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Behavioural analysis continues of the 8 women who were stalked and murdered in Baton Rouge by a serial killer. The team also discuss the psychology of the killer including his paraphilias.
Warning this pod contains graphic content #KillingBayous
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Belinda is still wide awake at The Horse and Jockey as the youngish man from reception brings her some extra special room service...
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It's the return of The Duchess in the penultimate chapter of 'Belinda Blinked'. What is she coming clean about? Will we find out? Will it make sense? Does it matter?
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Revelations, announcements, endings - this episode has it all! It's the final chapter of 'Belinda Blinked 1'. Belinda enjoys one more session with The Duchess but will she make it to work for 9am?
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It's a confusing part of climate change when it seems winter is as cold as ever, but as global temperatures creep ever so slightly higher, a cascade of catastrophic events will almost surely follow. The ball is in humanity's court.
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Todays guests is Mr Michael O'Neal, the podcasting master behind the hit Itunes show "The Solopreneur Hour Podcast". The top ranked business show, or The Solohour as it is known to its friends, teaching online marketing and entrepreneurship skills. Michael is a man who quite simply without him, then I wouldn't be on the mic today. So you know where to send all your complaints too. He is a born entrepreneur with a fascinating story, of successes, setbacks, leaps of faith, and finding his unique path with the guidance of John Lee Dumas and Pat Flynn. Growing up in Philadelphia, the thought of being the host of his own podcast show was the last thing on his mind. He was a normal type of kid, obsessed with sport, finding trouble at school, and generally being a kid. But unfortunately that freedom of thought and energy changed when he was moved from his beloved Philly, and taken down to Florida, and it seems to me this was the start of him looking for his path in life. He didn’t fit in down in the Sunshine State, so as soon as he could, he got himself back up North, and discovered one of the first dots in his life that links him to where he is today…the internet. He was fascinated by the worldwide web, so developed skills to be a web designer. And that was his life for fifteen years, until unfortunately his parents both passed away in a very short time, and he found himself sitting with just $14 dollars in his pocket. He was over 30, with a decision forced upon him. Would he accept the punches that life had dealt him, or would he start fighting back? And that descision was made and he took the steps that made him “Know too much” and not want to work for anyone else again? He was going to become a solopreneur and own his own future. But how did he know he had the skills to be a success in the online arena? How did he know where his true passions lie? And does he regret inspiring guys like me to jump into the pool too? Well lets find out as we bring onto the 100th show to start joining up dots, the man on the mike, the host of the “Solopreneur Hour podcast”, the one and only Mr Michael O’Neal! For more on the Solohour Podcast go to: The Solopreneur Hour Podcast with Michael O'Neal - Job Security...for the Unemployable By Michael O'Neal Chats with Proudly Unemployable Solopreneurs Like Himself Description They say successful people put their pants on the same way we all do. This show is about watching them put their pants on. Nominated As "Best New Show of 2013" by Stitcher Radio, Our range of guests takes us from comedy, to acting, to the NFL, to UFC and MMA, to Top Music Stars, to Millionaires, to Business Experts, to Real Estate moguls, and everything in between. Guests like Nicole Arbour, Adam Carolla, Hines Ward, Sam Jones, Tucker Max, Jonathan Fields, Derek Halpern, Pat Flynn, Amy Porterfield, John Lee Dumas, Chris Ducker, Chris Brogan, Guy Kawasaki, Mike Johnston, Rich Franklin, and many more, these casual conversations contain tons of action-inducing content wrapped up in an entertaining candy shell. Transcript Yes hello. How are we all? Can you believe it. Episode 100. We have been building up to this for well, it seems like a hundred episodes and we are finally here. We have got a man who who quite simply rose to the top and was going to be the only person who would fit the mantle of being my 100th guest. And I’ve had people banging down the doors. I had Paul McCartney phone up the other day and say I want to be on the show, I’ve heard it’s a big thing and I said to him, “Paul, unless you can get the other four Beatles to join you, it’s not going to happen” We’ve had David Bowie crying. It’s been pathetic really. So today’s man has been nailed on to do this today, and I’m absolutely delighted that he’s on the show because quite simply without him I wouldn’t be on the microphone. So you know where to send all your complaints to! He’s a man with a fascinating story of successes, setbacks leaps and finding his unique voice. Growing up in Philadelphia he was a normal type of kid obsessed with football at school, and generally being a kid. But unfortunately that freedom of thought and energy changed when he was moved from his beloved Philly and taken down to Florida and it seemed to me this to stop him looking for his path in life. He didn’t fit in down in the sunshine state so soon as he could he got himself back up north and discovered one of the first dots in his life that links him to where he is today the Internet. He was fascinated by a World Wide Web so develop skills to be a web designer and as he’s known for 15 years until unfortunately his parents both passed away in a very short time and he found himself sitting with just fourteen dollars in his pocket. It was over thirty with a decision forced upon him. Would you accept the punches that life had dealt him or would he stop fighting back and that decision was made and he took steps that made him know too much and not want to work for anyone else again. He was going to become a solopreneur and own his own future. But how did he know he had the skills to be a success in the online arena and how did he know where his true passions lie? And does he regret inspiring guys want me to jump into the pool too. Well let’s find out as we bring onto the show to start joining up thoughts the man on the microphone. The host of the Solohour podcast, the only Mr. Michael O’Neal. Well how are you Michael? Michael O’Neal Oh here is what I can’t even what is happening. I am so flabbergasted by that intro. OK. Two things. Number one that was the best intro I’ve ever had. And formerly Chris Cerrone had that that title of the best in show to a show I’ve ever had. But it was one of the best I’ve ever heard for anybody which is why you are so the right person for this job. Well we’re all thankful you have a microphone in front of you David. Trust me on that. Second thing is I would pay to hear Zombie John Lennon if you could figure out a way to get all four Beatles on the show. That would be cool. David Ralph Well I can do Steve Jobs every day. So I might be able to do them as well. Michael O’Neal Ah so dude that was incredible. I am . I am flummoxed. David Ralph I’m so excited to be on David Ralph’s show. David Ralph – Yeah. Go go and do that because I know you have been doing an action of me on a few shows and we’ll show you a few times night. Yeah you got a little bumper for me on my show. I have these little things that when people ask you me I have a guest on the show that I have them do a little like Hi this is David Ralph and then I get interested in this opener with Mike O’Neill and your voice is so. What’s the first thing I ever said to you. I said you have the ultimate voice for radio. Didn’t I say that you did. Absolutely. David Ralph I haven’t got the face for television but I’ve got a voice for Radio Michael O’Neal Well as long as you’ve got the radio part worked out and you have taken this thing and you’ve run with it my friend. So I’m honored. I’m honored to be at the 100 episode Mark. Thank you. Thank you. David Ralph Absolutely. It is an honor to have you here because it is amazing when you start this thing,because you started your show what was it August 2013. Michael O’Neal Eleven month ago. David Ralph Yeah,11 months ago and now you are rocking and rolling with the best of them you surround yourself with, with the Internet movers and shakers the ziggers and zagers and you know you’re going to be humbled by this. So maybe you won’t. You are an online celebrity of note. When I was saying to people is my show a lot of people sort of touch on the shows of said to me I know who you’re going to have. And I said no you don’t. And I go Yes I know who you’re going to have and ego going and going to no one. And I when Martin O’Neill and I went oh term term how did I know. Really I know. Yes yeah I did it because I had pain you know I don’t want to suck up to you Michael but the early days I didn’t know what the hell I was doing. So I just kept on saying your name over and over again or some kind of benchmark of what I was trying to achieve because you like that you’d come out the gates really and say look like a rocket ship. It’s unbelievable. But you’ve only been around so long because it seems like you’ve been here ever in a day. Does it seems like that to you? Michael O’Neal It is weird. It does feel like it was yesterday that I launched the show. It feels really really recent to me that it happened. So but then at the same time I look at the memories that I’ve had over the last 11 months and all the cool benchmarks and you know different things that have happened and, but it’s packed full of stuff right. So I think if there’s any celebrity it’s sort of a z list celebrity and only at certain conferences. But yeah it’s been it’s been an incredible journey. I couldn’t be happier with how it’s gone. And I can’t wait to see what happens in the next 365. You know I’m really excited about that. David Ralph Is there a plan to the next 365 because you seem to me somebody who is very much stimulated by the now and then. Are you somebody who knows what you’re aiming to achieve? Michael O’Neal No I’m a notorious non planner. Much to the chagrin of my girlfriend who is a total planner and if I didn’t have the you know a calendar app on my phone I would be I would be completely floating out there now because I I wake up and I look at I go OK what do I have to do today. And then I see what’s going on for the day. And sometimes that doesn’t work out for me like in a social situation because people actually make plans to go out and do things. But and I’m not one of them. And all of a sudden it’s Friday I’m like I probably should have planned to do something. Yes I watch movies tonight. But yeah I I’m in an interesting spot right now because I have had this kind of five year run of as you mentioned in the intro bringing myself in this very circuitous path from $14 and not having a clear direction to now. When someone says What do you do. I say I’m a podcast host. And that’s a thing like I. That’s what I do. So I sort of a couple of weeks ago had an occasion to kind of put the cap on that five year journey and now I’m going to be looking ahead but I haven’t quite formulated what that ahead looks like yet. David Ralph And how did you do that? How did you put a cap on that. How did you say that is five years, finished boxed up? Michael O’Neal Well it was as i say I’m I’m a notorious non-celibrator. I’m a guy that usually gets to an achievement and then continues to go without acknowledging it. And I have what is probably a weird story that you’re asking for but hey here comes. So I’ve been a Porsche fan for my whole life. And you may already know where you’re heading with this but I was a Porsche fan my whole life and I don’t know why particularly. I was I had a Volkswagen in high school and I think that maybe planted to see a little bit and I was a car guy and so you know those Porsche ads from the 80s with like the big fender flares and the big wing. I think I was attracted to that and I eventually in 2003 I bought my first vintage Porsche so I bought a 1972 11 and it was a piece of crap. I bought it in New York. I didn’t know better. I drove across country midway across the USA and midway across the country the engine blew up. So that’s how badly. Where were you when this happened. I was in the dead heart middle of Nebraska when it happened in Nebraska I suppose. You it’s nothing. It is hundreds and millions of acres of wide open like cornfields and nothing else. I mean we are I was I have a picture of my car sitting looking like it’s a panther wading in the grass. Waiting to you know to prowl and it’s just sitting there with with like a hundred miles in each direction of grass. There was no middle of nowhere when it happened and I ended up finding a Volkswagen place 60 miles away that towed me in. And the guy dropped the oil pan in the car and just giant chunks of metal came out and I’m like I’m pretty sure that’s not how it’s supposed to be. So I ended up getting a tow truck driving it from Denver where I was living at the time and picking it up. Neither here nor there. So I eventually traded that piece of crap on and got a nicer one. Not when I bought it but in 2005 and I restored this car it took me four years and 2000 hours to restore this car back to better than factory condition when I still have it now. And as part of the dynamic this one in 1969 9/11 and the 69 through 73 nine elevens are very very sought after. They are the iconic 9/11. So when you would see Steve McQueen and a picture of him in the 60s you know you know in LA MA or something driving a 9/11 he was driving one of these sort of 69 to 73 virgins. And one of the sponsors of Porsche in the 60s was a company called Hoyer which was tag Hoyer before Tagg was involved in the mid-80s. So just Hoyer and it’s a guy named Jack Hoyer and he made these beautiful tiny pieces chronographs based on race timers. So you’d have a co-driver with you as a race car and there was a race in Mexico called the career of PanAmericana and the first Porsche Carrera was named after this particular race. So Hoyer as a sponsor of Porsche created a watch based on the chronographs that they used for the race cars and they called it the Hoyer Kura. So this was a very utilitarian type watch you could use it as a race time or you could just click one of the buttons and it had this chronograph on it. It was beautiful automatic beautiful timepiece. And as I’ve been going through this journey for five years this has been on my vision board because these are about three grand and above to get one of these watches. But that was so superfluous for me because I had no i like zero money. And for me to spend three grand on something as excessive as a watch wasn’t even on my radar. So about a month and a half ago now I was in this position where I was like this could be the time. And I scoured the world. I ended up buying a 1972 Hoyer Carrera from a guy in France and it came to my house and it was more beautiful in person than I. I’d never seen one in person is more beautiful than I even thought it could be. And I remember at the mid midday I’d gone to this little swimming pool by my house I belong to this little pool club which is where I work out and I was swimming in the middle of the day two o’clock in the afternoon like Tony Soprano in the middle of a work day and thinking I just did this like this just happened. This 5 year journey comes stops right now like this is where my new journey begins. I’ve gone through this trial by fire. I’ve come out hopefully like a phoenix. I’m in a position where I can buy this watch now which is insane to think about and I’m peaceful and grateful for the life that I’ve built. And so that for me was the cap of a five year struggle. I mean a real struggle to get to where I am today. David Ralph Mr. O’Neill is a perfect story. It started and it made me think if I’m ever in a pub quiz and a question about Portia comes up you’re my man that does it to Luli you are obsessed by that and you. The amount that you were quoting then. Michael O’Neal Ah. I mean I think. I think it’s kind of a lifetime obsession for people that become afflicted by it. In fact there’s a great ad I will send it to you on YouTube and there’s an ad for the new Porsche about the time the new Porsche Carrera ad and it was there it’s a little boy. And he’s a little kid in his classroom and he’s daydreaming and on 9/11 drives by him and you just see him like looking out the window and his pencil drops and you know then he he gets in trouble. And then he runs to the you know was on his BMX bike to the Porsche dealer after school and and he you know he ends up sitting in this car and the steering wheel is bigger than he is and you see Mike raised his head he’s 12 or something and that he goes to the dealer or the guy goes you have a card and the guy goes yeah here you go and he goes I’ll see in 20 years. And then there’s this great voice over that says something like there’s a there’s a there’s a particular moment that happens with you know a Porsche fan. There’s that time you want one. Then there’s the time you get one and for the truly affected afflicted there’s the 20 years in between. And it just like it gives you the chills and my buddies sent it. I sense my body goes man. Pass the Kleenex. So I guess there is a real passion there for this. It’s a very visceral feeling that is so different because of the way they build their cars and because the engines in the rear and it’s a totally different experience than you have with with any other vehicle that yeah there becomes a real passion a real obsession with him. Did you read that because this shows about joining up dots, but do you remember as a young kid having the same kind of obsessive compulsive in both words and things when when you was a little kid running around the streets of Philly pretending you Rocky did most will keep you alive without paying him for the Michael O’Neal No no no. I was a BMX kid. Now I was I was in a suburb. I was the only gentile I was in a super Jewish town north of Philadelphia. And I was a BMX or I rode my BMX bike. I mean I was from 1984 until I mean I was racing bikes from 84 until 2000. David Ralph So Rocky wasn’t on your radar at all? Michael O’Neal No not at all. Tony Hawk and Dave you know Dave Voelker and Matt Hoffman and you know BMX guys Bob horo. They were all on my radar. I’ll tell you here’s here’s a little here’s a join up dot that is current. I rode an entire daywith real wow I just blanked on his name. That’s embarrassing really. I’m killing myself right now this is bad radio. David Ralph What does he look like? Michael O’Neal He’s a big famous director now and he will watch films John Malkovich. Being John Malkovich won a friggin Oscar. We’re ready. Come on. With it and it might seem seamless Spike Jones for crying out loud. David Ralph Spike Jones Michael O’Neal Yeah Spike Jones the director was a dude I rode with at a place called Rockville BMX and we were just BMX or dudes riding around. And then he he became a photographer for one of the BMX magazines and then started doing filming because he did Beastie Boys first video I forget which one and then started doing independent films then did Being John Malkovich and now he is like an international you know massive director like one of the best most well-reputed directors in the world. And it was kind of cool. I mean so he did adaptation he did Being John Malkovich Where the Wild Things Are You know just just done amazing stuff. So the Academy Awards. And so a pretty pretty bad ass. He did her you know the movie Her most recent Yeah that’s Spike Jones. David Ralph So is there any similarity between the young kid in Philly and now, because from what I see across the pond and I listen into the conversations that you have with your internet guys and it does seem from this side of the pond that you’ve got a gang of friends and followers and whatever that basically control the Internet. I had Rick Mulready on the show. And I said “Do you ever feel like slipping something into Pat Flynns drink, so that the next morning you turn on your screen and see if there’s a black hole on the Internet because he’s not functioning at this time because it kind of seems not” But he wouldn’t be pushed in to slipping a Mickey into his drink in any shape or form. But you seem a little bit edgy to most of them. Michael O’Neal Yeah. David Ralph Is that because you’re from Philly. Is it because he’s a very sort of industrial Con. Its a real city you know. Its like a working class city when you’re there. Michael O’Neal Yeah I think the the edginess is something that I’m kind of a known for. I don’t know if you curse on your show but I’m kind of a no B.S. kind of guy and I’ve never been one to straddle the fence very very much. And I think what happened with Irwin what happens with a lot of these sort of Internet type celebrities is that they’re so concerned about getting the broadest audience that they sometimes come off as being a little bit milktoast or a little bit vanilla. And I come from a totally different perspective where when you think about media you think about New York Philadelphia Boston. These are like the media centers of the world. It’s where you know you go to Boston College that’s one of the broadcasting school that’s where Howard Stern went. That’s where many very famous broadcasters come from those places I went to Temple University which has an incredible media department. And when you look at the people that are iconic in history they’re not people that are vanilla. There are people that have strong opinions one way or the other and people either love them or they hate them but they’re definitely them. So they definitely have a presence. They definitely have a voice that’s unique to them. And I think I always think it took me a little while to settle into that on my show but it is ultimately as you as I developed the show and I developed my own voice I realized hey I’m not in the interest of pleasing everybody. Like that’s not my job. My job is to talk from my perspective on certain issues and try to extract really good business advice from people without them or my audience really seeing what I’m doing. And one of my favorite quotes to that is and you probably heard me say before but which just never let him see your work. You know that’s from Bill Cosby also from my alma mater Temple University in Philly and that basically means that go through your process ask your questions you know have questions written down but you don’t have to be so blatant about it. You can you can ease through you know great standup comedians do this like Louis C.K. talks you know he’ll be sputtering and angry and going through all this process on stage and you think that that’s just how he is. You laugh at his angry energy but he knows all the beats within that he knows exactly what he’s doing within that realm and that is that is him not letting you see him work on him. David Ralph When your on the mike then how much is you now being absolutely authentic and how much is it creating a mood creating an atmosphere on the show. Michael O’Neal Well it can’t. Can’t you have both? David Ralph Oh I don’t know CAN you? Michael O’Neal What are you asking? Are you asking how much is sort of pre-written and how much is off the cuff? David Ralph Well on this show for example some of the things I say I only say to get a reaction from the guest. You know do I really mean it kind of. Do I think that they will go against it. Yes. So I will say it. How much do you actually say that you believe 100 percent. Michael O’Neal Well first of all you do that because you understand this and you’re a pro. I mean this is a very natural place for you to end up. So I think that that I do very similar things to you, as you do just because yeah sometimes you want to extract some stuff from a guest that is being difficult. But yeah I mean I’m pretty authentic dude. I there’s not a lot there’s people that have met me in real life and go Oh you’re exactly like you are on the show. Yeah Im exactly like I’m in the show. I turn it on and I talk so I don’t have this, I’m not affected in any way. I just go. David Ralph So you’re not like you haven’t got a human graphic equalizer when you press record you just kind of increase certain parts of your personality. Michael O’Neal Not really. No. This is pretty much how I am. Yeah I’ll speak like I speak. I’m probably slightly dirtier in real life. David Ralph Well you don’t know where the words will land do you! Michael O’Neal I probably curse a little more which is fine. I’ve done a few podcasts now where I was allowed to do that and it did make it really nice. David Ralph Are you in the same situation as me because I used to listen to your show all the time and it was a staple diet during my transition at that time and now I’m doing this. One of the failures of me is that I don’t get time to listen to other people’s shows. I listen to your one the other day because I just suddenly realized I had a gap but you almost become an island of your own success where before I used to listen to shows and I used to think oh I’ll take a bit of it and I’ll take a bit of it and become like a magpie. And now I don’t know what vibe is out there and I don’t know whether I’m being edgy or whatever. It just seems to be you. Speaking to the mic and I throw it out to the world and hopefully it goes well. It seems to be a fault of mine, and so do you have the same thing? Michael O’Neal No I’m exactly the same way. I’d say partially by choice and partially by by time. So when I when I do have time to consume podcasts I don’t tend to go business. I tend to go comedy. And lately I tend to go NFL football. I listen to podcasts related to that because I want to be able to clock out a little bit when I do want real inspiration. I’ve been listening to here’s the thing with Alec Baldwin it’s WNYC. I’ve not heard a better intro or production or interview style than that show. It’s his in his intros are nothing short of brilliant. I mean they’re amazing how he brings a guest on an and then how he interviews and his questions are very in-depth and he’s such a pro that it makes it really easy for me to like look at that bar and go OK that’s where the soul open for hours going. That’s what I do. I actually honestly David I find now the more that I get into this show the more I almost can’t stand other people’s shows like there so few that can capture my attention and that I feel like are being done well even with really good friends of mine that do shows I just go and that is almost unlistenable. You know it’s so. So I just don’t I definitely look far above the kind of Internet Marketing slash business world for inspiration on how I want to run mine. David Ralph because the only two that I listen to now is yours. And I went on started. I wanted to listen to every single one. And but the nerdiest and there the only two reasons. Yeah great and Nerdist is good for a number of reasons. David Ralph Yeah I just like the way it kind of flows and you don’t even know it started and it just kind of teases right. Michael O’Neal That’s right. Yeah they just start it. We kind of did that today didn’t we. David Ralph Yeah absolutely and that was the good stuff. Michael O’Neal And we talked for a while before we started recording. You know me I mean it just felt like yeah hit it. Go for it. We’ll start like Nerdist. But yeah no I think that there’s a sense there’s such a glutton of new shows out there and I don’t. but if I’m being opinionated I don’t. There’s a lot of places where people are learning quote on quote how to podcast. And I think they’re feeding them crap information.So often a big problem. David Ralph And I know he’s a mate of yours and I wish him all the success in the world, but the problem is so many people are trying to duplicate John Lee Dumas and that’s not right. He came first and he created the structure of his show, and whether you like that format or whatever that is he’s and he’s made in his own by being him. And I hear these shows and after about three minutes I think oh my god it’s the same thing again. Now I will listen to your shows and I will go all the way through. But people miss a trick don’t lay up coming back to my all the time is finding your authentic self playing to your streams. And and if you do that you create a bigger loyalty. You know if you are totally yourself people either hate you or like you but the ones that like you will love you. And that’s where these people are missing out because they’re not even being authentic to themselves they’re just kind of a middle ground. Michael O’Neal Yeah. And John would tell you and I’ve said this a million times in front of him and said do you the success of your show or his show has nothing to do with his format. And it has nothing do with him as a podcast for that all. It has everything to do with the fact that he has a financial background writes great marketing copy and has a schedule and a rigidity too. He has a military rigidity because he was in the military to his to his business. And unless you come with that exact kind of background you will not have success in that way. People think that because of the way he does his show because it’s structured and because he has these set questions and does it seven days a week that that’s why he’s successful and is completely irrelevant to that. So the problem is is like you said so many people listen to that or they go to podcasters paradise and they learn a certain way to do things. And I’m almost diametrically opposed to every single thing that they’re learning. So it’s like it’s like man I it’s it’s frustrating for me in that way. And I shouldn’t say that like I want to rephrase that I’m not time actually oppose everything they’re learning what I’m what I’m worried about is that the things that I think make podcasting successful aren’t emphasized in a lot of training courses. And like you just said finding your own voice is a number one you have to be successful. You have to find your own voice and you have to have a great brand and it’s not something that people speak about a lot. Like I took a lot of cliff Ravenscroft stuff. I’ve taken all the stuff. I’ve seen a number of course is out there a lot of them don’t pay a lot of attention to that piece and I worry that with this next phase of podcasting and what’s you know since everyone’s starting a show they’re going to find it a lot harder to sustain it unless they’ve found their own voice on their voice. And and it’s within this brand that they’ve really created. So we’ll see. But that’s the jury’s out on that. David Ralph Did you really have to love doing this because I’m going to play a speech in my Jim Carrey and I’m actually I’m going to play now and we’re going to talk afterwards. This is Jim Carrey. Jim Carrey Sound Clip My father could have been a great comedian but he didn’t believe that that was possible for him. And so he made a conservative choice. Instead he got a safe job as an accountant. And when I was 12 years old. He was let go from that safe job. And our family had to do whatever we could to survive. I learned many great lessons from my father. Not the least of which was that you can fail at what you don’t want. So you might as well take a chance on doing what you love. David Ralph Is that the true message that we should be getting across? Michael O’Neal Yes it is unfortunately the connecting of the dots joining of those two dots which is I found this thing that I love and now I have to figure out how to get paid for it is difficult. That’s a difficult journey. And that’s my that was my five year journey. Right. First not even knowing what it was that I loved. I had no idea I was going to podcast five years ago but I had an initial foray into public speaking. I started teaching social media on stage and I ended up traveling and going to 17 cities teaching people how to use social media to grow their business and I found it very like oh this is something I could be good at. And then that morphed into doing back end production on a podcast for a year and a half and just starting to understand the podcasting industry that finally morphed into me starting my own show and here we are. But it was a five year journey to find that you know like I had indicators of it and if someone in 2009 it said hey do you want to get. You want to make six figures and be a public speaker. I be like totally that be great. But at the time I had nothing to speak about. And now I do. So it’s kind of a I I do feel like you have to find something that will and you’ve probably seen this in your life with your show something that will make you walk into that studio and record an episode even if you’re exhausted or not in the mood or whatever because you truly love it and you’re excited about it. Oh yesterday. That’s how I am. Yeah I’ve had times when I’ve recorded 12 shows back to back and now I’ve. Why just because I knew I was going to do it seven days a week show and that was the hardest time I had. I had no internet for two weeks he just crashed on me and I suddenly panic but I didn’t have enough to cover. And I was going away as well. So yes seven days a week he goes out and I needed the boke. And so I did it and I started off at six o’clock in the morning and I just went through through move through and I edited and I did everything in the gap between when I recorded the next one and he just went seamlessly. And when I pressed record yes I was on I was on. Once I was off it was just like I was you know on drugs or something I was just slump too much. But it wasn’t until the very last ones that I realized actually about that passion that you’re talking about the ability to actually do it when you’re tired. I’ve gone past by and I was actually feeling ill. And I remember doing this show and the sweat was pouring off me and I listened back to and it doesn’t sound like it but I realized brain actually no you’ve got to look up to yourself as much as you do actually doing something. Yeah I’m very committed to that. DAVID It’s I have I have three sort of pillars if you will that I do I think make a good soul a partner or a successful soul a partner. And there’s there’s time freedom there’s financial freedom and there’s location freedom. And so the first one is really easy time freedom simple you walk into your boss’s office tell him to go screw himself and then you have time freedom. There you go. Location freedom. You can pretty much just get in a car and go somewhere that we have that kind of freedom in the U.K. and in the United States. Yeah there’s some complications in between. But technically you can just go do that. It’s the financial freedom part. That’s the tricky part of the three. That is a little harder. But I find that I’m so unwilling to compromise my time freedom. I’ve turned down so many more so much more money because it would compromise my time freedom like I could have a lot more coaching clients and a lot more people in my my group coaching. It’s called Solo lab. But with that I would have to commit another couple of days to taking care of them and I’d I’m willing to do that at all. Like i will i love my life the way it is right now and I can be comfortable financially I can go do fun things. And I don’t have to compromise that. And you know hopefully I can continue to grow and continue to you know make more money maybe have more speaking gigs things like that but I don’t intend on working any harder. I just want to you know work smarter maybe try to over deliver a little more to my audience and that’s what I’m looking for. Well was sensible and that’s exactly what I want to do as well because I hate these people and it’s almost like a badge of honor. But I’ve quit in nine to five job. And then you go yes I’m an online marketing do I do this I’m a diva and I cook my time and I’m doing 80 hours a week and I think right. Right. What the hell do you do that. Why don’t you just do two days hard work and have the rest of the time of it. It seems stupid that I say that. That’s right. And it’s. It does. It is counter intuitive. The thing is when my parents passed away you mentioned this in the intro when they did that. My perspective on time completely shifted and I just I. Life’s too short. So I am very much a person that says both. When someone says would you like this or this. I say both. When I get an opportunity to do something I say yes. Win you know and I just do it like it’s a thing that I have committed to and not mentally like I don’t just go yeah this is what I’m going to do from now on. I just do it now I just say yeah let’s do that. That sounds fun. Let’s just go for that. I’m going to go on a hike. Yeah. Great book a ticket. You know and we just do it. And I found that that has served me really well because when I do that and I put that as a priority in my life then the the stuff that I’m not so thrilled about I still end up having to do it. It still fills in the blanks but my priority is to really extract the most that I can out of my life and I’ll tell you not a person that does that well I think as John John Lee Dumas he works probably a little more like the person you were just mentioning. He works a lot but he’s also great at saying yes when when something comes across his desk he goes yeah lets do that. And it’s like on the schedule. And I think that’s that’s part of I think what that’s part of success. To me that’s part of what success feels like is being able to do that. I remember hearing an interview with Billy Joel and the interviewer said to him Billy you’ve sold X squillion albums and singles and you’ve done these tours and you play Madison Square Garden five straight nights. What has success given you. And he just said time and that was it. He can wake up each morning and if he doesn’t want to do something he doesn’t. And that single word resonated with me hugely especially when I was in my 9 to 5 job and I realized then that things were not right. And why should I be doing a nine to five job when there are options I suppose. I began to know too much. And then once you know too much brain you realize you can’t ever go back. Michael O’Neal Yeah. It’s really really is a one way street. It also but that carries over as well into my personal life as well. And I think when the there’s ever such a different confidence now just in my life in general and I think Billy Joel would sort sort of anybody that reached a level of success has this this this underlying confidence about them that is very attractive not only to you know the opposite sex but it’s what attracts other successful people to you. There’s just there’s a subtlety in actions and just how really how you go through life when you’re confident that is very attractive to you know both both people both sexes and that is something that people pick up on pretty easily. You become a success back humor don’t you. You know the old Jim rhône thing about you know the average of you know five people to surrender a lot of people I talked to. Yeah. I mean a crappy job and all these miserable people all the time. How can I surround myself. And one of the things I say to them is you know focus on success because the more success you get and the more competence as you say they end up a successful people get sucked into your world and suddenly you created what he was saying. It’s not easy to do. But it certainly is a mindset that starts moving in that direction. That’s right. And you it’s funny you just asked that question of me is how do you now you’re on it you’re on an island so you’re you’re in the UK you’re not. I’m in San Diego so I get to have a bunch of people around me at all times. I will say though we don’t get together. I mean you know we get together as friends but I’m not in a mastermind with any of these people around me. We don’t sit there and me out. So you know to answer your question I’m mean answer answered on my show tomorrow. But you’ve got to join a group you’ve got to join a group mastermind of some sort. And there’s really no other way. If you if you’re not surrounded by those five people that that you feel are motivating you in a way that that is bettering your life and hopefully their lives. You’ve got to separate from those people and find the people that are doing that and pretty much everyone I know that’s in this you know business Internet Marketing podcasting world has some sort of coaching program. And my best advice is to get people that you really enjoy like how they speak and like how they deliver and join their group and that’s it. And you know once you’re a part of that community you’ll be a lot more apt to be motivated you know learn the things you want to learn. It’s part of the reason why I don’t need to listen to podcasts anymore because I have so many people in my group that are doing cool things. I get to learn about all the cool new stuff without having to go listen. They sort of comes to me. So so do you now feel that you’re ahead of the curve. Because when when you started the show I remember you saying it’s the Wild West and now it seems like every man Dogan whatever has made me a podcast. So do you think now about you it’s not the Wild West but you actually ahead of the curve. It’s good. Get a question. Yes and no I think it’s still the wild west. I think that people in this environment aren’t necessarily looking in the right direction to advance their business where they should be. Let me clarify that. I think inspiration for how someone’s podcast get better gets better doesn’t happen within the new podcasting community. It happens with old media. Then you go look at how you all learn how to interview you go study Howard Stern if you want to learn how to produce an an excellent show. You go you know you look at and some an NPR show or something like that like a where a BBC show something that you know pay close attention to how people are introducing guests and what they’re how they do their ads and how they integrate you know clips from this person’s body of work into their intro or into the show itself. So I think there is really a professional side to this that will ultimately come out. For me personally what I’ve realized over the last couple of months and this is something that I think you can you can sort of strap on as a badge of honor as well is that I’m a better interviewer than most. Just in general I’m more intuitive and I have more range of knowledge so I can connect those dots. You know I can join those dots. And that’s what makes for a compelling and entertaining interview no matter who you are it’s the people that have the pre-scripted questions that I think are really going to struggle because that’s that’s very exhausting to an audience. So on one side I think I’m still really ahead of the curve in that. I come from this and as do you come from this background this history of paying attention to interviewers and then sort of bringing this natural ability to the microphone that 99 percent of people don’t have. And that’s the building not only to interview someone in a business sense and extract what they do for a living but actually make an entertaining hour of programming for someone. And in my opinion they can get the business data from 80000 podcasts that are on iTunes but it’s really hard to get entertainment out of it. And that’s what I’m trying to bring to the table and I think that’s what you do a really great job bringing to the table as well because because what I’ve realized you know was a complete nobody is basically the very first interview I did was no you weren’t Yes. Stop it. Tom Mocha’s was episode your line on the line. Me right now David. And he was a huge inspiration to me so I wanted him as guest number one. And he was talking to a gentleman called John Lee Dumas and so awful who’s is CHEP never heard of him. And I went over to his show and the very first show I listened to was episode 3 2 2 which was yourself and kidding. That was I didn’t know that. Yeah that was the very first episode. And the fascinating thing about it was which got me on the show and this is my sort of join up thought was the fact that everything you see in life is normally about benchmarking against success. You see people already Veja and you go I’d like to do that but it worked for him he’s had this skill he’s got that you know he’s a natural that’s for sure. On that show on 0 5 3 2 2 you hadn’t even lunged and he was saying to you you know when are you going to go and you and I’m going to go on Wednesday or whatever it was. And I tuned in and I listened or whatever you do you click on it you don’t tune into you. But I heard you speak for the very first time and I found it fascinating because I was seeing but not some bouts of somebody finding their way. And you was saying Yeah and I had 17 downloads and it wasn’t that you were looking at success you were looking at somebody finding their flow finding them. Moving on. And that’s right. But that’s what really flavored my show was the fact that you were doing something that seemed natural and you were holding your hands up and you going really. I don’t know if this is going to work but hey if it doesn’t change we’ll move on later on. And remember you did this show and it was it was some chap I don’t remember who was with them on the on the beach somewhere and calls were whizzing past and your battery ran out half way through. Yes and yes you still put out and I thought that’s interesting because what he’s saying back is not that this show has got to be polished and perfect what he’s saying is is a journey and I’m going to improve from that and that be the last time that my battery runs out halfway through. That’s right and it was definitely the last time that happened. Yeah. Yeah it’s a good way to good insight. I see. If I were doing it again yeah I would probably do the same thing again. I was I’ve been always sort of a fan of the let’s just put it out at that at that time. I was leaning more on my hopeful interview skills than I was like ultimate show quality and since I’d already put out a couple of episodes it wasn’t that bad but I really loved the guys story. So I was like yeah there was Harry. Harry Smith was the guy’s name and. And. And I thought yeah let me let me throw that on. And why not. What happened. You know and somewhere. This is what’s so cool about this right. You heard one single episode I did from Johnny Dumas which was like a random occurrence. And look how much it’s affected both of us. Yeah. Just that one thing. So if one little episode you put out catches the right person it can literally be life changing. I will say something. I want your listeners to go to solo our solo our dotcom and I want you to go back to like three. I don’t know let’s say pre 70s so anything from episode like I don’t know one until episode 70 and I want you to click on those posts and read how great David’s comments are for the episodes. They are so insightful and brilliant. And you do such a great job summarizing. I think I even wrote you once and said Do you want to write my show summaries. Remember that you did and it was just that the crux of me doing this and I knew I was just going to stall so cool. So I am and you still you just did it the other day when you were that episode you listened to. You do such a great job summarizing. You’re going to be such a smash successful podcast. David Yeah I have no doubt whatsoever you are going to I hope you will let us be on your show someday when you do these live broadcasts in front of you know a hundred thousand people at the Wembley Stadium. Did you know when you start this and I’m really going to open up here so I don’t really have a Chevez. But when you start based you want it to be so good and you want it to be brought in and you kind of. There were job. You look back on them and you go OK yeah that wasn’t quite where I wanted to be but it was all right. And then you hit sort milestones and you listened back to some of these shows I don’t know if you listen to yours and I thought oh that was a bit closer to what I had in my head my original vision. And I got to show it E.T. and that’s when I suddenly realize Michael that was the host of a show and it was my responsibility to be the host to even I think he was too grateful for people giving up their time to be on my show. I it was a complete mind set. Now I want this to be the biggest show out there. I absolutely do. And it’s all I can focus in on and it’s in many ways it’s killing me or my life is totally out of whack. But all I want is about is the number one thing upset that on any show because it sounds a bit arrogant really I’m upset. Once we’ve stopped recording them when somebody asked me about it that is where I want to be and I want to be join up not as a brand. Exactly as you say. Right. Because it’s one of those things that you kind of go join up towards. What does it mean. And I’m very aware of if you provide quality and content as quality brand in many ways take care of itself. It’s like we always talk in the early episode the name that was always mentioned was Pat Flynn. And you know he’s got that classic smart passive income and you forget that’s a premium brand but actually he’s only three words put together and he’s because he’s provided that great content and quality and value. But it becomes the kind of the trust word where what he’s trying to achieve. That’s right in he that he can live that now. But I actually want I want to focus on something you said just before that you will be bigger than him and so will I. And I know I don’t mean that like he doesn’t have the same aspirations as you do. Right. And I’m saying in terms of podcasts in terms of like Pat wants to speak I’m not speaking for him here but just knowing what I know about him. He he is sort of the crash test dummy of internet marketers. So he does all these really cool things on the web. I want my show to become about like I want to. I want to be interviewing complete legitimate A-listers you know and finding out about their kind of business and so normal journey. That’s where I will see the show going. And because of that if when and if I get to that point. The show the podcast itself will be bigger than all of the internet marketing type podcasts. Does that make sense. Yeah it’ll be way bigger than that. It’ll be more like Nerdist. You know Chris Hardwick gets killer guests on his show and that’s why his podcast is you know number one number two number three on iTunes overall. And so it’s it’s one of those things that that I it’s what I aspire to do as well is to get working within this world like real A-list category of people because I think that they’ll appreciate talking about their journey. And so that’s where I want to head with that. Also I was very strategic and I changed direction. I realized that when I started I was just throwing out the net to anyone and anyone would jump on the show. I would have them round about sort of thing once again I thought to myself no I can’t do this because when I was looking at other people’s shows I was thinking Oh I’ve been on my show I’ve been on my show and it was just the sort of hybrid of people doing the rounds. So I went off in a different direction. So if you listen to episode 88 I had Cathy O’Dowd who was the first woman to hit the summit of Everest from both sides. I’ve got the first civilian astronaut coming on the show. I’ve got a chap over a few years ago was worldwide news because he sold his life on e-bay and he’s just sold his life to Disney and all that kind of stuff. So I realized I had to change direction to become more unique to be more interested by the stories more. Yes. Extract out of them what I wanted to show to the world and that was my original vision but I couldn’t say Eva until later on in the journey. Yeah and that’s really what you’ve done. That’s the whole point. That’s why you will be successful because you’ve you’ve done this in a sort of a different way in your life when you look back to sort of the Philadelphia kid and you riding around on your BMX and all that kind of stuff. Well you just sort of wanting to be the classic sports kid was. If you look back and now we all going to send you back in time soon on the Sermon on the mike. No I was a show off though. I think I think I was you know a performer of some sort and the PA is I keep is that makes my colonial who he is to play better racquetball with an audience. Yes. Every single time. Yeah I think so. I think there’s that’s there that’s in there. It’s in the DNA for sure. I don’t use that a lot but it’s in the DNA. I work better in a performance environment which is presumably why I kind of screw myself on the show intentionally. I don’t I I prepare in a way where I I’ve researched my guest as you have. You know you know and you certainly listen to the show but at times you know a little bit about me and you’re able to then naturally structure questions that that dovetail into my history and that’s what a good interviewer does. I don’t write a lot of questions out sometimes intentionally and that’s because I there’s something about the performance side. I realize now that I’m I’m doing this the shows this this month I’ve got over 300000 downloads for the first time and this is a and I realize so there’s people listening and I have to perform. You know what I like it. It makes me it UPS my game. I’m live on the show. And I think I do that to myself on purpose because because I work better in that environment a lot maybe underpressure a little. Well we’re very similar. It’s fascinating. I feel like I’m finding out the real Marcantonio here. Where is the person behind the that the presenter. Because I am somebody who has spent my life doing training courses and presentations and that’s my job. I’ve never done this kind of thing. It was totally BA and I’m somebody very much likes to be on their own likes no one near them. And then when I suddenly go ping. That’s it. It’s performance time. And I don’t know if it’s showing off or trying to create a different persona for myself because that’s kind of not naturally me. But I do have the ability to raise my game and present a different side to myself if you know me deep down you would say to me different people that the people who know me from seeing where I allow them to see me they would say yeah you it’s like I’m on the mike as you are when you normally doing those things because I’m letting them see what they want to see. Yeah. Yeah I mean I think there’s there’s an element of that and again I want people to understand this is why we and we talked earlier about sort of what John brought to the table. And I’m you know people look at my show and say it’s it’s been it’s it’s been pretty successful in the first 11 months just overall debt is not that’s not a fluke because I didn’t just start in August of 2013 with kind of media. You know I’ve been a professional drummer my whole life. I’ve performed I’ve been on I’ve been a racer I’ve been you know a competitive racquetball player for for many many tournaments for many many years now and before that it was tennis. So I’ve always been performing in some way or the other. I I coached for five years on teaching people social media in front of huge audiences. I’ve played Red Rocks in front of 10000 people like me being on a microphone and being natural at it is not something that happened overnight. It’s a it’s this is something that you walked in with. You’ve been training for years before you turned a mike on yourself. So it’s kind of like Yeah right yeah. You were new to podcasting but not nuda trying to translate a concept from one person to an audience like that’s something you’ve been doing for a long time. So so that’s I think that it’s a bit of a misnomer within our industry that yeah anybody can you know podcast or anybody can start blah blah blah. That’s kind of cool I get it. Yes technically you can turn on an app you can go to boss jock on your iPhone and upload it to clips and you’ve got a podcast but can you do it. Well can you do it so that when someone switches from morning radio or Howard Stern or the BBC to your podcast that they don’t notice a huge drop off in quality or you know sound quality interview quality production quality that’s that’s what I try to bring the table and I think you do the same thing. So is that what you’re saying really and I’m going to play the words of Steve Jobs because he says it very well as well but no experience is wasted. It doesn’t matter what you’ve done in your life you will pull elements and you extract what you need to create your new path. Out 100 percent. Absolutely yes. Everything you’ve done up until this point is does training for you for this next phase. When I have people on their show and we have these episodes called Find your swing I want to find out everything that person has done because it find your swing is like well what do I do. Like what am I naturally gifted at how can I make money off of something that I really enjoy that I’m passionate about that’s what finding your swing is. And it’s I want to find out like what you did when you were a kid. Were you an athlete did you or you or you a professional knitter you like to knit hats. You know like what is it what do you do. And when people can start accessing those things that they’ve done their whole lives they’re really gifted and I like to find ways that we can use those talents in whatever their next business endeavor is. We call about connecting our past to build our future and here. And one of the names as come out is if you really want to know your passion really want to know what you’re naturally good at. Don’t think about what you were doing in adult life because very much you would have been taking a responsibility for a wage or whatever. Look at what you was doing as a kid when you weren’t being paid for it. And if you was a drama when you was a kid and you loved doing it then try and look at something that would do that. And he says that exactly the same way as you do it and you’ll find your swing episodes. That’s right. And I and I love those. Again that’s another instance where we totally put ourselves on the spot. I have a co-host. Her name is Dawn Mars. For those episodes and we never read the questions first. Like I only you know sometimes I glance at them to see just a copy and paste them into my Evernote when we’re doing the show. But we were reading them and answering them live and which again has another element of pressure that we’ve got to come up with an answer and these people are literally like I’ve had people that have taken what we’ve said on the show. They’ve made a business from it like the next day they’ve gone and done it. So it’s it can be a little daunting. And I was going to ask you earlier you know your show’s growing now and this this will be big your show will have a huge audience at some point and I’ve asked this with other people that are in the space. Have you yet felt this sense of responsibility that comes with that the fact that you’re speaking into a microphone and someone’s actually listening to what you’re saying. Yeah. With power comes great responsibility. And it’s funny the very first show I released I got two e-mails and they were from people I’d never met and they were saying thank you so much for putting the show out there and I thought oh my God. And from that moment of being very aware of what I’m saying or being very aware of I don’t know where my words are landing. And of also having a conversation with my wife this afternoon saying if this really takes on. Just as I want it to really take on I’m a little bit scared but I haven’t got the value to provide the audience but I won’t and I don’t know why that is because you know success is everything you want. But I suddenly felt a pressure because I can see the downloads increasing increasing increasing. I can see the work coming towards me and I’m doing this seven days old on my own. There’s not one person that helps me and I’m also balancing other responsibilities as well. So this isn’t my only so restrained I suddenly freaked this afternoon for the exact reason that you said oh my god this is power this is responsibility. I’ve got to be careful with it. Yeah. Have you also found it. I agree. I felt that in some I haven’t had yet. Hey buddy come back to me I’m like you ruin my life but I’ll show it. That’s going to have to happen right. Someone will listen to something you’ve said or I’ve said and they’re going to do it and it’s not going to work for them and we won’t have the details but they’re going to say I listened to you when you were in my life. That’s going to happen. There’s no way it that doesn’t happen. When you’re when you grow this thing to where it can go there’s no way that doesn’t happen. Well think shows a slightly different note because you teach nuts and bolts. I think with my show I talk about hope and I told you why leap of both. Yeah I really think I teach nuts and bolts because that’s that’s I feel like there’s a lot of shows that do that specifically. And I I feel like I teach more of the journey and then the nuts and bolts sort of fall from there. Well I think that’s the same thing. I think what you do you you talk about the journey you get the cogs working in your own brain and brain when you throw out the nuts and bolts which you probably don’t think have got value as such. You’re already using those cokes and you’re thinking yeah I can use that yeah I can tell you that that’s exactly what happened with me. You know I couldn’t see how to do this because I’ve never done this. But just by you having conversations with people you take the element and you take the element and you take that element and what do you do. He’s been up to you as an individual to put it together. Yeah I actually find myself pretty. I can be very socially awkward at the beginning and I sometimes I’ve actually accessed my I’ve switched into interview mode when I’m meeting someone in real life. I just watch on Mike I like my mentally switch on a podcast microphone in front of me and I found it so much easier to have conversations with people that way. So that’s kind of interesting to me is bizarre. I’m getting ready to play Steve Jobs now because I’m fascinated to see your spin on this. And this is the fulcrum of the whole show so this is a job. Don’t be free to do that of course it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward. When I was in college but it was very very clear looking backwards. Ten years later again you can’t connect the dots looking forward. You can only connect them looking backwards. So you have to trust that the dots will somehow connect in your future. You have to trust in something your gut destiny life karma whatever because believing that the dots will connect down the road will give you the confidence to follow your heart even when it leads you off the well-worn path. And that will make all the difference. When I’m going to ask a different question because I think you’ve answered it already but you will say yes you believe in it. But why do you think so many people don’t believe in that. I think that’s a lot. Most people get hung up on the how of something for example I think that we we pick a point be right we pick a point B that’s there’s the dot so I’ve got this I want to I want to do I want to have this show. And to get this show together I need this this this this this this this and we get stuck in the details of the this this this this this instead of. All right I’m going to sort of flow through this. All I want to do is get to that thing. I’m not sure how I’m going to get there yet but I’m going to I don’t really know. And by the time you get there and you look back and go wow that is not the path that all that I was going to take. My favorite metaphor. Or maybe it’s an analogy I forget but for this is if you and I were sitting at a cafe and I there was you know a three story building across the street and I said David there’s a hundred thousand pounds sitting in a bag on the roof of that building across the street. You have 15 minutes to get it. How fast would you be out the door to go get that money. I’d be on the right run the window right but you wouldn’t know how you were going to get it. You had no idea how to get to the roof of that building. You just knew you were getting to the roof. You don’t know if you’re going to you know helicopter down you know if you’re going to call the fire department to take you up there or you know scale like Spiderman but you’re getting to the roof of that building somehow. And I think what successful entrepreneurs do is they just keep their eye on that that you know that bag the bag that’s on the roof. They’re not quite as concerned about the how part. And we very much get concerned about the how part. And the second piece of that is when someone gives you an opportunity I just said this a little earlier when someone gives you an opportunity. Our instinctive reaction is to say no because of this this and this versus just instinctive to say yes and I’m going to figure out how to work out this this and this and that is a huge mental shift even though it’s very subtle. It’s just yes and no. But if you’ll find that people in your world that are really successful or really look like they’re just having a great time. They’re the ones that say yes first and then figure out how it’s going to work after and most of the people that are stuck and they don’t get from that one dot to the next dot. Those are the ones that say no because you know I I can’t live in San Diego because I have kids in school or because I can’t afford the move or because whatever we can come up with 15 different ways. But in reality all that stuff can be worked out. So I think that’s how I would respond to that and I hope that helps someone. So what scares you this is probably my final question before I send you on the mike and you can have a one on one with your younger self. As you all know and you’ve got these rocking and rolling show everything’s going well you’ve just bought these the watch you’ve finished off the last five years and everything’s good and you’ve got a lovely new girlfriend. What scares you. Well when you look at what you need to achieve. What scares me. I have to say I look at the bank being intimidated or being excited. I sort of treat the same way. So I don’t get super excited about everything and I don’t get scared about everything. I gosh I mean I don’t I I can honestly say I don’t have that for the same reason when someone said you know when I was so literally I was scraping up change so I could take in an airport shuttle for a ticket that was paid for by somebody else to go speak in front of 3000 people and that in which I was going to make $5000 or whatever that weekend. A few years ago I I literally had to scrape $8 up so I could take the shuttle like in change so I could take the shuttle to get to the airport that I had. I had $18 in my bank account at the time. And so it wasn’t enough to get the cash out of the machine. So I wasn’t worried about it. I’ve never been worried about stuff like that and I didn’t even know what success was going to look like for me. But I had a feeling that I was destined for it. And that’s the only way I can say is that it was it was very innate and I didn’t know where it was going to come from but I was very patient about it. Now I was also very patient about about you know I knew I was going to meet a great woman at some point and I was able to reach you know like you said read about a year ago but but recently. So I think that I have that that vibe that that it’s the same reason I don’t plan a lot. I just don’t. I’m living very much in the moment as I go day by day. And for better or for worse I don’t plan as much as I probably could or should. But right now I’m not really you know scared about anything. I mean I could say you know the show doesn’t grow at all. But even if it doesn’t I’m live in a great life right now. So I guess I’m not even that scared of that. OK last question before we send you back this time. Is it easier to move forward when you’ve hit rock bottom and you really did hit rock bottom. Yes it is. It’s easier for me to keep perspective on it. I just last weekend went to I went to Napa Valley with my girlfriend’s family and it was a very first class trip like from private private jet from San Diego to Napa Valley which I’ve never done before my life and everything was super exclusive super like Michelin star first class and I was like man I don’t want to be here like this. No I don’t mean like I didn’t want to be at the weekend. I just I don’t want to live in that universe of that sort of high end world. And that’s it. I I remember looking longingly at a train that goes through Napa Valley and it stops at all these different wineries and I’m kind of like Man I wish I would’ve just taken the train and gotten kind of drunk at the third winery and kept going and that would’ve been a really fun day. Instead it was like this you know 12 people serving our table kind of thing and it just wasn’t me. But my my Philly boy sort of like Kragen pragmatist personality carried me through that whole weekend thinking yeah I would be fine with stopping at a fast food place now and going to another winery. We don’t have to go to a hundred dollar plate dinner you know. And so I think if anything it’s given me perspective and there’s one more piece of perspective that in my very very lowest time and it was very low. And I thank you for not like making me go through that again like 40000 other shows have but I had a I remember the current hurricane Katrina had hit the southern United States and it just decimated New Orleans. And this was literally at my lowest time. And I remember looking on the news and seeing like a little 9 year old little black kid who everybody in his family died. Right. And he lost everything like lost every piece of memory he ever had including all of his family members. And he’s this kid who doesn’t have much of an education. He’s a minority. He doesn’t have a lot of opportunity that are coming coming to him and I remember thinking all right no matter what happens I’m a white male with a skill set in United States and that’s not and that’s not to be racially insensitive I’m looking. That was a practical. OK. So no matter what my situation is I can’t complain like I’m starting with these four advantages that a lot of people all over the world don’t have. I will be given opportunities that a lot of people don’t have and that really kept me grounded like that there was this you know that some people had to struggle to get to what I had innately by birth that I had nothing to do with. So that really kept me grounded and it still keeps me grounded to this day is that I always realize that there’s people out there that do not have the same opportunities that I knew the answer. Mike are we going to put you on the Sermon on the mike now. This is when we send you back in time lost a young Marty McFly to have a one on one with yourself and if you could go back in time. What age would you choose and what advice would you say. So I’m going to play the music and when he gets out you’re up. This is the Sermon on the mike. Here. We go with the speed of this. This man. Who. I think that first of all very handsome very very talented man couldn’t congratulate now. If you could work on harnessing that Philly attitude a little bit just over the next few years if you could take the edge off of that. Not everybody is out to get you and focus on building some relationships that you will sustain forever without having that kind of you know screw you Gene. Not Eugene. I don’t know anybody named Eugene. I’m not trying to signal that that will serve you in the future. Yeah. So to some or to to to bring that and I know that was very short but to bring that in I feel like over the last few years I’ve been able to take this. There was a bit of filea attitude like where if someone slighted me in any way that was it they were erased like done. And there was no real going back. It was partially like it was a Scorpio in me that that that’s sort of like had that stinger. And I you know it’s it’s the it’s the patience I have now which is maybe a little bit of it’s I wouldn’t say less judgment because I think judgment makes for good comedy. But but it’s just maybe being a little more empathetic to people’s situations and realizing that that people aren’t always in control of their actions and sometimes they’re going through a learning process as well. And to just instantly give them the guillotine and out of one’s life is not the most productive way to go through things. I don’t do that anymore but I did it for a number of years and I think it was just a reaction to losing my parents and it being so so much. OK Wolf I’m going to lose this anyway I might as well just cut it right off. And I think that didn’t that didn’t serve me for a long time. So I’d fix that. Michael how can our listeners connect with you sir. Well you know this. Oh I know you say you say in an American Xon is better I would say the same thing if you were speaking in a British accent. By the way you going to come on my show some time. I would love to come on your show it oh no great. And Howard Jones I want him to go. Has he been on your show yet. No he isn’t knocking me back. He said he would and not me but I’ve called a few of them that sign up for it. And then you just come down and that’s a drag. Anyway the show is called the Solar Perner hour. The Web site because no one can spell pre-New or is solo our dotcom. And if you’d like some coaching give a coaching program yet. I’ve only been focused on building you audience. That’s good. Well so if anybody needs coaching including you my friend I can’t believe you’re not in solo lab. I want solo lab dotcom and we’d love to have you in our really cool community. Mancow thank you so much for spending time with us tonight joining up those dots on the 100th episode and it’s quite the world’s longest episode of ever done as well. Please come listen. Is. Yeah we were about seven minutes past what we normally do. So come back again when you have more dots to join up because I do believe that by joining up the dots and connecting up pasts is the best way to build a future. Mr. Michael O’Neill thank you so much. And thank you.
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Todays guests is Mr Michael ONeal, the podcasting master behind the hit Itunes show "The Solopreneur Podcast". The top ranked business show, or The Solohour as it is known to its friends, teaching online marketing and entrepreneurship skills. Michael is a man who quite simply without him, then I wouldn't be on the mic today. So you know where to send all your complaints too. He is a born entrepreneur with a fascinating story, of successes, setbacks, leaps of faith, and finding his unique path with the guidance of John Lee Dumas and Pat Flynn. Growing up in Philadelphia, the thought of being the host of his own podcast show was the last thing on his mind. He was a normal type of kid, obsessed with sport, finding trouble at school, and generally being a kid. But unfortunately that freedom of thought and energy changed when he was moved from his beloved Philly, and taken down to Florida, and it seems to me this was the start of him looking for his path in life. He didn’t fit in down in the Sunshine State, so as soon as he could, he got himself back up North, and discovered one of the first dots in his life that links him to where he is today…the internet. He was fascinated by the worldwide web, so developed skills to be a web designer. And that was his life for fifteen years, until unfortunately his parents both passed away in a very short time, and he found himself sitting with just $14 dollars in his pocket. He was over 30, with a decision forced upon him. Would he accept the punches that life had dealt him, or would he start fighting back? And that descision was made and he took the steps that made him “Know too much” and not want to work for anyone else again? He was going to become a solopreneur and own his own future. But how did he know he had the skills to be a success in the online arena? How did he know where his true passions lie? And does he regret inspiring guys like me to jump into the pool too? Well lets find out as we bring onto the 100th show to start joining up dots, the man on the mike, the host of the “Solopreneur Hour podcast”, the one and only Mr Michael O’Neal! For more on the Solohour Podcast go to: The Solopreneur Hour Podcast with Michael O'Neal - Job Security...for the Unemployable By Michael O'Neal Chats with Proudly Unemployable Solopreneurs Like Himself Description They say successful people put their pants on the same way we all do. This show is about watching them put their pants on. Nominated As "Best New Show of 2013" by Stitcher Radio, Our range of guests takes us from comedy, to acting, to the NFL, to UFC and MMA, to Top Music Stars, to Millionaires, to Business Experts, to Real Estate moguls, and everything in between. Guests like Nicole Arbour, Adam Carolla, Hines Ward, Sam Jones, Tucker Max, Jonathan Fields, Derek Halpern, Pat Flynn, Amy Porterfield, John Lee Dumas, Chris Ducker, Chris Brogan, Guy Kawasaki, Mike Johnston, Rich Franklin, and many more, these casual conversations contain tons of action-inducing content wrapped up in an entertaining candy shell. Yes hello. How are we all? Can you believe it. Episode 100. We have been building up to this for well, it seems like a hundred episodes and we are finally here. We have got a man who who quite simply rose to the top and was going to be the only person who would fit the mantle of being my 100th guest. And I’ve had people banging down the doors. I had Paul McCartney phone up the other day and say I want to be on the show, I’ve heard it’s a big thing and I said to him, “Paul, unless you can get the other four Beatles to join you, it’s not going to happen” We’ve had David Bowie crying. It’s been pathetic really. So today’s man has been nailed on to do this today, and I’m absolutely delighted that he’s on the show because quite simply without him I wouldn’t be on the microphone. So you know where to send all your complaints to! He’s a man with a fascinating story of successes, setbacks leaps and finding his unique voice. Growing up in Philadelphia he was a normal type of kid obsessed with football at school, and generally being a kid. But unfortunately that freedom of thought and energy changed when he was moved from his beloved Philly and taken down to Florida and it seemed to me this to stop him looking for his path in life. He didn’t fit in down in the sunshine state so soon as he could he got himself back up north and discovered one of the first dots in his life that links him to where he is today the Internet. He was fascinated by a World Wide Web so develop skills to be a web designer and as he’s known for 15 years until unfortunately his parents both passed away in a very short time and he found himself sitting with just fourteen dollars in his pocket. It was over thirty with a decision forced upon him. Would you accept the punches that life had dealt him or would he stop fighting back and that decision was made and he took steps that made him know too much and not want to work for anyone else again. He was going to become a solopreneur and own his own future. But how did he know he had the skills to be a success in the online arena and how did he know where his true passions lie? And does he regret inspiring guys want me to jump into the pool too. Well let’s find out as we bring onto the show to start joining up thoughts the man on the microphone. The host of the Solohour podcast, the only Mr. Michael O’Neal. Well how are you Michael? Michael O’Neal Oh here is what I can’t even what is happening. I am so flabbergasted by that intro. OK. Two things. Number one that was the best intro I’ve ever had. And formerly Chris Cerrone had that that title of the best in show to a show I’ve ever had. But it was one of the best I’ve ever heard for anybody which is why you are so the right person for this job. Well we’re all thankful you have a microphone in front of you David. Trust me on that. Second thing is I would pay to hear Zombie John Lennon if you could figure out a way to get all four Beatles on the show. That would be cool. David Ralph Well I can do Steve Jobs every day. So I might be able to do them as well. Michael O’Neal Ah so dude that was incredible. I am . I am flummoxed. David Ralph I’m so excited to be on David Ralph’s show. David Ralph – Yeah. Go go and do that because I know you have been doing an action of me on a few shows and we’ll show you a few times night. Yeah you got a little bumper for me on my show. I have these little things that when people ask you me I have a guest on the show that I have them do a little like Hi this is David Ralph and then I get interested in this opener with Mike O’Neill and your voice is so. What’s the first thing I ever said to you. I said you have the ultimate voice for radio. Didn’t I say that you did. Absolutely. David Ralph I haven’t got the face for television but I’ve got a voice for Radio Michael O’Neal Well as long as you’ve got the radio part worked out and you have taken this thing and you’ve run with it my friend. So I’m honored. I’m honored to be at the 100 episode Mark. Thank you. Thank you. David Ralph Absolutely. It is an honor to have you here because it is amazing when you start this thing,because you started your show what was it August 2013. Michael O’Neal Eleven month ago. David Ralph Yeah,11 months ago and now you are rocking and rolling with the best of them you surround yourself with, with the Internet movers and shakers the ziggers and zagers and you know you’re going to be humbled by this. So maybe you won’t. You are an online celebrity of note. When I was saying to people is my show a lot of people sort of touch on the shows of said to me I know who you’re going to have. And I said no you don’t. And I go Yes I know who you’re going to have and ego going and going to no one. And I when Martin O’Neill and I went oh term term how did I know. Really I know. Yes yeah I did it because I had pain you know I don’t want to suck up to you Michael but the early days I didn’t know what the hell I was doing. So I just kept on saying your name over and over again or some kind of benchmark of what I was trying to achieve because you like that you’d come out the gates really and say look like a rocket ship. It’s unbelievable. But you’ve only been around so long because it seems like you’ve been here ever in a day. Does it seems like that to you? Michael O’Neal It is weird. It does feel like it was yesterday that I launched the show. It feels really really recent to me that it happened. So but then at the same time I look at the memories that I’ve had over the last 11 months and all the cool benchmarks and you know different things that have happened and, but it’s packed full of stuff right. So I think if there’s any celebrity it’s sort of a z list celebrity and only at certain conferences. But yeah it’s been it’s been an incredible journey. I couldn’t be happier with how it’s gone. And I can’t wait to see what happens in the next 365. You know I’m really excited about that. David Ralph Is there a plan to the next 365 because you seem to me somebody who is very much stimulated by the now and then. Are you somebody who knows what you’re aiming to achieve? Michael O’Neal No I’m a notorious non planner. Much to the chagrin of my girlfriend who is a total planner and if I didn’t have the you know a calendar app on my phone I would be I would be completely floating out there now because I I wake up and I look at I go OK what do I have to do today. And then I see what’s going on for the day. And sometimes that doesn’t work out for me like in a social situation because people actually make plans to go out and do things. But and I’m not one of them. And all of a sudden it’s Friday I’m like I probably should have planned to do something. Yes I watch movies tonight. But yeah I I’m in an interesting spot right now because I have had this kind of five year run of as you mentioned in the intro bringing myself in this very circuitous path from $14 and not having a clear direction to now. When someone says What do you do. I say I’m a podcast host. And that’s a thing like I. That’s what I do. So I sort of a couple of weeks ago had an occasion to kind of put the cap on that five year journey and now I’m going to be looking ahead but I haven’t quite formulated what that ahead looks like yet. David Ralph And how did you do that? How did you put a cap on that. How did you say that is five years, finished boxed up? Michael O’Neal Well it was as i say I’m I’m a notorious non-celibrator. I’m a guy that usually gets to an achievement and then continues to go without acknowledging it. And I have what is probably a weird story that you’re asking for but hey here comes. So I’ve been a Porsche fan for my whole life. And you may already know where you’re heading with this but I was a Porsche fan my whole life and I don’t know why particularly. I was I had a Volkswagen in high school and I think that maybe planted to see a little bit and I was a car guy and so you know those Porsche ads from the 80s with like the big fender flares and the big wing. I think I was attracted to that and I eventually in 2003 I bought my first vintage Porsche so I bought a 1972 11 and it was a piece of crap. I bought it in New York. I didn’t know better. I drove across country midway across the USA and midway across the country the engine blew up. So that’s how badly. Where were you when this happened. I was in the dead heart middle of Nebraska when it happened in Nebraska I suppose. You it’s nothing. It is hundreds and millions of acres of wide open like cornfields and nothing else. I mean we are I was I have a picture of my car sitting looking like it’s a panther wading in the grass. Waiting to you know to prowl and it’s just sitting there with with like a hundred miles in each direction of grass. There was no middle of nowhere when it happened and I ended up finding a Volkswagen place 60 miles away that towed me in. And the guy dropped the oil pan in the car and just giant chunks of metal came out and I’m like I’m pretty sure that’s not how it’s supposed to be. So I ended up getting a tow truck driving it from Denver where I was living at the time and picking it up. Neither here nor there. So I eventually traded that piece of crap on and got a nicer one. Not when I bought it but in 2005 and I restored this car it took me four years and 2000 hours to restore this car back to better than factory condition when I still have it now. And as part of the dynamic this one in 1969 9/11 and the 69 through 73 nine elevens are very very sought after. They are the iconic 9/11. So when you would see Steve McQueen and a picture of him in the 60s you know you know in LA MA or something driving a 9/11 he was driving one of these sort of 69 to 73 virgins. And one of the sponsors of Porsche in the 60s was a company called Hoyer which was tag Hoyer before Tagg was involved in the mid-80s. So just Hoyer and it’s a guy named Jack Hoyer and he made these beautiful tiny pieces chronographs based on race timers. So you’d have a co-driver with you as a race car and there was a race in Mexico called the career of PanAmericana and the first Porsche Carrera was named after this particular race. So Hoyer as a sponsor of Porsche created a watch based on the chronographs that they used for the race cars and they called it the Hoyer Kura. So this was a very utilitarian type watch you could use it as a race time or you could just click one of the buttons and it had this chronograph on it. It was beautiful automatic beautiful timepiece. And as I’ve been going through this journey for five years this has been on my vision board because these are about three grand and above to get one of these watches. But that was so superfluous for me because I had no i like zero money. And for me to spend three grand on something as excessive as a watch wasn’t even on my radar. So about a month and a half ago now I was in this position where I was like this could be the time. And I scoured the world. I ended up buying a 1972 Hoyer Carrera from a guy in France and it came to my house and it was more beautiful in person than I. I’d never seen one in person is more beautiful than I even thought it could be. And I remember at the mid midday I’d gone to this little swimming pool by my house I belong to this little pool club which is where I work out and I was swimming in the middle of the day two o’clock in the afternoon like Tony Soprano in the middle of a work day and thinking I just did this like this just happened. This 5 year journey comes stops right now like this is where my new journey begins. I’ve gone through this trial by fire. I’ve come out hopefully like a phoenix. I’m in a position where I can buy this watch now which is insane to think about and I’m peaceful and grateful for the life that I’ve built. And so that for me was the cap of a five year struggle. I mean a real struggle to get to where I am today. David Ralph Mr. O’Neill is a perfect story. It started and it made me think if I’m ever in a pub quiz and a question about Portia comes up you’re my man that does it to Luli you are obsessed by that and you. The amount that you were quoting then. Michael O’Neal Ah. I mean I think. I think it’s kind of a lifetime obsession for people that become afflicted by it. In fact there’s a great ad I will send it to you on YouTube and there’s an ad for the new Porsche about the time the new Porsche Carrera ad and it was there it’s a little boy. And he’s a little kid in his classroom and he’s daydreaming and on 9/11 drives by him and you just see him like looking out the window and his pencil drops and you know then he he gets in trouble. And then he runs to the you know was on his BMX bike to the Porsche dealer after school and and he you know he ends up sitting in this car and the steering wheel is bigger than he is and you see Mike raised his head he’s 12 or something and that he goes to the dealer or the guy goes you have a card and the guy goes yeah here you go and he goes I’ll see in 20 years. And then there’s this great voice over that says something like there’s a there’s a there’s a particular moment that happens with you know a Porsche fan. There’s that time you want one. Then there’s the time you get one and for the truly affected afflicted there’s the 20 years in between. And it just like it gives you the chills and my buddies sent it. I sense my body goes man. Pass the Kleenex. So I guess there is a real passion there for this. It’s a very visceral feeling that is so different because of the way they build their cars and because the engines in the rear and it’s a totally different experience than you have with with any other vehicle that yeah there becomes a real passion a real obsession with him. Did you read that because this shows about joining up dots, but do you remember as a young kid having the same kind of obsessive compulsive in both words and things when when you was a little kid running around the streets of Philly pretending you Rocky did most will keep you alive without paying him for the Michael O’Neal No no no. I was a BMX kid. Now I was I was in a suburb. I was the only gentile I was in a super Jewish town north of Philadelphia. And I was a BMX or I rode my BMX bike. I mean I was from 1984 until I mean I was racing bikes from 84 until 2000. David Ralph So Rocky wasn’t on your radar at all? Michael O’Neal No not at all. Tony Hawk and Dave you know Dave Voelker and Matt Hoffman and you know BMX guys Bob horo. They were all on my radar. I’ll tell you here’s here’s a little here’s a join up dot that is current. I rode an entire daywith real wow I just blanked on his name. That’s embarrassing really. I’m killing myself right now this is bad radio. David Ralph What does he look like? Michael O’Neal He’s a big famous director now and he will watch films John Malkovich. Being John Malkovich won a friggin Oscar. We’re ready. Come on. With it and it might seem seamless Spike Jones for crying out loud. David Ralph Spike Jones Michael O’Neal Yeah Spike Jones the director was a dude I rode with at a place called Rockville BMX and we were just BMX or dudes riding around. And then he he became a photographer for one of the BMX magazines and then started doing filming because he did Beastie Boys first video I forget which one and then started doing independent films then did Being John Malkovich and now he is like an international you know massive director like one of the best most well-reputed directors in the world. And it was kind of cool. I mean so he did adaptation he did Being John Malkovich Where the Wild Things Are You know just just done amazing stuff. So the Academy Awards. And so a pretty pretty bad ass. He did her you know the movie Her most recent Yeah that’s Spike Jones. David Ralph So is there any similarity between the young kid in Philly and now, because from what I see across the pond and I listen into the conversations that you have with your internet guys and it does seem from this side of the pond that you’ve got a gang of friends and followers and whatever that basically control the Internet. I had Rick Mulready on the show. And I said “Do you ever feel like slipping something into Pat Flynns drink, so that the next morning you turn on your screen and see if there’s a black hole on the Internet because he’s not functioning at this time because it kind of seems not” But he wouldn’t be pushed in to slipping a Mickey into his drink in any shape or form. But you seem a little bit edgy to most of them. Michael O’Neal Yeah. David Ralph Is that because you’re from Philly. Is it because he’s a very sort of industrial Con. Its a real city you know. Its like a working class city when you’re there. Michael O’Neal Yeah I think the the edginess is something that I’m kind of a known for. I don’t know if you curse on your show but I’m kind of a no B.S. kind of guy and I’ve never been one to straddle the fence very very much. And I think what happened with Irwin what happens with a lot of these sort of Internet type celebrities is that they’re so concerned about getting the broadest audience that they sometimes come off as being a little bit milktoast or a little bit vanilla. And I come from a totally different perspective where when you think about media you think about New York Philadelphia Boston. These are like the media centers of the world. It’s where you know you go to Boston College that’s one of the broadcasting school that’s where Howard Stern went. That’s where many very famous broadcasters come from those places I went to Temple University which has an incredible media department. And when you look at the people that are iconic in history they’re not people that are vanilla. There are people that have strong opinions one way or the other and people either love them or they hate them but they’re definitely them. So they definitely have a presence. They definitely have a voice that’s unique to them. And I think I always think it took me a little while to settle into that on my show but it is ultimately as you as I developed the show and I developed my own voice I realized hey I’m not in the interest of pleasing everybody. Like that’s not my job. My job is to talk from my perspective on certain issues and try to extract really good business advice from people without them or my audience really seeing what I’m doing. And one of my favorite quotes to that is and you probably heard me say before but which just never let him see your work. You know that’s from Bill Cosby also from my alma mater Temple University in Philly and that basically means that go through your process ask your questions you know have questions written down but you don’t have to be so blatant about it. You can you can ease through you know great standup comedians do this like Louis C.K. talks you know he’ll be sputtering and angry and going through all this process on stage and you think that that’s just how he is. You laugh at his angry energy but he knows all the beats within that he knows exactly what he’s doing within that realm and that is that is him not letting you see him work on him. David Ralph When your on the mike then how much is you now being absolutely authentic and how much is it creating a mood creating an atmosphere on the show. Michael O’Neal Well it can’t. Can’t you have both? David Ralph Oh I don’t know CAN you? Michael O’Neal What are you asking? Are you asking how much is sort of pre-written and how much is off the cuff? David Ralph Well on this show for example some of the things I say I only say to get a reaction from the guest. You know do I really mean it kind of. Do I think that they will go against it. Yes. So I will say it. How much do you actually say that you believe 100 percent. Michael O’Neal Well first of all you do that because you understand this and you’re a pro. I mean this is a very natural place for you to end up. So I think that that I do very similar things to you, as you do just because yeah sometimes you want to extract some stuff from a guest that is being difficult. But yeah I mean I’m pretty authentic dude. I there’s not a lot there’s people that have met me in real life and go Oh you’re exactly like you are on the show. Yeah Im exactly like I’m in the show. I turn it on and I talk so I don’t have this, I’m not affected in any way. I just go. David Ralph So you’re not like you haven’t got a human graphic equalizer when you press record you just kind of increase certain parts of your personality. Michael O’Neal Not really. No. This is pretty much how I am. Yeah I’ll speak like I speak. I’m probably slightly dirtier in real life. David Ralph Well you don’t know where the words will land do you! Michael O’Neal I probably curse a little more which is fine. I’ve done a few podcasts now where I was allowed to do that and it did make it really nice. David Ralph Are you in the same situation as me because I used to listen to your show all the time and it was a staple diet during my transition at that time and now I’m doing this. One of the failures of me is that I don’t get time to listen to other people’s shows. I listen to your one the other day because I just suddenly realized I had a gap but you almost become an island of your own success where before I used to listen to shows and I used to think oh I’ll take a bit of it and I’ll take a bit of it and become like a magpie. And now I don’t know what vibe is out there and I don’t know whether I’m being edgy or whatever. It just seems to be you. Speaking to the mic and I throw it out to the world and hopefully it goes well. It seems to be a fault of mine, and so do you have the same thing? Michael O’Neal No I’m exactly the same way. I’d say partially by choice and partially by by time. So when I when I do have time to consume podcasts I don’t tend to go business. I tend to go comedy. And lately I tend to go NFL football. I listen to podcasts related to that because I want to be able to clock out a little bit when I do want real inspiration. I’ve been listening to here’s the thing with Alec Baldwin it’s WNYC. I’ve not heard a better intro or production or interview style than that show. It’s his in his intros are nothing short of brilliant. I mean they’re amazing how he brings a guest on an and then how he interviews and his questions are very in-depth and he’s such a pro that it makes it really easy for me to like look at that bar and go OK that’s where the soul open for hours going. That’s what I do. I actually honestly David I find now the more that I get into this show the more I almost can’t stand other people’s shows like there so few that can capture my attention and that I feel like are being done well even with really good friends of mine that do shows I just go and that is almost unlistenable. You know it’s so. So I just don’t I definitely look far above the kind of Internet Marketing slash business world for inspiration on how I want to run mine. David Ralph because the only two that I listen to now is yours. And I went on started. I wanted to listen to every single one. And but the nerdiest and there the only two reasons. Yeah great and Nerdist is good for a number of reasons. David Ralph Yeah I just like the way it kind of flows and you don’t even know it started and it just kind of teases right. Michael O’Neal That’s right. Yeah they just start it. We kind of did that today didn’t we. David Ralph Yeah absolutely and that was the good stuff. Michael O’Neal And we talked for a while before we started recording. You know me I mean it just felt like yeah hit it. Go for it. We’ll start like Nerdist. But yeah no I think that there’s a sense there’s such a glutton of new shows out there and I don’t. but if I’m being opinionated I don’t. There’s a lot of places where people are learning quote on quote how to podcast. And I think they’re feeding them crap information.So often a big problem. David Ralph And I know he’s a mate of yours and I wish him all the success in the world, but the problem is so many people are trying to duplicate John Lee Dumas and that’s not right. He came first and he created the structure of his show, and whether you like that format or whatever that is he’s and he’s made in his own by being him. And I hear these shows and after about three minutes I think oh my god it’s the same thing again. Now I will listen to your shows and I will go all the way through. But people miss a trick don’t lay up coming back to my all the time is finding your authentic self playing to your streams. And and if you do that you create a bigger loyalty. You know if you are totally yourself people either hate you or like you but the ones that like you will love you. And that’s where these people are missing out because they’re not even being authentic to themselves they’re just kind of a middle ground. Michael O’Neal Yeah. And John would tell you and I’ve said this a million times in front of him and said do you the success of your show or his show has nothing to do with his format. And it has nothing do with him as a podcast for that all. It has everything to do with the fact that he has a financial background writes great marketing copy and has a schedule and a rigidity too. He has a military rigidity because he was in the military to his to his business. And unless you come with that exact kind of background you will not have success in that way. People think that because of the way he does his show because it’s structured and because he has these set questions and does it seven days a week that that’s why he’s successful and is completely irrelevant to that. So the problem is is like you said so many people listen to that or they go to podcasters paradise and they learn a certain way to do things. And I’m almost diametrically opposed to every single thing that they’re learning. So it’s like it’s like man I it’s it’s frustrating for me in that way. And I shouldn’t say that like I want to rephrase that I’m not time actually oppose everything they’re learning what I’m what I’m worried about is that the things that I think make podcasting successful aren’t emphasized in a lot of training courses. And like you just said finding your own voice is a number one you have to be successful. You have to find your own voice and you have to have a great brand and it’s not something that people speak about a lot. Like I took a lot of cliff Ravenscroft stuff. I’ve taken all the stuff. I’ve seen a number of course is out there a lot of them don’t pay a lot of attention to that piece and I worry that with this next phase of podcasting and what’s you know since everyone’s starting a show they’re going to find it a lot harder to sustain it unless they’ve found their own voice on their voice. And and it’s within this brand that they’ve really created. So we’ll see. But that’s the jury’s out on that. David Ralph Did you really have to love doing this because I’m going to play a speech in my Jim Carrey and I’m actually I’m going to play now and we’re going to talk afterwards. This is Jim Carrey. Jim Carrey Sound Clip My father could have been a great comedian but he didn’t believe that that was possible for him. And so he made a conservative choice. Instead he got a safe job as an accountant. And when I was 12 years old. He was let go from that safe job. And our family had to do whatever we could to survive. I learned many great lessons from my father. Not the least of which was that you can fail at what you don’t want. So you might as well take a chance on doing what you love. David Ralph Is that the true message that we should be getting across? Michael O’Neal Yes it is unfortunately the connecting of the dots joining of those two dots which is I found this thing that I love and now I have to figure out how to get paid for it is difficult. That’s a difficult journey. And that’s my that was my five year journey. Right. First not even knowing what it was that I loved. I had no idea I was going to podcast five years ago but I had an initial foray into public speaking. I started teaching social media on stage and I ended up traveling and going to 17 cities teaching people how to use social media to grow their business and I found it very like oh this is something I could be good at. And then that morphed into doing back end production on a podcast for a year and a half and just starting to understand the podcasting industry that finally morphed into me starting my own show and here we are. But it was a five year journey to find that you know like I had indicators of it and if someone in 2009 it said hey do you want to get. You want to make six figures and be a public speaker. I be like totally that be great. But at the time I had nothing to speak about. And now I do. So it’s kind of a I I do feel like you have to find something that will and you’ve probably seen this in your life with your show something that will make you walk into that studio and record an episode even if you’re exhausted or not in the mood or whatever because you truly love it and you’re excited about it. Oh yesterday. That’s how I am. Yeah I’ve had times when I’ve recorded 12 shows back to back and now I’ve. Why just because I knew I was going to do it seven days a week show and that was the hardest time I had. I had no internet for two weeks he just crashed on me and I suddenly panic but I didn’t have enough to cover. And I was going away as well. So yes seven days a week he goes out and I needed the boke. And so I did it and I started off at six o’clock in the morning and I just went through through move through and I edited and I did everything in the gap between when I recorded the next one and he just went seamlessly. And when I pressed record yes I was on I was on. Once I was off it was just like I was you know on drugs or something I was just slump too much. But it wasn’t until the very last ones that I realized actually about that passion that you’re talking about the ability to actually do it when you’re tired. I’ve gone past by and I was actually feeling ill. And I remember doing this show and the sweat was pouring off me and I listened back to and it doesn’t sound like it but I realized brain actually no you’ve got to look up to yourself as much as you do actually doing something. Yeah I’m very committed to that. DAVID It’s I have I have three sort of pillars if you will that I do I think make a good soul a partner or a successful soul a partner. And there’s there’s time freedom there’s financial freedom and there’s location freedom. And so the first one is really easy time freedom simple you walk into your boss’s office tell him to go screw himself and then you have time freedom. There you go. Location freedom. You can pretty much just get in a car and go somewhere that we have that kind of freedom in the U.K. and in the United States. Yeah there’s some complications in between. But technically you can just go do that. It’s the financial freedom part. That’s the tricky part of the three. That is a little harder. But I find that I’m so unwilling to compromise my time freedom. I’ve turned down so many more so much more money because it would compromise my time freedom like I could have a lot more coaching clients and a lot more people in my my group coaching. It’s called Solo lab. But with that I would have to commit another couple of days to taking care of them and I’d I’m willing to do that at all. Like i will i love my life the way it is right now and I can be comfortable financially I can go do fun things. And I don’t have to compromise that. And you know hopefully I can continue to grow and continue to you know make more money maybe have more speaking gigs things like that but I don’t intend on working any harder. I just want to you know work smarter maybe try to over deliver a little more to my audience and that’s what I’m looking for. Well was sensible and that’s exactly what I want to do as well because I hate these people and it’s almost like a badge of honor. But I’ve quit in nine to five job. And then you go yes I’m an online marketing do I do this I’m a diva and I cook my time and I’m doing 80 hours a week and I think right. Right. What the hell do you do that. Why don’t you just do two days hard work and have the rest of the time of it. It seems stupid that I say that. That’s right. And it’s. It does. It is counter intuitive. The thing is when my parents passed away you mentioned this in the intro when they did that. My perspective on time completely shifted and I just I. Life’s too short. So I am very much a person that says both. When someone says would you like this or this. I say both. When I get an opportunity to do something I say yes. Win you know and I just do it like it’s a thing that I have committed to and not mentally like I don’t just go yeah this is what I’m going to do from now on. I just do it now I just say yeah let’s do that. That sounds fun. Let’s just go for that. I’m going to go on a hike. Yeah. Great book a ticket. You know and we just do it. And I found that that has served me really well because when I do that and I put that as a priority in my life then the the stuff that I’m not so thrilled about I still end up having to do it. It still fills in the blanks but my priority is to really extract the most that I can out of my life and I’ll tell you not a person that does that well I think as John John Lee Dumas he works probably a little more like the person you were just mentioning. He works a lot but he’s also great at saying yes when when something comes across his desk he goes yeah lets do that. And it’s like on the schedule. And I think that’s that’s part of I think what that’s part of success. To me that’s part of what success feels like is being able to do that. I remember hearing an interview with Billy Joel and the interviewer said to him Billy you’ve sold X squillion albums and singles and you’ve done these tours and you play Madison Square Garden five straight nights. What has success given you. And he just said time and that was it. He can wake up each morning and if he doesn’t want to do something he doesn’t. And that single word resonated with me hugely especially when I was in my 9 to 5 job and I realized then that things were not right. And why should I be doing a nine to five job when there are options I suppose. I began to know too much. And then once you know too much brain you realize you can’t ever go back. Michael O’Neal Yeah. It’s really really is a one way street. It also but that carries over as well into my personal life as well. And I think when the there’s ever such a different confidence now just in my life in general and I think Billy Joel would sort sort of anybody that reached a level of success has this this this underlying confidence about them that is very attractive not only to you know the opposite sex but it’s what attracts other successful people to you. There’s just there’s a subtlety in actions and just how really how you go through life when you’re confident that is very attractive to you know both both people both sexes and that is something that people pick up on pretty easily. You become a success back humor don’t you. You know the old Jim rhône thing about you know the average of you know five people to surrender a lot of people I talked to. Yeah. I mean a crappy job and all these miserable people all the time. How can I surround myself. And one of the things I say to them is you know focus on success because the more success you get and the more competence as you say they end up a successful people get sucked into your world and suddenly you created what he was saying. It’s not easy to do. But it certainly is a mindset that starts moving in that direction. That’s right. And you it’s funny you just asked that question of me is how do you now you’re on it you’re on an island so you’re you’re in the UK you’re not. I’m in San Diego so I get to have a bunch of people around me at all times. I will say though we don’t get together. I mean you know we get together as friends but I’m not in a mastermind with any of these people around me. We don’t sit there and me out. So you know to answer your question I’m mean answer answered on my show tomorrow. But you’ve got to join a group you’ve got to join a group mastermind of some sort. And there’s really no other way. If you if you’re not surrounded by those five people that that you feel are motivating you in a way that that is bettering your life and hopefully their lives. You’ve got to separate from those people and find the people that are doing that and pretty much everyone I know that’s in this you know business Internet Marketing podcasting world has some sort of coaching program. And my best advice is to get people that you really enjoy like how they speak and like how they deliver and join their group and that’s it. And you know once you’re a part of that community you’ll be a lot more apt to be motivated you know learn the things you want to learn. It’s part of the reason why I don’t need to listen to podcasts anymore because I have so many people in my group that are doing cool things. I get to learn about all the cool new stuff without having to go listen. They sort of comes to me. So so do you now feel that you’re ahead of the curve. Because when when you started the show I remember you saying it’s the Wild West and now it seems like every man Dogan whatever has made me a podcast. So do you think now about you it’s not the Wild West but you actually ahead of the curve. It’s good. Get a question. Yes and no I think it’s still the wild west. I think that people in this environment aren’t necessarily looking in the right direction to advance their business where they should be. Let me clarify that. I think inspiration for how someone’s podcast get better gets better doesn’t happen within the new podcasting community. It happens with old media. Then you go look at how you all learn how to interview you go study Howard Stern if you want to learn how to produce an an excellent show. You go you know you look at and some an NPR show or something like that like a where a BBC show something that you know pay close attention to how people are introducing guests and what they’re how they do their ads and how they integrate you know clips from this person’s body of work into their intro or into the show itself. So I think there is really a professional side to this that will ultimately come out. For me personally what I’ve realized over the last couple of months and this is something that I think you can you can sort of strap on as a badge of honor as well is that I’m a better interviewer than most. Just in general I’m more intuitive and I have more range of knowledge so I can connect those dots. You know I can join those dots. And that’s what makes for a compelling and entertaining interview no matter who you are it’s the people that have the pre-scripted questions that I think are really going to struggle because that’s that’s very exhausting to an audience. So on one side I think I’m still really ahead of the curve in that. I come from this and as do you come from this background this history of paying attention to interviewers and then sort of bringing this natural ability to the microphone that 99 percent of people don’t have. And that’s the building not only to interview someone in a business sense and extract what they do for a living but actually make an entertaining hour of programming for someone. And in my opinion they can get the business data from 80000 podcasts that are on iTunes but it’s really hard to get entertainment out of it. And that’s what I’m trying to bring to the table and I think that’s what you do a really great job bringing to the table as well because because what I’ve realized you know was a complete nobody is basically the very first interview I did was no you weren’t Yes. Stop it. Tom Mocha’s was episode your line on the line. Me right now David. And he was a huge inspiration to me so I wanted him as guest number one. And he was talking to a gentleman called John Lee Dumas and so awful who’s is CHEP never heard of him. And I went over to his show and the very first show I listened to was episode 3 2 2 which was yourself and kidding. That was I didn’t know that. Yeah that was the very first episode. And the fascinating thing about it was which got me on the show and this is my sort of join up thought was the fact that everything you see in life is normally about benchmarking against success. You see people already Veja and you go I’d like to do that but it worked for him he’s had this skill he’s got that you know he’s a natural that’s for sure. On that show on 0 5 3 2 2 you hadn’t even lunged and he was saying to you you know when are you going to go and you and I’m going to go on Wednesday or whatever it was. And I tuned in and I listened or whatever you do you click on it you don’t tune into you. But I heard you speak for the very first time and I found it fascinating because I was seeing but not some bouts of somebody finding their way. And you was saying Yeah and I had 17 downloads and it wasn’t that you were looking at success you were looking at somebody finding their flow finding them. Moving on. And that’s right. But that’s what really flavored my show was the fact that you were doing something that seemed natural and you were holding your hands up and you going really. I don’t know if this is going to work but hey if it doesn’t change we’ll move on later on. And remember you did this show and it was it was some chap I don’t remember who was with them on the on the beach somewhere and calls were whizzing past and your battery ran out half way through. Yes and yes you still put out and I thought that’s interesting because what he’s saying back is not that this show has got to be polished and perfect what he’s saying is is a journey and I’m going to improve from that and that be the last time that my battery runs out halfway through. That’s right and it was definitely the last time that happened. Yeah. Yeah it’s a good way to good insight. I see. If I were doing it again yeah I would probably do the same thing again. I was I’ve been always sort of a fan of the let’s just put it out at that at that time. I was leaning more on my hopeful interview skills than I was like ultimate show quality and since I’d already put out a couple of episodes it wasn’t that bad but I really loved the guys story. So I was like yeah there was Harry. Harry Smith was the guy’s name and. And. And I thought yeah let me let me throw that on. And why not. What happened. You know and somewhere. This is what’s so cool about this right. You heard one single episode I did from Johnny Dumas which was like a random occurrence. And look how much it’s affected both of us. Yeah. Just that one thing. So if one little episode you put out catches the right person it can literally be life changing. I will say something. I want your listeners to go to solo our solo our dotcom and I want you to go back to like three. I don’t know let’s say pre 70s so anything from episode like I don’t know one until episode 70 and I want you to click on those posts and read how great David’s comments are for the episodes. They are so insightful and brilliant. And you do such a great job summarizing. I think I even wrote you once and said Do you want to write my show summaries. Remember that you did and it was just that the crux of me doing this and I knew I was just going to stall so cool. So I am and you still you just did it the other day when you were that episode you listened to. You do such a great job summarizing. You’re going to be such a smash successful podcast. David Yeah I have no doubt whatsoever you are going to I hope you will let us be on your show someday when you do these live broadcasts in front of you know a hundred thousand people at the Wembley Stadium. Did you know when you start this and I’m really going to open up here so I don’t really have a Chevez. But when you start based you want it to be so good and you want it to be brought in and you kind of. There were job. You look back on them and you go OK yeah that wasn’t quite where I wanted to be but it was all right. And then you hit sort milestones and you listened back to some of these shows I don’t know if you listen to yours and I thought oh that was a bit closer to what I had in my head my original vision. And I got to show it E.T. and that’s when I suddenly realize Michael that was the host of a show and it was my responsibility to be the host to even I think he was too grateful for people giving up their time to be on my show. I it was a complete mind set. Now I want this to be the biggest show out there. I absolutely do. And it’s all I can focus in on and it’s in many ways it’s killing me or my life is totally out of whack. But all I want is about is the number one thing upset that on any show because it sounds a bit arrogant really I’m upset. Once we’ve stopped recording them when somebody asked me about it that is where I want to be and I want to be join up not as a brand. Exactly as you say. Right. Because it’s one of those things that you kind of go join up towards. What does it mean. And I’m very aware of if you provide quality and content as quality brand in many ways take care of itself. It’s like we always talk in the early episode the name that was always mentioned was Pat Flynn. And you know he’s got that classic smart passive income and you forget that’s a premium brand but actually he’s only three words put together and he’s because he’s provided that great content and quality and value. But it becomes the kind of the trust word where what he’s trying to achieve. That’s right in he that he can live that now. But I actually want I want to focus on something you said just before that you will be bigger than him and so will I. And I know I don’t mean that like he doesn’t have the same aspirations as you do. Right. And I’m saying in terms of podcasts in terms of like Pat wants to speak I’m not speaking for him here but just knowing what I know about him. He he is sort of the crash test dummy of internet marketers. So he does all these really cool things on the web. I want my show to become about like I want to. I want to be interviewing complete legitimate A-listers you know and finding out about their kind of business and so normal journey. That’s where I will see the show going. And because of that if when and if I get to that point. The show the podcast itself will be bigger than all of the internet marketing type podcasts. Does that make sense. Yeah it’ll be way bigger than that. It’ll be more like Nerdist. You know Chris Hardwick gets killer guests on his show and that’s why his podcast is you know number one number two number three on iTunes overall. And so it’s it’s one of those things that that I it’s what I aspire to do as well is to get working within this world like real A-list category of people because I think that they’ll appreciate talking about their journey. And so that’s where I want to head with that. Also I was very strategic and I changed direction. I realized that when I started I was just throwing out the net to anyone and anyone would jump on the show. I would have them round about sort of thing once again I thought to myself no I can’t do this because when I was looking at other people’s shows I was thinking Oh I’ve been on my show I’ve been on my show and it was just the sort of hybrid of people doing the rounds. So I went off in a different direction. So if you listen to episode 88 I had Cathy O’Dowd who was the first woman to hit the summit of Everest from both sides. I’ve got the first civilian astronaut coming on the show. I’ve got a chap over a few years ago was worldwide news because he sold his life on e-bay and he’s just sold his life to Disney and all that kind of stuff. So I realized I had to change direction to become more unique to be more interested by the stories more. Yes. Extract out of them what I wanted to show to the world and that was my original vision but I couldn’t say Eva until later on in the journey. Yeah and that’s really what you’ve done. That’s the whole point. That’s why you will be successful because you’ve you’ve done this in a sort of a different way in your life when you look back to sort of the Philadelphia kid and you riding around on your BMX and all that kind of stuff. Well you just sort of wanting to be the classic sports kid was. If you look back and now we all going to send you back in time soon on the Sermon on the mike. No I was a show off though. I think I think I was you know a performer of some sort and the PA is I keep is that makes my colonial who he is to play better racquetball with an audience. Yes. Every single time. Yeah I think so. I think there’s that’s there that’s in there. It’s in the DNA for sure. I don’t use that a lot but it’s in the DNA. I work better in a performance environment which is presumably why I kind of screw myself on the show intentionally. I don’t I I prepare in a way where I I’ve researched my guest as you have. You know you know and you certainly listen to the show but at times you know a little bit about me and you’re able to then naturally structure questions that that dovetail into my history and that’s what a good interviewer does. I don’t write a lot of questions out sometimes intentionally and that’s because I there’s something about the performance side. I realize now that I’m I’m doing this the shows this this month I’ve got over 300000 downloads for the first time and this is a and I realize so there’s people listening and I have to perform. You know what I like it. It makes me it UPS my game. I’m live on the show. And I think I do that to myself on purpose because because I work better in that environment a lot maybe underpressure a little. Well we’re very similar. It’s fascinating. I feel like I’m finding out the real Marcantonio here. Where is the person behind the that the presenter. Because I am somebody who has spent my life doing training courses and presentations and that’s my job. I’ve never done this kind of thing. It was totally BA and I’m somebody very much likes to be on their own likes no one near them. And then when I suddenly go ping. That’s it. It’s performance time. And I don’t know if it’s showing off or trying to create a different persona for myself because that’s kind of not naturally me. But I do have the ability to raise my game and present a different side to myself if you know me deep down you would say to me different people that the people who know me from seeing where I allow them to see me they would say yeah you it’s like I’m on the mike as you are when you normally doing those things because I’m letting them see what they want to see. Yeah. Yeah I mean I think there’s there’s an element of that and again I want people to understand this is why we and we talked earlier about sort of what John brought to the table. And I’m you know people look at my show and say it’s it’s been it’s it’s been pretty successful in the first 11 months just overall debt is not that’s not a fluke because I didn’t just start in August of 2013 with kind of media. You know I’ve been a professional drummer my whole life. I’ve performed I’ve been on I’ve been a racer I’ve been you know a competitive racquetball player for for many many tournaments for many many years now and before that it was tennis. So I’ve always been performing in some way or the other. I I coached for five years on teaching people social media in front of huge audiences. I’ve played Red Rocks in front of 10000 people like me being on a microphone and being natural at it is not something that happened overnight. It’s a it’s this is something that you walked in with. You’ve been training for years before you turned a mike on yourself. So it’s kind of like Yeah right yeah. You were new to podcasting but not nuda trying to translate a concept from one person to an audience like that’s something you’ve been doing for a long time. So so that’s I think that it’s a bit of a misnomer within our industry that yeah anybody can you know podcast or anybody can start blah blah blah. That’s kind of cool I get it. Yes technically you can turn on an app you can go to boss jock on your iPhone and upload it to clips and you’ve got a podcast but can you do it. Well can you do it so that when someone switches from morning radio or Howard Stern or the BBC to your podcast that they don’t notice a huge drop off in quality or you know sound quality interview quality production quality that’s that’s what I try to bring the table and I think you do the same thing. So is that what you’re saying really and I’m going to play the words of Steve Jobs because he says it very well as well but no experience is wasted. It doesn’t matter what you’ve done in your life you will pull elements and you extract what you need to create your new path. Out 100 percent. Absolutely yes. Everything you’ve done up until this point is does training for you for this next phase. When I have people on their show and we have these episodes called Find your swing I want to find out everything that person has done because it find your swing is like well what do I do. Like what am I naturally gifted at how can I make money off of something that I really enjoy that I’m passionate about that’s what finding your swing is. And it’s I want to find out like what you did when you were a kid. Were you an athlete did you or you or you a professional knitter you like to knit hats. You know like what is it what do you do. And when people can start accessing those things that they’ve done their whole lives they’re really gifted and I like to find ways that we can use those talents in whatever their next business endeavor is. We call about connecting our past to build our future and here. And one of the names as come out is if you really want to know your passion really want to know what you’re naturally good at. Don’t think about what you were doing in adult life because very much you would have been taking a responsibility for a wage or whatever. Look at what you was doing as a kid when you weren’t being paid for it. And if you was a drama when you was a kid and you loved doing it then try and look at something that would do that. And he says that exactly the same way as you do it and you’ll find your swing episodes. That’s right. And I and I love those. Again that’s another instance where we totally put ourselves on the spot. I have a co-host. Her name is Dawn Mars. For those episodes and we never read the questions first. Like I only you know sometimes I glance at them to see just a copy and paste them into my Evernote when we’re doing the show. But we were reading them and answering them live and which again has another element of pressure that we’ve got to come up with an answer and these people are literally like I’ve had people that have taken what we’ve said on the show. They’ve made a business from it like the next day they’ve gone and done it. So it’s it can be a little daunting. And I was going to ask you earlier you know your show’s growing now and this this will be big your show will have a huge audience at some point and I’ve asked this with other people that are in the space. Have you yet felt this sense of responsibility that comes with that the fact that you’re speaking into a microphone and someone’s actually listening to what you’re saying. Yeah. With power comes great responsibility. And it’s funny the very first show I released I got two e-mails and they were from people I’d never met and they were saying thank you so much for putting the show out there and I thought oh my God. And from that moment of being very aware of what I’m saying or being very aware of I don’t know where my words are landing. And of also having a conversation with my wife this afternoon saying if this really takes on. Just as I want it to really take on I’m a little bit scared but I haven’t got the value to provide the audience but I won’t and I don’t know why that is because you know success is everything you want. But I suddenly felt a pressure because I can see the downloads increasing increasing increasing. I can see the work coming towards me and I’m doing this seven days old on my own. There’s not one person that helps me and I’m also balancing other responsibilities as well. So this isn’t my only so restrained I suddenly freaked this afternoon for the exact reason that you said oh my god this is power this is responsibility. I’ve got to be careful with it. Yeah. Have you also found it. I agree. I felt that in some I haven’t had yet. Hey buddy come back to me I’m like you ruin my life but I’ll show it. That’s going to have to happen right. Someone will listen to something you’ve said or I’ve said and they’re going to do it and it’s not going to work for them and we won’t have the details but they’re going to say I listened to you when you were in my life. That’s going to happen. There’s no way it that doesn’t happen. When you’re when you grow this thing to where it can go there’s no way that doesn’t happen. Well think shows a slightly different note because you teach nuts and bolts. I think with my show I talk about hope and I told you why leap of both. Yeah I really think I teach nuts and bolts because that’s that’s I feel like there’s a lot of shows that do that specifically. And I I feel like I teach more of the journey and then the nuts and bolts sort of fall from there. Well I think that’s the same thing. I think what you do you you talk about the journey you get the cogs working in your own brain and brain when you throw out the nuts and bolts which you probably don’t think have got value as such. You’re already using those cokes and you’re thinking yeah I can use that yeah I can tell you that that’s exactly what happened with me. You know I couldn’t see how to do this because I’ve never done this. But just by you having conversations with people you take the element and you take the element and you take that element and what do you do. He’s been up to you as an individual to put it together. Yeah I actually find myself pretty. I can be very socially awkward at the beginning and I sometimes I’ve actually accessed my I’ve switched into interview mode when I’m meeting someone in real life. I just watch on Mike I like my mentally switch on a podcast microphone in front of me and I found it so much easier to have conversations with people that way. So that’s kind of interesting to me is bizarre. I’m getting ready to play Steve Jobs now because I’m fascinated to see your spin on this. And this is the fulcrum of the whole show so this is a job. Don’t be free to do that of course it was impossible to connect the dots looking forward. When I was in college but it was very very clear looking backwards. Ten years later again you can’t connect the dots looking forward. You can only connect them looking backwards. So you have to trust that the dots will somehow connect in your future. You have to trust in something your gut destiny life karma whatever because believing that the dots will connect down the road will give you the confidence to follow your heart even when it leads you off the well-worn path. And that will make all the difference. When I’m going to ask a different question because I think you’ve answered it already but you will say yes you believe in it. But why do you think so many people don’t believe in that. I think that’s a lot. Most people get hung up on the how of something for example I think that we we pick a point be right we pick a point B that’s there’s the dot so I’ve got this I want to I want to do I want to have this show. And to get this show together I need this this this this this this this and we get stuck in the details of the this this this this this instead of. All right I’m going to sort of flow through this. All I want to do is get to that thing. I’m not sure how I’m going to get there yet but I’m going to I don’t really know. And by the time you get there and you look back and go wow that is not the path that all that I was going to take. My favorite metaphor. Or maybe it’s an analogy I forget but for this is if you and I were sitting at a cafe and I there was you know a three story building across the street and I said David there’s a hundred thousand pounds sitting in a bag on the roof of that building across the street. You have 15 minutes to get it. How fast would you be out the door to go get that money. I’d be on the right run the window right but you wouldn’t know how you were going to get it. You had no idea how to get to the roof of that building. You just knew you were getting to the roof. You don’t know if you’re going to you know helicopter down you know if you’re going to call the fire department to take you up there or you know scale like Spiderman but you’re getting to the roof of that building somehow. And I think what successful entrepreneurs do is they just keep their eye on that that you know that bag the bag that’s on the roof. They’re not quite as concerned about the how part. And we very much get concerned about the how part. And the second piece of that is when someone gives you an opportunity I just said this a little earlier when someone gives you an opportunity. Our instinctive reaction is to say no because of this this and this versus just instinctive to say yes and I’m going to figure out how to work out this this and this and that is a huge mental shift even though it’s very subtle. It’s just yes and no. But if you’ll find that people in your world that are really successful or really look like they’re just having a great time. They’re the ones that say yes first and then figure out how it’s going to work after and most of the people that are stuck and they don’t get from that one dot to the next dot. Those are the ones that say no because you know I I can’t live in San Diego because I have kids in school or because I can’t afford the move or because whatever we can come up with 15 different ways. But in reality all that stuff can be worked out. So I think that’s how I would respond to that and I hope that helps someone. So what scares you this is probably my final question before I send you on the mike and you can have a one on one with your younger self. As you all know and you’ve got these rocking and rolling show everything’s going well you’ve just bought these the watch you’ve finished off the last five years and everything’s good and you’ve got a lovely new girlfriend. What scares you. Well when you look at what you need to achieve. What scares me. I have to say I look at the bank being intimidated or being excited. I sort of treat the same way. So I don’t get super excited about everything and I don’t get scared about everything. I gosh I mean I don’t I I can honestly say I don’t have that for the same reason when someone said you know when I was so literally I was scraping up change so I could take in an airport shuttle for a ticket that was paid for by somebody else to go speak in front of 3000 people and that in which I was going to make $5000 or whatever that weekend. A few years ago I I literally had to scrape $8 up so I could take the shuttle like in change so I could take the shuttle to get to the airport that I had. I had $18 in my bank account at the time. And so it wasn’t enough to get the cash out of the machine. So I wasn’t worried about it. I’ve never been worried about stuff like that and I didn’t even know what success was going to look like for me. But I had a feeling that I was destined for it. And that’s the only way I can say is that it was it was very innate and I didn’t know where it was going to come from but I was very patient about it. Now I was also very patient about about you know I knew I was going to meet a great woman at some point and I was able to reach you know like you said read about a year ago but but recently. So I think that I have that that vibe that that it’s the same reason I don’t plan a lot. I just don’t. I’m living very much in the moment as I go day by day. And for better or for worse I don’t plan as much as I probably could or should. But right now I’m not really you know scared about anything. I mean I could say you know the show doesn’t grow at all. But even if it doesn’t I’m live in a great life right now. So I guess I’m not even that scared of that. OK last question before we send you back this time. Is it easier to move forward when you’ve hit rock bottom and you really did hit rock bottom. Yes it is. It’s easier for me to keep perspective on it. I just last weekend went to I went to Napa Valley with my girlfriend’s family and it was a very first class trip like from private private jet from San Diego to Napa Valley which I’ve never done before my life and everything was super exclusive super like Michelin star first class and I was like man I don’t want to be here like this. No I don’t mean like I didn’t want to be at the weekend. I just I don’t want to live in that universe of that sort of high end world. And that’s it. I I remember looking longingly at a train that goes through Napa Valley and it stops at all these different wineries and I’m kind of like Man I wish I would’ve just taken the train and gotten kind of drunk at the third winery and kept going and that would’ve been a really fun day. Instead it was like this you know 12 people serving our table kind of thing and it just wasn’t me. But my my Philly boy sort of like Kragen pragmatist personality carried me through that whole weekend thinking yeah I would be fine with stopping at a fast food place now and going to another winery. We don’t have to go to a hundred dollar plate dinner you know. And so I think if anything it’s given me perspective and there’s one more piece of perspective that in my very very lowest time and it was very low. And I thank you for not like making me go through that again like 40000 other shows have but I had a I remember the current hurricane Katrina had hit the southern United States and it just decimated New Orleans. And this was literally at my lowest time. And I remember looking on the news and seeing like a little 9 year old little black kid who everybody in his family died. Right. And he lost everything like lost every piece of memory he ever had including all of his family members. And he’s this kid who doesn’t have much of an education. He’s a minority. He doesn’t have a lot of opportunity that are coming coming to him and I remember thinking all right no matter what happens I’m a white male with a skill set in United States and that’s not and that’s not to be racially insensitive I’m looking. That was a practical. OK. So no matter what my situation is I can’t complain like I’m starting with these four advantages that a lot of people all over the world don’t have. I will be given opportunities that a lot of people don’t have and that really kept me grounded like that there was this you know that some people had to struggle to get to what I had innately by birth that I had nothing to do with. So that really kept me grounded and it still keeps me grounded to this day is that I always realize that there’s people out there that do not have the same opportunities that I knew the answer. Mike are we going to put you on the Sermon on the mike now. This is when we send you back in time lost a young Marty McFly to have a one on one with yourself and if you could go back in time. What age would you choose and what advice would you say. So I’m going to play the music and when he gets out you’re up. This is the Sermon on the mike. Here. We go with the speed of this. This man. Who. I think that first of all very handsome very very talented man couldn’t congratulate now. If you could work on harnessing that Philly attitude a little bit just over the next few years if you could take the edge off of that. Not everybody is out to get you and focus on building some relationships that you will sustain forever without having that kind of you know screw you Gene. Not Eugene. I don’t know anybody named Eugene. I’m not trying to signal that that will serve you in the future. Yeah. So to some or to to to bring that and I know that was very short but to bring that in I feel like over the last few years I’ve been able to take this. There was a bit of filea attitude like where if someone slighted me in any way that was it they were erased like done. And there was no real going back. It was partially like it was a Scorpio in me that that that’s sort of like had that stinger. And I you know it’s it’s the it’s the patience I have now which is maybe a little bit of it’s I wouldn’t say less judgment because I think judgment makes for good comedy. But but it’s just maybe being a little more empathetic to people’s situations and realizing that that people aren’t always in control of their actions and sometimes they’re going through a learning process as well. And to just instantly give them the guillotine and out of one’s life is not the most productive way to go through things. I don’t do that anymore but I did it for a number of years and I think it was just a reaction to losing my parents and it being so so much. OK Wolf I’m going to lose this anyway I might as well just cut it right off. And I think that didn’t that didn’t serve me for a long time. So I’d fix that. Michael how can our listeners connect with you sir. Well you know this. Oh I know you say you say in an American Xon is better I would say the same thing if you were speaking in a British accent. By the way you going to come on my show some time. I would love to come on your show it oh no great. And Howard Jones I want him to go. Has he been on your show yet. No he isn’t knocking me back. He said he would and not me but I’ve called a few of them that sign up for it. And then you just come down and that’s a drag. Anyway the show is called the Solar Perner hour. The Web site because no one can spell pre-New or is solo our dotcom. And if you’d like some coaching give a coaching program yet. I’ve only been focused on building you audience. That’s good. Well so if anybody needs coaching including you my friend I can’t believe you’re not in solo lab. I want solo lab dotcom and we’d love to have you in our really cool community. Mancow thank you so much for spending time with us tonight joining up those dots on the 100th episode and it’s quite the world’s longest episode of ever done as well. Please come listen. Is. Yeah we were about seven minutes past what we normally do. So come back again when you have more dots to join up because I do believe that by joining up the dots and connecting up pasts is the best way to build a future. Mr. Michael O’Neill thank you so much. And thank you. Dream Jobs, Online Courses, Persistence, Personal Trainer, Decision Making, Publicity, Young Entrepreneur, Freedom, Addicted, Shawn Stevenson, American Hustle, Make Money Online, Motivational Quotes, Expedition, Challenges, Steve Jobs, How To Start A Business, The Secret, Rich, Online Marketing, Time Management, Blogger, Videos, Recruiting, Authentic, Travel Blogs, Ultra Running, American Football, How To Make Money, Online Business, Company Culture, Law Of Attraction, Planet Money, Jobs, Video Marketing, Linkedin, Success Principles, Digital Marketing, Action Taking, Starting A Business, Successful Entrepreneurs, Personal Branding, Amazon, Lead Generation, Career Change, Life Planner, Comfort zone, Simplicity, Break The Rules, Book Launches, Personal Finance, Secret To Success, Business Plan, Health And Fitness, Tech Startup, Self Publishing, Entrepreneurs, Love, Career Path, Educational, Creativity, Selling, motivation, motivational, inspiration, confidence, success, freedom
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Your real mission is to gather people and serve them at your highest level.
On today’s episode Russell talks about having a gathering and how you build one. He shares the kinds of gatherings he already has, and how gathering gatherers can help build your business.
Here are some of the cool things in today’s episode:
The different examples of gatherings you and your people can be a part of. And how what you are doing has an impact on someone else’s life, which in turn has an impact on someone else’s live and you have the ability to impact many more lives than you originally could.So listen below to find out how to gather and impact more people than you ever thought possible.
---Transcript---
Hey everyone, good morning. This is Russell and I am heading to, not the worst place I can go in the morning. The worst place would be probably the accountants, they’re definitely the worst. Number two used to be lawyers, but my lawyer now is super awesome, so that’s cool. Number three is the dentist, so I’m heading to the dentist right now, which is not my favorite thing, but it’s that time. I got some weird thing on the left side of my mouth when I bite down. It really hurts, so hopefully they can fix that and I hope I don’t have any cavities, but I’ll let you guys know.
But this morning, I woke up and had a coaching session with one of my coaches, Tara Williams, which was really, really cool. She said something that I thought was cool and it got my mind thinking and then more and more cool stuff started happening. But we’re talking about the new book, and if I’m being completely honest there’s a lot of stress and pressure on me right now. Even though the book’s finally done, there’s…of course I can’t just sell a book you guys. I got all excited and had this idea for this Funnel Hacker Blackbox, which then meant I had a whole bunch of other stuff. And then there’s a bunch of….anyway, a lot of stuff going together to make this, I want to make this buying experience when you guys buy the book, the most fun thing ever. I want you to be like, “that was so fun we should buy it again.” That’s the goal.
So with that we’re just making a really cool funnel that would be really cool for you guys to funnel hack and then watch and learn and really hopefully model and use in your world. But we’re talking, oh I almost turned left and I’m glad I didn’t because there is insane traffic, and I’m already late for the dentist, so that was close.
But what we were talking about is gathering. What we do is we’re gathering people. So I think about each of your businesses, we talked about this from a list building standpoint, or from getting customers or things like that. Or I’d be putting products and services out there in the world. And you’re doing that to gather certain types of people to you. That’s the whole point of what we’re all doing. We create some amazing things that cause value in the world and in people’s lives. They get those things and then they gather to you.
Ten year ago those gatherings were like, “Okay, well people are on my email list.” But there was no physical gathering. Then we started doing events and there was kind of a physical gathering of people. Now, I look at facebook groups and it’s become kind of like the gathering spot. Most programs have a facebook group. We have that, we have our Funnel Hacker Group, which is all of you all. If you’re not in that by the way, you should come. We’ve got 50,000 people in that now. 50,000, if you go to projectclickfunnels.com it redirects you to our facebook group. Because I couldn’t remember how to get people there, so I bought projectclickfunnels.com.
But there’s 50,000 people gathered there together talking about what we’re all talking about. And then there’s, for different products we sell, like Inner Circle’s got a different group. People are gathered together. We communicate and hang out in this group. So we’re gathering. So for each of you guys, that’s kind of big piece of this pie. How are you gathering people together so that then when they’re together and they’re congregated together, you can serve them in the highest way that you are able to. Those are your products and services and training and podcasts, and coaching and blah. Supplements, whatever it is you’re selling, that’s really the goal.
Businesses become less transactional and is now more gathering people and figuring out how to serve them. That mindset shift is pretty big. There’s these gatherings and what was kind of cool. We were talking about, with the Expert Secrets book we’re gathering. That’s, I didn’t know this was my goal, but what’s interesting, and even with the Funnel Hackers and Clickfunnels and stuff, I am gathering gatherers, which is super cool when you think about it.
My goal is to gather all these people together and get them to start mass movements. That’s the whole point of the new book. How to build your own movement of people you can change and inspire and help and serve. So that’s my goal, is to gather all the gatherers, which is insanely cool and a huge honor. As I’m just thinking about that as a calling or a mission or whatever you want to call it. It’s a pretty cool thing. My job is to serve you guys so that you can gather more people and serve them. And hopefully during this whole process we have a little bit of impact on the world and we change people’s lives and we make things better and give people hope and faith in the future and what’s possible and make everyone’s journey’s here on the world a little bit better.
It was interesting, I heard someone talk about this before. Tony Robbins at our event was talking about why we all do what we do. He said, “When it all comes down to it. We’re doing it for feeling.” I was like, huh. How weird is that? We read books because the feeling, we watch a movie because of the feeling, we hang out with people because of the feeling we get. Feelings is what drives everything. It’s the feeling that we’re seeking, that we’re trying to get. A certain feeling we liked in the past, or that we didn’t like, we’re trying to stay away from that feeling.
And I’m not sure how this whole thing ties together, but when all is said and done, our goal is to gather people together so we can help them to feel good. I know that’s simplifying, way over simplifying the whole thing. Or is it? That’s kind of the thing. Why do I gather all of you guys together? I’ll say guys and gals. Why do I gather you guys together? Obviously there’s something I’m excited about and I’m sharing it. And it’s a tool and a theology and thought process that helps you be able to share your messages.
By me sharing it, I feel better. I feel happy. It makes me, it gets me excited, being able to share these things and seeing the light bulb go off in your heads. But then you gather people and you’re not necessarily teaching what I’m teaching. But you’re teaching your own thing. Maybe it’s weight loss or fitness, I guess weight loss and fitness are similar. But whatever it is that you do, you’re gathering people together and selling them products and services that make them feel good. And that’s kind of it. If you really boil it down.
Anyway, I thought that was interesting. I just started thinking about that. How do we give people those good feelings? How do we make support better so that people have good feelings when they deal with it? How do make the product better so they have better feelings? It’s all about feelings, that’s what we’re all looking for. That’s why people fall in love, that’s why they do drugs, on the positive and negative side, they’re all looking to get a special feeling or to stay away from a feeling they don’t like.
Anyway, I thought that was interesting. I don’t really know the point of my ramblings today other than I thought it was really cool to kind of look at this as each of us are gatherers. You’re gathering people. You’re gathering your tribe. You’re gathering your people that resonate with you and your message and who you are. And then after you’ve gathered them, you can serve them, help them and you can try to effect their lives by making them have better feelings. Feeling better about themselves and things around them, about the future and all those things.
What’s interesting is that when people are happy they treat other people better, it’s this huge compounding thing. It’s like a ripple, I hate using that because if you guys listened to the podcast back from day one, back when we were working on the project Rippln, but it never went. That was the whole concept. Throw a rock into the middle of a pond, what happens? There’s a ripple and it keeps going all the way out to the edge of the pond. And that’s kind of what we’re doing. We’re gathering people together, give them this ripple in their lives and it goes out.
It’s kind of corny when you say, “We’re going to change the world.” But we kind of are. Isn’t that cool when you think about it that way? The thing you’re doing has an impact and it changes somebody else’s life and it changes somebody else’s and it kind of ripples out.
So anyway, with that said, I just wanted to state that everyone keep on doing what you’re doing despite some of the pressure and stress and things that go into it. The ups and downs and failures and successes. All of those things are all wrapped into it. When all is said and done, what’s the real purpose? We’re gathering our people. Gather your people, they will come to you, the right people. And not everyone’s going to come to you or me or anyone, there’s people who can’t stand me. Especially after some of my fun jokes and stuff recently. There’s a lot of people who don’t like me. That’s cool. I don’t mind. It used to bug me, but it’s okay now. Because what is important, is my people, the people I am congregating will hear my voice, come to me and listen and I’ll be able to have impact and hopefully cause a change and make their lives better.
Like I said, my goal is to gather gatherers, and I think what fires me up more than anything is knowing that if I can affect you and help you gather more people, or serve more people at a higher level, if I can affect you and again, I’m not talking to everyone listening to this podcast, I’m talking to you. Yes, you the one listening right now. If I can affect you, to help people and to cause that gathering amongst your people, how cool is that? There’s thousands or millions of people that you can affect, that I never could. Because my gifts aren’t what yours are. But your gifts are special.
And I don’t want to, I think I might have bragged them yesterday because I’m so excited about it. But Brandon and Kaelin from Inner Circle, their numbers are insane right now. They’re getting 500 people a day joining their program. 500 women a day are coming and they’re helping these women look at themselves differently and lose weight and feel better. And usually what happens, I don’t know about you, but when I get on a weight loss kick, what do I do? I tell my friends and family and spouse and kids and we all, it’s a ripple effect that goes out there.
And I can’t do what Kaelin does. I can’t do what Tara does. I can’t do what….I’m trying to think of everyone in my inner circle. All the people we effect in the work, I can’t do what you do. But if I can help you gather more people and serve them at a higher level, that’s the key. That’s my mission.
Anyway, I thought that was kind of cool. I hope it helps you think about what you do a little bit. And understand that that’s the goal, gather your people and that could be through building a list, podcasts, groups, whatever it is, you’re gathering people together and you’re trying to serve them at the highest level possible. That’s it, that’s the game. When you do that, they’re going to feel good. And when they feel good, people around them will feel good and it’ll trickle down. Kind of cool.
Anyway, I’m getting close to the dentist, but I’m still stuck in a lot of traffic, but I’m going to bounce, cause I am behind on my Voxers and my inner circle members need some responses, dang it. So I’m going to go catch up with them. Appreciate you all and we will talk soon.
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Jane Stoller hit a low point in life after a move and changing jobs and relationships. She asked herself, "What is making me so unhappy?" and quickly realized the lack of organization was really putting a damper on her happiness. Learn how Jane survived that low point by getting organized. Jane is originally from Canada and now resides in Zurich, Switzerland and she's constantly finding new ways to get and stay organized. Jane is the author of Organizing for Your Lifestyle, which provides inspiration to make organization fit YOUR needs.
Nuggets of Wisdom from Jane:"And for every minutes spent organizing, an hour is earned."
"For me, I naturally start it with reorganizing my closet and whenever I am in kind of a low point, that is what I do, I organize my own and then sometimes I have lots of friends that love it when I come to do theirs. So that gives me kind of a feeling that I have accomplished something. "
"When I am organized, I am my happiest."
"If you have a perfect organizing system, sustaining that is the most important part, otherwise there is no point even getting organized. So that is where I say, 'Make it your lifestyle but do not think about it all the time. Make it a routine... Make it fit for your lifestyle'"
"My day starts the night before. Planning my outfit for the next day and my meals. So I make sure that when I wake up in the morning, whether I am working out first thing in the morning or whether I am going to the office or on the weekend, I have my outfit planned, so there is no last minute stress of looking for what to wear or what not. So, I think that really helps you start off on a right foot. And if you start off on that right foot, the rest of the day, I find usually smooth flows pretty smoothly."
Some of Jane's Favorite Things:Personal habit: Organizing Calendar. Planning.
Easy meal: "Swiss meal. Rösti. Like hashbrowns. Lots of carbs. It is really similar to hashbrowns but they make it into a pie form. I learned it from my mom and it is my favorite side dish to make."
Possession: "My juice maker."
Jane's Favorite Book: The Life Changing Magic of Tidying Up by Marie Kondo
Best advice received: "Do not sweat the small stuff."
Jane's Happiness Formula:"Being with my family. Being healthy and exercising. And of course, being organized."
A Challenge from Jane:"Write down three organizing goals. I think that will really help everybody start their organizing challenge. It could be small goals like organize everyday or perhaps larger ones like a creative organizing system. Whatever it is, write down three small organizing goals. "
ResourcesOrganizing for Your Lifestyle by Jane Stoller
The Life Changing Magic of Tidying Up by Marie Kondo
Rösti - here is the recipe
Jane's Book PR Contact is Kelsey McBride
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The #RCP team arc across episodes 1-13 of the popular Netflix original show 13 Reasons Why. This pod comes with a health warning as the subject may well be triggering for some. The victim's voice is at the centre of this show, which chimes with our team and it's what makes it unique. We deep dive the show, how it was made, the differing perspectives, the characters, their actions and the crimes which led to Hannah Baker taking her own life.
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What do you do if you don't have a clear passion? Or if you used to have one, but now... not so much? In this C&C episode, we discuss an alternative to all of that advice about passion, and it may just change the way you approach your work. We also address ambition and Tall Poppy Syndrome, embracing the unknown and a profound story about erasers. Trust us on this one.
