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“Uncertainty inherently means that possibility exists. Possibility for all sorts of things. For the darkest fantasies and fears that I have and for the most beautiful. And my life is a vote in the direction of a possibility, and I'm going to give myself to the one I want.”
Check out the episode page for the transcript and the full list of the resources mentioned in this episode: https://widerroots.com/7
In this conversation with Jess Serrante, we dive into the teachings of Joanna Macy and explore how they can support us in our work for social change. I was particularly moved by our discussion on the role of heartbreak in activism and coaching. We asked, what if more healing modalities and spiritual paths helped us get in touch with our pain for the world as a catalyst for discovering our unique contribution? Jess shares powerful insights from her new podcast, "We Are The Great Turning," (including previews of unreleased episodes!)
We also grapple with the question of hope in the face of overwhelming challenges like climate change. When despair creeps in, what can we draw upon that's more stable than the fluctuations of hope? Throughout our conversation, we touch on the importance of grounding our activism in our love for the world, and how Joanna's teachings can help us do that.
Jess Serrante is a dear friend of mine and a longtime climate activist who has worked with groups like Greenpeace, Rainforest Action Network, and Sunrise Movement. She’s a coach, facilitator, and now a podcaster!
Subscribe to We Are The Great Turning on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pocket Casts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Key moments03:02 - The dream Joanna & Jess had for this project15:39 - Heartbreak and honoring our pain for the world23:59 - Clip from Joanna Macy: What if my pain for the world overwhelms me?28:58 - Clip from Joanna Macy: Our pain is sacred35:34 - Heartbreak guiding us to our calling44:25 - Examining Hope (and other places to find our motivation)53:36 - Clip from Joanna Macy: Whistling in the dark to cheer ourselves up1:02:51 - Jess' sources of nourishment1:04:46 - Closing
Resources & LinksWe Are The Great Turning Podcast websiteActive Hope by Joanna Macy (book)The Work That ReconnectsVideo of Joanna Macy: “The knife edge of uncertainty”Parable of The Sower by Octavia Butler (book)Rebecca Solnit quote: “Hope is not a lottery ticket you can sit on the sofa and clutch, feeling lucky. It is an axe you break down doors with in an emergency"
Connect with JessCoaching website: JessSerrante.comInstagram: -
“My starting point is less about agitating for change and more about empowering people to believe that they can be actors in their own lives. We fundamentally believe that everyone has a stake in climate change, that everyone can make, can affect change around it.”
Check out the episode page for the transcript and a full list of the resources mentioned in this episode: https://widerroots.com/6
Today's episode features Charly Cox, author of the book "Climate Change Coaching."
In this conversation, Charly's approach to holding a systemic view stands out. She not only believes in our client's ability to change but also in the system's ability to change. Her coaching helps clients see their situation from this broader perspective. Charly shares her story about realizing that coaches don't have to be "neutral" and can bring their own values forward in their work.
Some background on Charly Cox and her work: She founded an organization called The Climate Change Coaches, which focuses on empowering climate leaders with coaching skills. Their climate coaching approach helps leaders and individuals find their unique role in addressing the climate crisis. It motivates them to take action and enact behavior change at the personal, organizational, and systemic levels.
Key moments01:39 - Charly Cox's Journey to Climate Change Coaching06:20 - Bridging Climate and Coaching13:48 - The Unique Approach of Climate Change Coaching20:26 - "Having an agenda" vs living your values as a coach32:39 - Charly’s sources of nourishment34:42 - Closing
Resources & LinksThe Climate Change Coaches (the organization Charly founded)Climate Change Coaching by Charly Cox (book)Terra.DoThe Uninhabitable Earth by David Wallace-Wells (book)Acceptance and Commitment TherapyJoanna MacyMargaret WheatleyEco-Dharma by David Loy (book)We Are The Great Turning (podcast with Jess Serrante)Climate Change Coaching Mastery courseGreen Transition Coach Course
Connect with Charly CoxThe Climate Change CoachesCharly Cox on LinkedIn
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“Can we actually lead with fierceness and the vulnerability of saying, I'm not here because I hate you. I'm actually here because I love you. I'm here because I love the sanctity of life and beauty, and those things are being destroyed all over our ecosystem.”
Check out the episode page for the transcript and a full list of the resources mentioned in this episode: https://widerroots.com/5
Today’s episode is with Kazu Haga, a nonviolence trainer in the lineage of Dr. King, based in Oakland who's been involved in social change movements since he was 17. He leads trainings for youth, incarcerated populations, and activists. He's the author of Healing Resistance: A Radically Different Response to Harm.
In this conversation, Kazu and I explore how to bring more spiritually grounded practice into our social change movements. I appreciated his invitation for us to think about how we can bring an energy of opening things up, even if outwardly we're doing direct actions that are shutting things down. He also shares his perspective that much of the injustice we witness is actually a manifestation of unhealed wounds, both at the individual level and the societal level. And I particularly loved the part of this conversation where we talked about leading from heartbreak and vulnerability as a way to create connection, especially during conflict.
Key moments03:24 - Kazu's spiritual lineage and politicization through nonviolence07:51 - Opening things up spiritually while shutting them down tactically14:38 - Exploring trauma healing as a modality for social change22:43 - The necessity of deep practice in movements26:07 - Allowing messiness as we learn to hold conflict33:56 - Breaking up with "cancel culture" and creating deep belonging37:51 - We need skills to not only name harm, but repair it46:45 - Embracing complexity over black-and-white thinking50:08 - Anekāntavāda: Holding multiple truths53:06 - Finding beauty in challenging times54:55 - Nourishment: Hospicing Modernity & unplugged time
Resources & LinksHealing Resistance (book by Kazu Haga)Fierce Vulnerability (upcoming book by Kazu Haga, scheduled for early 2025)A Force More Powerful (documentary about nonviolent movements)Ayni InstituteBuilding Belonging (organization)Prentice HemphillHospicing Modernity (book)Movement GenerationThich Nhat HanhAnekāntavāda: Holding multiple truths (principle form Jainism)Canticle Farm (community in Oakland)
Connect with Kazu -
“Healing doesn't look like getting back to the way things were before, the way things were before made you sick.”
Noëlle Janka is a politicized career and healing coach dedicated to supporting social change leaders. For the past decade, she has brought together her personal experience navigating chronic illness with her passion for social justice and transforming systems of oppression. Noëlle recently published her book, Rebel Healing: Transforming Ourselves and the Systems that Make Us Sick.
In this conversation, Noëlle shares concrete ways coaches can support social change leaders to reconnect with their bodies, intuition, and a sense of interconnectedness. We explore how coaching can help prevent burnout by focusing not just on doing more, but on what needs to stop. And Noëlle opens up about embracing her role as a healer within social movements and how she navigates the tension between one-on-one work and large-scale transformation.
Check out the episode page for the transcript and the full list of the resources mentioned in this episode: https://widerroots.com/4
Key moments02:04 - The Root Cause: What inspired you to write Rebel Healing?06:41 - Doing work for justice with a more regulated nervous system13:45 - Preventing burnout: Coaching can be about doing less, not more17:23 - Healing: 30% repair, 70% transformation21:51 - Serving 1-on-1: Embracing the role of healer within social movements28:28 - Coaching Technique: Reconnecting with body wisdom and intuition in coaching34:25 - Noëlle's sources of inspiration36:52 - Closing
Resources & LinksRebel Healing: Transforming Ourselves and the Systems that Make Us Sick (Book by Noëlle Janka)Liberated to the Bone: History's Body's Futures (Book by Susan Rappo)Deepa Iyer's Social Change MapMicroactivism: How You Can Make a Difference in the World Without a Bullhorn (Book by Omkari Williams)Strozzi Institute (Somatic coach training program)@CoachJenniGrover - For folks with health challenges and a crafty sideChronic Babe 101: How to Live an Awesome Life with Chronic Illness (Book by Jenni Grover)Girl, Woman, Other (Book by Bernadine Evaristo)Wildchoir (Spiritual Social Change Choir Music)Black Voters Matter FundEmergent Strategy Ideation Institute with adrienne maree brown
Connect with NoëlleNoëlle Janka’s Website@NoelleJanka on Instagram -
“I think if people don't change by shame or blame or forcing them into things, I think they change because they have a vision of the world they want.”
In this episode, I get to talk with Dara Silverman, a white queer Jewish consultant, somatic coach, and trainer with over 20 years with organizations and movements for social, racial, economic, and gender justice. Dara was the founding director of Showing Up for Racial Justice (SURJ), an organization bringing together white folks working for racial and economic justice. She shares insights into supporting clients around the ongoing genocide in Gaza. We discuss how politicized coaches can hold the principle of “not having an agenda for clients” while still bringing in their political views. Dara also shares how white coaches and facilitators committed to systemic change can integrate anti-racism into our work for change.
Check out the episode page for the transcript and the full list of the resources mentioned in this episode: https://widerroots.com/3
Key moments02:28 - Dara's background08:22 - Coaching clients around Gaza12:13 - Holding "not having an agenda" while being politicized21:03 - Relaxed, Dignified, and Accountable: Supporting white folks to show up for racial justice26:30 - The role of coaching in movement spaces33:28 - Dara's coaching growth area35:21 - Dara's sources of nourishment
Resources & LinksShowing Up for Racial Justice (organization)Strozzi Institute (coach training training program)generative somatics (somatics training)Leadership That Works, Coaching for Transformation (coaching program, now only in India)Black Leadership for Organizing and Dignity (organization)The Embodiment Institute (organization)Coaching for Healing Justice and Liberation (coach training program)Nervous by Jen Soriano (book)Fargo (TV series)Handsome (podcast)
Connect with Dara SilvermanWebsite: DaraSilverman.com for upcoming courses and resources.Opening to Freedom: Embodied Facilitation for White Folks - the year-long program that Dara discussed in the episode. Register by March 25, 2024.Weekly online somatic practice groupInstagram: Follow @darasilverLinkedIn: -
“So how can we create such rich belonging, that there's room to challenge each other without fearing that we're going to be kicked out of the group?”
In this episode, we’ll be exploring that question and many other questions about justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion (JEDI) with Mazin Jamal, co-founder of Holistic Underground. We dive into how we stay grounded as facilitators when we’re supporting groups to look at race, privilege, and equity.
Check out the episode page for the transcript and all the resources related to this episode: https://widerroots.com/2
Key takeawaysBringing Levity: Use humor and lightness when dealing with weighty topics to help keep things in perspective. This allows the group to stay regulated and think clearly. [00:10:09]Orienting Toward Love and Liberation: Come from a place of care and freedom rather than just fixing problems. This creates a generosity of spirit that is more sustainable.Keeping Groups Regulated: Help everyone stay grounded and resourced rather than reactive. This allows for cooperation and completion of the necessary conversations. [00:15:08]Grounding in Shared Vision and Values: Keep bringing it back to the “eyes on the prize” and the shared care. This connects to the deeper reasons people are engaged.Living the Change We Wish to See: Model the kind of community we want to build in how we organize and work together. [00:21:25]Making Space for Imperfection and Redemption: Have compassion for our own and others’ humanity. This reduces defensive othering when we all accept we are on a journey. [00:26:25]Developing ancestral spiritual cleansing practices: Use techniques grounded in one's ancestry to energetically care for oneself when dealing with heavy topics over time. [00:37:14]Helping People Find Their Niche: Support folks in locating the intersection of their experiences, skills, and passions so they can sustainably contribute over the long haul.
Resources & LinksThis Is An Uprising - Book about the momentum organizing model, where Jeremy first learned about Ghandi’s idea of “prefigurative” organizing (living the world we want to see now).Characteristics of White Supremacy Culture - Mazin mentions this list indirectly when he brings up perfectionism.New Blue Sun - Andre 3000's new flute albumThe Emerald PodcastThe Prophet by Kahlil Gibran
Connect with MazinHolistic Underground - JEDI consulting, fiscal sponsorship, and impact incubator for spiritual innovationEmbraceCommunity.co - Community events in the Bay Area that Mazin helps organize.@mazinjamal_ - Mazin on Instagram
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Welcome to the podcast! This episode is going to be different than our usual format because I wanted to take some time to lay the foundation for the questions we’ll be exploring on this show. Questions like “How can our movement spaces actively create more opportunities for deep, internal transformation while we work for external change?”
I invited my dear friend Jess Serrante (a long-time coach for climate leaders) to help shed some light on the purpose of this podcast and our hopes for justice-oriented coaches.
Check out the episode page for the transcript and all the resources related to this episode: https://widerroots.com/1
Make sure to subscribe through your podcast app: https://widerroots.com/subscribe
Timestamps[00:32] - What this show is about[08:26] - Intro to my conversation with Jess[10:14] - Jeremy's coaching origin story[14:24] - What would it be like if we all had these skills?[18:40] - Who this is for and what we'll be exploring[21:29] - Coaching industry & how we don't see ourselves in it[26:03] - Why we find coaching so powerful in movement work[31:52] - Being in community with one another as practitioners
Connect with JessConnect with Jess at JessSerrante.com or @jess_serrante. Sign up for her newsletter to get notified when the We Are The Great Turning podcast (with Joanna Macy!) is released later this year.
Follow the podcastJoin the newsletter at WiderRoots.com for more resources on personal + systemic transformation.Instagram @WiderRootsPod Connect with Jeremy on his coaching website.
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In order to navigate the breakdowns we’re in, we need coaches and leaders who can help us bring out the best qualities of humanity and tap into our deepest longings for the future.
This podcast is my attempt to do “research in public” and explore the questions that have been in my heart for over a decade:
How can coaching skills and practices support changemakers and social movements working for systemic change?How can social, political, and ecological realities inform the foundation of HOW we coach? (Rather than being de-politicized and individualistic.)What does it look like to place our commitment to the well-being of the whole at the center of a coaching conversation/relationship?This podcast is my quest to understand more about these questions. I hope you walk away with ideas, inspiration, and resources to coach in a way that makes a difference for the world we want to live into.
I invite you to join the newsletter where we'll be sharing additional resources, links, training opportunities and more: https://widerroots.com/
