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This episode exposes the myth of "direct-to-fan" when artists rely on third-party platforms that own the data, APIs, and revenue streams. It explains how rented platforms can strip creators of rights, credit, and sustainable income.
Host Terrence Sawchuk outlines a better path: building private portals and owning your audience, data, and monetization. He shares practical thinking and resources to help artists and creators reclaim value, leverage their work, and build lasting careers.
Resources & Next StepsPick up your copy of my new book, $old 4 a $ong (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back)sold4asong.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, engineer and now author with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
The Book (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back) is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com
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Recorded live at a Mississauga book event, this episode features Terrence Sawchuk discussing his book "Sold for a Song" and the long history of undervaluing music creators. He explores self-worth, ownership of songs and data, and practical solutions to help artists build sustainable careers.
Terry shares personal stories from Toronto and Nashville, highlights the power of community, and outlines ideas for artists to reclaim control—through ownership, direct fan relationships, and new tech platforms. A call-to-action for creators and supporters follows the talk.
Resources & Next StepsPick up your copy of my new book, $old 4 a $ong (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back)sold4asong.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, engineer and now author with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
The Book (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back) is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com
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Saknas det avsnitt?
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Terrance Sawchuk urges artists to build their careers from the ground up by testing songs and performance in their own neighborhood, learning from real audience feedback rather than chasing online vanity metrics or moving to a bigger city.
He explains why local shows, selling directly to fans, and maintaining ownership of your work create sustainable momentum, help you develop as an entertainer, and protect you from being undervalued by the industry.
Practical takeaways include focusing on live performance, measuring real results like ticket sales and repeat attendees, and committing to the work and time required to grow a lasting career.
Resources & Next StepsPick up your copy of my new book, $old 4 a $ong (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back)sold4asong.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, engineer and now author with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
The Book (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back) is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com
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Big announcement: my first book is finished!!! In this episode I share why I wrote it, to expose how the music industry has historically overleveraged and undervalued creators, and to offer practical ways artists can reclaim their worth and attract abundance.
I also discuss the early book release, the official launch before SXSW 2026, upcoming projects like a docu‑series called The True Value of Music, workshops, and how I plan to help creators streamline their careers so they can focus on making art.
Join me as I break down the problem, the path to self‑worth, and actionable steps for creators to thrive in a changing industry.
Resources & Next StepsPick up your copy of my new book, $old 4 a $ong (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back)sold4asong.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, engineer and now author with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
The Book (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back) is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode Terrance Sawchuk argues that musicians and creators must stop giving their value away to big platforms and instead build their own “private portals” to own relationships with fans. Using AI and simple tech, artists can use TikTok and Spotify as billboards to drive traffic to their own hubs, sell directly, and reclaim income and control.
The episode outlines practical steps and a mindset shift: stop relying on third-party platforms that monetize your data, create unique fan experiences on your own site, and use tech to streamline and sustain a real music business.
Resources & Next StepsPick up your copy of my new book, $old 4 a $ong (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back)sold4asong.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, engineer and now author with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
The Book (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back) is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry Sawchuk breaks down a quiet but fundamental shift in the modern music business: how platforms moved from distributing music to extracting data—and why most artists never see the upside of the value they generate.
Every stream, skip, save, replay, and share feeds an ecosystem designed to learn, predict, and monetize human behavior at scale. While creators focus on promotion and visibility, tech platforms quietly leverage analytics, audience data, and pattern recognition to build massive profit engines—often without artists realizing what they’re giving away.
This episode is a wake-up call for artists, producers, and songwriters who feel stuck in a loop of being controlled instead of being in control.
🔍 In This Episode, You’ll Learn:Why fan behavior has become more valuable than the song itself
How artists unknowingly give up masters, publishing, and audience data
The real difference between reach and leverage—and why confusing the two keeps creators powerless
Why visibility without control leads to noise, not sustainability
What it truly means to own your audience in a data-driven industry
Why platforms thrive on your data—and why artists must build their own infrastructure
How small, leveraged audiences often outperform massive but disconnected followings
💡 Key TakeawayIf you don’t own your rights, your data, or your direct relationship with your audience, you’re not participating in the upside—you’re powering it.
Understanding the difference between being visible and being leveraged is the first step toward reclaiming creative freedom, financial stability, and long-term value.
Resources & Next StepsJoin the Sold for a Song community:sold4asong.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, and now author with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
The Book (How Music Creators Lost Their Worth, and How to Take It Back) is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terrance Sawchuk answers the question why do musicians, singers, actors, directors, producers, screenwriters, even stagehands,have unions… but songwriters don’t?
In this episode of Sold for a Song, Terry Sawchuk breaks down a truth that shocks many creators: songwriters are legally prohibited from forming a union in the United States. Not discouraged. Not frowned upon. Illegal.
Drawing on 30+ years in the music industry, including real-world examples from his own Billboard #1 career, Terry explains:
How U.S. labor and antitrust law classify songwriters
Why owning a song and controlling it are two very different things
How compulsory licenses strip songwriters of the right to say no
Why publishers, PROs, and Congress—not creators—set the rules
Where live performance royalties break down (and often disappear)
And why the future of creator power depends on direct ownership, private portals, and cutting out intermediaries
This episode is about clarity, leverage, and practical survival in a system that was never designed to favor the inventor.
Key Topics CoveredWhy songwriter unions are illegal under U.S. antitrust law
The difference between copyright ownership and price control
What a song actually is (before publishers enter the picture)
Advances vs. income, and why publishing deals behave like credit cards
How administrative fees quietly eat up royalties worldwide
The real story behind compulsory licenses
A firsthand case study: pulling unauthorized uses of a #1 hit
Why live concert royalties are one of the least transparent systems in music
How Congress, the Copyright Royalty Board, and PROs shape songwriter income
Elon Musk, platform leverage, and the future battle over music pricing
Why artist-owned “home bases” are the most powerful path forward
How education changes your leverage with labels and publishers
Key TakeawaysSongwriters are independent rights holders, not employees, which blocks collective bargaining
Once a song is released, key rights are permanently restricted
Publishers and PROs do not equal songwriter representation
Transparency failures aren’t accidental, they’re structural
Ownership without control is not freedom
The future belongs to creators who own, leverage, streamline, and sustain from their own platforms
Memorable Quotes“Owning your song and controlling your song are two very different things.”
“The inventor is the only one in the system who isn’t allowed to set the price.”
“If you don’t like the cost of music, don’t use music. Don’t over-leverage it.”
“Spotify and TikTok should be billboards, not the destination.”
Action Steps for Songwriters & ArtistsUnderstand your rights before releasing music
Stop confusing advances with income
Audit where your royalties are actually coming from
Build a private, artist-owned home base
Use platforms as traffic, not dependency
Educate yourself before signing your next deal
Resources & Next StepsJoin the Sold for a Song community:TerranceSawchuk.com
Subscribe, rate, and review the podcast to help this message reach more creators
Share this episode with a songwriter who still believes “someone else is watching out for them”
About the HostTerrance “Terry” Sawchuk is a Billboard #1, multi-platinum songwriter, producer, and industry veteran with over three decades in the trenches. Sold for a Song exists to challenge the systems that undervalue creators—and to offer real pathways back to ownership, leverage, and sustainability.
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terrance Sawchuk sits down with legendary songwriter Mark Jordan, the creator of “Rhythm of My Heart” and a writer whose songs have been recorded by Diana Ross, Rod Stewart, Joe Cocker, Manhattan Transfer, Bonnie Raitt, Cher, and more.
Mark shares the untold story behind writing “Rhythm of My Heart,” his lifelong relationship with dyslexia before it was understood, and how neurodiversity became a creative advantage rather than a limitation. From CBC transcription sessions and LA studio legends to publishing blind spots and royalty realities, this conversation explores how value is created—and often lost—inside the music industry.
This episode goes beyond hit songs. It’s a deep, human conversation about creative identity, confidence, ownership, and the quiet cost creators pay when their work outpaces their self-worth. It also examines music’s healing power through Mark’s work in music therapy with first responders, reminding us why music matters far beyond charts and market share.
TakeawaysDyslexia and neurodiversity can be powerful creative strengths
Writing a hit does not guarantee understanding or ownership of value
Publishing systems often separate creators from awareness and control
Creative confidence is shaped early—and can be reclaimed later
Music’s value extends far beyond commercial success
Direct creative integrity leads to longevity
Industry myths often hide structural inequities
Ownership and self-worth are deeply connected
Music has measurable healing and therapeutic impact
True success comes from alignment, not just accolades
TitlesWriting “Rhythm of My Heart” & the Hidden Cost of a Hit
Dyslexia, Creativity, and Reclaiming Artistic Worth
Sound Bites“Dyslexia isn’t a flaw—it’s my superpower.”
“You can write a worldwide hit and still be disconnected from your value.”
“Music heals people long before it pays them.”
Chapters00:00 Writing “Rhythm of My Heart”05:48 Dyslexia, Confidence, and Creative Identity12:30 Early Career, CBC, and Learning by Ear20:10 LA Studios, Publishing, and Industry Blind Spots31:40 Rod Stewart, Hits, and the Cost of Success41:55 Music Therapy and Healing Through Song53:20 Reclaiming Worth, Ownership, and Longevity
Keywordsmusic industry, songwriting, Rhythm of My Heart, Mark Jordan, dyslexia, neurodiversity, creative worth, publishing, ownership, royalties, music therapy, artist sustainability, creative confidence, Sold 4 a Song
Sold 4 a Song™ PodcastHosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, and entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music—inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of 'Sold for a Song', Terry Sawchuk discusses the evolving landscape of the music industry, emphasizing the importance of artists owning their copyright and data. He reflects on the past year, highlights key guests, and addresses the impact of AI on music creation and artist-fan relationships. Looking ahead to 2026, he shares his upcoming projects aimed at empowering creatives and raising awareness about the true value of music.TakeawaysArtists must own their copyright and data to thrive.Monetizing directly and leveraging art is crucial.Empowering artists is essential for creative success.AI will significantly impact the music industry.Direct relationships with fans are vital for artists.Ownership and sustainability are key for future artists.The true value of music is often undervalued.Feedback indicates a broader appeal for my upcoming book.New projects aim to highlight music's societal value.Building a community of support for artists is important.TitlesEmpowering Artists in the Digital AgeReflections on 2025: A Year in ReviewSound bites"AI will transform the music industry.""Thank you for joining me today!""Let's build this movement together."Chapters00:00 Empowering Artists in the Digital Age02:48 Reflections on 2025: A Year in Review06:09 The Future of Music: AI and Artist Relationships08:50 Ownership and Sustainability for Creatives11:45 Looking Ahead: New Projects and Goals for 2026
Keywordsmusic industry, artists, copyright, AI, sustainability, ownership, creativity, fan relationships, digital age, music therapy
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode, Terry sits down with Dr. Concetta “Connie” Tomaino — co-founder and Executive Director of the Institute for Music and Neurologic Function (IMNF) — for a mind-opening conversation on the true value of music far beyond streaming numbers.
They break down how music actually engages the brain, why rhythm can restore movement in Parkinson’s, how songs can “wake up” memory in dementia, and how music therapy helps veterans and trauma survivors access what words can’t. Then Terry connects it back to the core mission of Sold 4 a Song: the painful irony that the people who create the world’s most powerful healing tool are often the ones least valued inside the ecosystem built around it — and why access to music therapy should be reimbursed and available to everyone.
To go deeper, join Terry at TerranceSawchuk.com
👉 Watch for announcements for my Free Webinar coming in January 2026.
Keywords
music therapy, neuroscience, mental health, creativity, neurodiversity, music industry, healing, brain function, emotional connection, artist empowerment
Summary
In this episode of 'Sold for a Song', host Taren Saczek engages with Dr. Concetta Tomeino, a pioneer in music therapy, discussing the profound impact of music on mental health and neurological function. They explore the evolution of music therapy, its applications in treating various conditions, and the importance of recognizing the value of music creators in society. The conversation delves into the neuroscience behind music, the therapeutic techniques used in music therapy, and the challenges faced by artists in the industry. Dr. Tomeino emphasizes the need for greater accessibility to music therapy and the economic value of music in enhancing well-being.
Takeaways
Music therapy needs to be accessible to everyone.The field of music therapy originated in the 1950s.Music engages almost every part of the brain.Music can help individuals with PTSD and cognitive impairments.Therapeutic music experiences can enhance recovery and function.Neurodiversity plays a significant role in creativity.Music can evoke strong emotional responses and memories.The economic value of music creators is often undervalued.Music therapy can improve mental health and well-being.Artists have a unique role in nurturing creativity in society.
Titles
Unlocking the Healing Power of Music TherapyThe Neuroscience Behind Music and Healing
Sound bites
"We need to get the word out.""Music therapy is a profession.""Music has power in healing."
Chapters
00:00 The Value of Music Therapy06:07 Introduction to Dr. Concetta Tomeino11:46 The Evolution of Music Therapy20:04 Understanding Music's Impact on the Brain30:11 Music Therapy Techniques and Applications40:07 Neurodiversity and Creativity50:03 The Economic Value of Music and Artists
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In this episode of Sold For A Song, Terry Sawchuk discusses the undervaluation of music creators and the impact of AI on the music industry. He emphasizes the need for musicians to recognize their worth and leverage technology to reclaim control over their careers. The conversation highlights the challenges posed by AI, the exploitation of session musicians, and the importance of using technology to empower artists rather than diminish their value.
Takeaways
Empowering artists is crucial for redefining creative success.Musicians must awaken their self-worth to thrive.AI is changing the landscape of the music industry.Session musicians are facing unprecedented challenges due to AI.Technology should be leveraged to benefit creators.Musicians need to create their own platforms for lessons.The music industry is monopolized by a few major players.AI companies are profiting from the work of musicians without compensation.Musicians should reverse engineer technology for their advantage.Building a community of empowered creators is essential.
Titles
Reclaiming Value in the Music IndustryThe AI Revolution: Threat or Opportunity for Musicians?
Sound bites
"Why am I on your website?""AI is an absolute game changer.""Let's build this movement together."
Chapters
00:00 Empowering Music Creators01:46 The Impact of AI on Musicians08:38 Leveraging Technology for Musicians
Keywords
music industry, songwriters, AI, musicians, technology, empowerment, creativity, copyright, session musicians, music lessons
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry Sawchuk breaks down the AI Wild West currently reshaping the music industry — and who is really benefiting from it.
Terry exposes how AI platforms like Suno allegedly trained their models using music scraped from YouTube without permission, reached billion-dollar valuations, and were ultimately rewarded with licensing deals from major labels like Warner Music. Meanwhile, actual songwriters and artists are told by PROs that using “too much AI” could disqualify them from performance royalties.
This episode confronts the glaring double standard: AI companies can profit from creators’ work at scale, but creators themselves remain restricted, underpaid, and over-controlled. Terry explains how market power, ownership concentration, and pro-rata payment systems continue to suffocate artists — and why the flood of AI-generated music only accelerates the problem.
He closes by teasing artist-first solutions designed to reverse-engineer the system — where creators own their data, control their IP, and finally reclaim leverage in an industry built on undervaluation.
TakeawaysAI companies are being rewarded for actions artists would be penalized for
Major labels prioritize market share over creator protection
PRO rules around AI create a double standard for songwriters
AI is drastically increasing music saturation on DSPs
Artists are more lost in the shuffle than ever before
Ownership and leverage — not exposure — determine power
Major labels control most IP, limiting artist agency
The industry is designed to extract value from creators
Artist-owned platforms are no longer optional
The future belongs to creators who control data, IP, and audience
TitlesThe AI Wild West: Who Really Wins in Music’s New Gold Rush?Why AI Companies Get Paid — and Songwriters Don’t
Sound Bites“We’ve got value going once, truth going twice.”“They stole the music, built the platform, and got rewarded.”“It’s okay for AI companies — but not the creators they took from.”“Artists are always the ones being over-leveraged.”“Welcome to the Wild West.”
Chapters00:00 Value, truth, and the mission of Sold 4 a Song02:39 How AI music models were trained05:02 Warner’s deal with AI and what it signals07:25 Why artists are more buried than ever08:45 Reclaiming leverage through artist-first systems
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this Thanksgiving special episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry Sawchuk speaks directly to music fans and creators alike, pulling back the curtain on why being a songwriter in the United States is anything but a free-market profession.
Terry explains how intermediaries — from Live Nation and Ticketmaster to DSPs and social platforms — control market share, inflate costs for fans, and extract the lion’s share of revenue while creators earn fractions of a penny. He walks listeners through how streaming royalties actually work, why songwriters make hundreds instead of tens of thousands where they once did, and how record labels reshaped streaming economics in their favor before Spotify was even allowed into the U.S. market.
The episode also explores a rarely discussed issue: the absence of a songwriter union, the centralized power of the U.S. Copyright Board, and how government-controlled royalty rates eliminate true market dynamics for creators. Terry contrasts this with how songwriters are paid internationally, particularly for live performances and film music.
At its heart, this episode is about bridging artists and fans directly — restoring connection, transparency, and value by bypassing gatekeepers. Terry closes by expressing gratitude to listeners and reaffirming that the future of music depends on ownership, direct relationships, and creator-controlled platforms.
Takeaways
There is no true free market for songwriters in the U.S.
Fans and artists both want connection — intermediaries disrupt it
Live Nation operates as a near-total monopoly in live music
Streaming payouts heavily favor master owners over songwriters
A million Spotify streams can earn songwriters only hundreds of dollars
Major labels reshaped streaming economics before launch
Social platforms monetize artists and fans as the product
Songwriters lack union protection unlike other entertainment roles
Many U.S. performance royalties never reach creators
Direct artist-to-fan relationships restore value and sustainability
Titles
Why Songwriting Isn’t a Free Market — and Never Has BeenA Thanksgiving Thank You to the Fans (And the Truth About Music Money)
Sound Bites
“There is nothing free market about being a songwriter.”“Fans and artists are both looking for connection.”“The middlemen control the experience — and the money.”“You can’t cash likes at a bank.”“Nobody leaves the driveway until someone writes a song.”
Chapters
00:00 The myth of the free market for songwriters02:37 Bridging artists and fans04:55 Live Nation, Ticketmaster, and market control07:18 Streaming economics explained11:55 Why songwriters earn the least14:23 Copyright control and government-set royalties16:45 Why U.S. songwriters miss live performance pay18:30 Gratitude to fans & closing reflections
If today’s episode lit a fire in you, don’t let it fade.Subscribe to Sold 4 a Song, leave a review, and share this episode with someone who needs to hear it.Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
Keywords
songwriters, music industry, free market, Live Nation, Ticketmaster, Spotify, royalties, artists and fans, music monopolies, copyright board, PROs, streaming economics, creative ownership
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In this landmark episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry sits down with legendary investigative journalist and author Fredric Dannen, whose book The Hit Men ripped the lid off payola, mafia influence, and systemic corruption inside the record business.
Fredric walks through the origin story of The Hit Men: how an innocuous business assignment on PolyGram led to Dick Asher’s shocking Pink Floyd “Another Brick in the Wall” experiment, the rise of independent promoters known as The Network, and how major labels effectively created an extortion machine that controlled radio airplay. He recounts Clive Davis’ attempts to block the book’s release, the legal battles that followed, and how one threatened lawsuit actually helped send the book to the New York Times bestseller list — “Thank you, Clive.”
The conversation dives into the darker corners of music history: the mob-connected promotion ecosystem, figures like Morris Levy, the pay-to-play reality behind Pink Floyd, The Who, Loverboy, and Michael Jackson’s Thriller era… and the uncomfortable role artists themselves sometimes played in fueling the system. Fredric shares the now-famous Maurice White quote — “Don’t make me your crusade” — and how that crystallized the tension between moral outrage and survival for artists.
From there, Terry and Fredric zoom out into cultural loss and censorship: race records, the R&B label slapped on Michael Jackson’s Off the Wall purely because of skin color, the disappearing tradition of truly society-shifting songs (“Strange Fruit,” “Born in the U.S.A.,” “Fight the Power”), and the way both government and corporate power still suppress and reshape creative expression. Fredric also explains how The Hit Men helped inspire Eliot Spitzer’s later payola crackdown — proof that one book really can change the system.
The episode closes on Fredric’s life in Mexico, his bilingual theater company La Troupe Mexico, the San Miguel Playhouse, his ongoing work for Billboard, and a new miniseries he’s writing set in 19th-century Mexico. It’s a masterclass in how one truth-teller can impact music, law, culture, and justice — and a reminder of why creators need to understand the game above the game.
TakeawaysThe Hit Men remains the definitive inside account of music industry corruption
Independent promoters (“The Network”) wielded power not just to get records played, but to block airplay
Major labels built and funded the very extortion system that later threatened them
Global hits by Pink Floyd, The Who, and Loverboy were manipulated through payola-style schemes
Artists often felt forced to participate: “Don’t make me your crusade — I only have one career”
Race and genre labeling (“race records,” “rhythm and blues”) were historically tied to skin color, not sound
Cultural protest songs once shifted society in ways today’s landscape rarely allows
The Hit Men helped inspire Eliot Spitzer’s later payola investigation as Attorney General
Fredric’s obsession with justice has freed wrongly convicted people and reshaped his life
Art, journalism, theater, and songwriting remain powerful tools for exposing systems — if we dare to tell the truth
TitlesThe Hit Men, the Mob, and the Music Industry’s Dark SecretFredric Dannen on Payola, Power, and the Price of Telling the Truth
Sound Bites“You think you’re just writing a book — then you find out it changed the law.”“There is power in being able to keep a record off the air.”“Don’t make me your crusade. I only have one career.”“If you can do that to Pink Floyd and The Who, you can do it to anyone.”“Songwriting is one of the greatest art forms in human history.”
Chapters00:55 Sold 4 a Song intro & why this conversation matters02:50 How The Hit Men was born — from chemicals to corruption04:41 Dick Asher, Pink Floyd, and the “Another Brick in the Wall” experiment06:06 The Network, independent promotion, and mafia ties14:27 Payola history: from $50 handshakes to full-scale extortion19:10 Morris Levy, trials, wiretaps, and “Terrible!”23:06 Major labels, rock & roll, and why indies couldn’t survive30:46 Race records, R&B, and the categorization of Black artists34:10 Thriller, Frank DiLeo, Al Sharpton, and the Jackson tour39:38 Justice, banned books, and censorship from both sides44:11 Revenge of the Green Dragons and the limits of adaptation46:07 Why The Hit Men should be a series — and how Vinyl got it wrong47:50 Eliot Spitzer, revived payola cases, and real-world impact49:56 Cultural loss, protest songs, and the value of music53:09 Life in Mexico, La Troupe Mexico & San Miguel Playhouse55:30 New projects, miniseries, and closing reflections
Keywordsmusic industry, payola, The Hit Men, Fredric Dannen, mafia, independent promotion, Pink Floyd, Michael Jackson, Al Sharpton, Clive Davis, Earth Wind & Fire, race records, rhythm and blues, censorship, justice, San Miguel de Allende, theater, Billboard
📚 Buy The Hit Men here:👉 https://a.co/d/4WcT7OR
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this first-ever video episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry pulls back the curtain on just how frighteningly easy it is to create a full song using AI — in real time.
Using the AI platform Suno, Terry demonstrates step-by-step how anyone can generate a “world-class-sounding” track in minutes. He starts with a simple, ridiculous concept— a Motown-style uptempo song about his two cats, Tomato and Tomato, who beg for food and treats all day — and shows how quickly AI turns a basic text prompt into a fully produced track with vocals, horns, backing vocals, and artwork.
Along the way, Terry explains how AI lyric handling works, how prompts shape style and arrangement, and how you can remix, change singers, adjust instrumentation, and even export stems (drums, bass, keys, vocals, etc.) for further editing in a DAW like Pro Tools. The point isn’t the cat song — it’s that this level of speed and quality is now available to anyone with an internet connection.
Terry then zooms out to the bigger issue: the flood of AI-generated music. He cites Deezer reporting roughly 20,000 fully AI songs per day, and notes those tracks already represent 1–4% of the global market — and that’s just one DSP. He contrasts the ease of AI creation with the realities of the royalty system, highlighting recent decisions by SOCAN, ASCAP, and BMI not to pay performance royalties on songs that are 100% AI-generated, unless there is meaningful human authorship in lyrics or melody.
The episode closes with the core question facing every modern creator:To AI or not to AI?Will you ignore it and risk getting buried, or adopt it as a tool without surrendering your creative worth?
TakeawaysIt is now shockingly simple to generate a full song with AI in minutes
Platforms like Suno can create music from a plain-text prompt — lyrics, arrangement, vocals, and artwork
AI tools allow detailed control over style, tempo, vibe, and even “weirdness”
You can export stems and finish production in a DAW using your own sounds and taste
DSPs are now flooded with tens of thousands of fully AI tracks every day
AI music already makes up a measurable percentage of the global market
PROs like SOCAN, ASCAP, and BMI will not pay performance royalties on fully AI songs
To qualify for royalties, there must be human-created elements (melody, lyrics, etc.)
Ignoring AI entirely may leave artists lost in the shuffle
The real power is in AI-assisted creativity — not outsourcing your entire artistry
TitlesTo AI or Not to AI: How Easy Is It to Make a Song Now?My Cats Have a Record Deal: Inside the AI Music Explosion
Sound Bites“That’s literally how easy it is to create a song now with AI.”“My two cats could have their own solo career if I uploaded this today.”“If you’re not incorporating AI somehow, you’re going to get left behind.”“You can’t even get performance royalties on a fully AI song.”“To AI or not to AI — that is the decision.”
Chapters00:00 First video episode & why Terry’s showing AI in action01:30 How many AI songs hit DSPs every day (Deezer and beyond)02:22 Setting up the Suno prompt: a Motown song about Tomato & Tomato04:46 First AI attempts & fixing the lyric handling06:39 Listening back: “world-class” cat songs in minutes07:36 Versions, remixes, and swapping singers with AI09:00 Stems, Pro Tools, and combining AI with human production10:30 From AI file to DSP upload and release11:30 SOCAN / ASCAP / BMI stance on fully AI songs12:30 The Wild West: human vs AI authorship & what gets paid13:15 To AI or not to AI — where do you stand as a creator?
KeywordsAI music, Suno, DSPs, Deezer, Spotify, Apple Music, song creation, stems, Pro Tools, songwriting, music industry, performance royalties, SOCAN, ASCAP, BMI, creative ownership, technology, automation
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry delivers one of the hardest—but most necessary—truths for creatives: no one is coming to save you.
Terry dismantles the myth that record labels, managers, agents, or social media algorithms will discover and “rescue” artists who haven’t yet put in the work. Drawing from decades inside the music industry, he explains that even in the so-called “old days” of artist development, gatekeepers still only amplified artists who were already moving people—through their songs, their performances, and their presence.
He challenges creators to shift their focus away from vanity metrics like streams, follows, and playlists, and back toward the fundamentals: Is your music actually moving people? Are you entertaining? Are you telling a story that makes fans want to show up, pay attention, and share? Terry makes the case that audience behavior—buying tickets, merch, emails, and evangelizing on your behalf—is the only metric that truly matters.
Using vivid examples from writer’s rounds in Nashville, world-class artists who still fail to connect, and a sharp Dave Chappelle analogy (“I’m wearing all the right shit—why am I not getting into the club?”), Terry underscores that talent alone isn’t enough. Connection is currency.
The episode closes with a reframing: true success comes when artists stop trying to be chosen and instead focus on awakening themselves—then sharing that awakening to move others. That’s the game above the game.
TakeawaysNo label, manager, agent, or A&R is coming to save you
Even historically, artists were expected to do the work first
Analytics didn’t change the game—expectations did
Followers and streams don’t equal connection or value
Music and live performance must move people
Audience behavior (tickets, merch, sharing) is the real metric
Collaborating with people better than you accelerates growth
Repetition is not the same as progress
Entertainment value matters as much as songwriting skill
Artists win when they stop chasing validation and start creating impact
TitlesNo One Is Coming to Save You (And Why That’s Good News)If You’re Not Moving People, Nothing Else Matters
Sound Bites“No one is coming to save you.”“If you’re not moving people, that’s a metric.”“You’re focused on trying to make it—not make it better.”“Fans will tell you with their money and their presence.”“Don’t forget to actually entertain us.”
Chapters00:00 Why moving people is the real metric01:09 The Sold 4 a Song mission02:15 The myth of being ‘discovered’03:20 Why gatekeepers want you to do the work04:10 Analytics vs actual artist development05:33 Dave Chappelle, feedback, and truth06:30 Collaboration, markets, and putting in the work07:56 Entertainers vs artists—and choosing your path09:15 Repetition vs real progress10:45 Audience behavior as the only metric12:00 The game above the game
Keywordsmusic artists, live performance, songwriting, artist development, entertainment value, audience connection, self-worth, music industry, A&R, managers, agents, collaboration, creativity, metrics, fan engagement
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry goes straight at a mindset that quietly kills more music careers than bad deals or bad luck ever will: entitlement.
He contrasts entitlement with accountability, and breaks down why so many artists feel “slept on” when, in reality, they haven’t yet done the hard work of mastery, clarity, and connection. Terry uses Russell Brunson’s Hook / Story / Offer framework to help artists see their careers through a marketing lens:
Hook – Are you capturing attention?
Story – Are you telling your story in a way that lets fans see themselves in it?
Offer – Does your music, performance, and world actually deliver an emotional payoff?
Terry argues that most artists are chasing validation, not improvement—trying to “make it” instead of trying to “make it better.” If people aren’t connecting, it’s not the algorithm’s fault, your city’s fault, or your mom’s fault. It’s feedback.
He then gets personal, dismantling the “you’re just lucky” narrative by sharing the real cost of his Nashville journey: cashing in his RRSP (like a 401k), coming down with almost no safety net, paying thousands for visas and a green card, and moving with what he now calls a terrible game plan—but relentless commitment.
From there, Terry explores:
Why confidence is the byproduct of courage (via Dan Sullivan)
How victimhood, comparison, and blame steal your time, energy, and creativity
The brutal truth that your bank account is telling you a story—and you need to listen
Why lifelong “lifers” in music keep going regardless of external validation
He closes by challenging artists to audit their careers with radical honesty—no self-shaming, just data—and to recognize that the universe will always mirror what they’re actually putting out into the world.
Key TakeawaysNo one is coming to save you. Industry people amplify momentum; they don’t create it for you.
Exposure doesn’t fix weak foundations; it only magnifies what already exists.
If fans can’t see themselves in your story, that’s your communication problem, not their failure.
Hook / Story / Offer applies to artists as much as entrepreneurs.
Entitlement says “I deserve success because I’m talented.” Accountability asks “Where am I missing something?”
Your bank account is one of the clearest metrics of whether your art is converting into value.
Victim mentality and comparison will quietly ruin your career faster than a bad contract.
Confidence doesn’t come first—courage does. Confidence shows up on the other side of action.
The artists we celebrate are almost never the ones with entitlement in their internal dialogue.
The universe (and your audience) will mirror exactly what you are putting out—energetically and creatively.
Suggested Episode TitlesEntitlement vs Accountability: Why No One Is Coming to Save Your Career
You’re Not “Unlucky” — You’re Unaccountable
Sound Bites“You’re focused on trying to make it instead of trying to make it better.”
“If people aren’t connecting, maybe you’re not giving them a place to find themselves in your music.”
“Being an artist isn’t a title you give yourself. It’s earned by how deeply your work moves people.”
“Yeah, I’m lucky. I cashed in my retirement, had no money, and paid nineteen grand for visas and a green card.”
“Confidence is the byproduct of courage. The confidence is waiting for you on the other side of effort.”
“The universe will come back and mirror what you’re putting out into the world.”
Chapters00:00 – “Yeah, I’m lucky…” – Terry’s real Nashville origin story01:18 – Show intro: Sold 4 a Song mission & lens of self-worth02:10 – Entitlement vs accountability: why this conversation matters03:40 – Hook / Story / Offer – applying Russell Brunson to artists04:40 – Exposure doesn’t fix weak songs, weak shows, or weak stories05:30 – Fans need to find themselves in your music06:15 – When your hook, story, or offer is broken07:00 – Entitlement says “I deserve”; accountability says “I’m missing something”07:56 – Artist vs entertainer: history decides, not you08:50 – Your bank account is telling you a story—are you listening?09:40 – Not a beat-yourself-up session: how to analyze like a pro10:39 – “I’m not lucky like you” – Terry dismantles the myth with real numbers11:45 – 18 years in Toronto, blind move to the U.S., terrible plan, relentless commitment12:40 – Steven Tyler, victim mentality, and the line that hit Terry like a truck13:50 – Dan Sullivan: confidence as the byproduct of courage14:40 – How to catch yourself in entitlement: complaints, blame, comparison15:09 – Final reminder: the universe mirrors what you put out
Episode Keywordsmusic career, entitlement, accountability, artist mindset, Nashville, hook story offer, Russell Brunson, Dan Sullivan, victim mentality, self-worth, creative courage, artist development, songwriter life, DIY artists, music industry reality
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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In this episode of Sold 4 a Song, Terry tackles one of the most misunderstood—and most exploited—ideas in the music business: being “unique.”
He opens with a classic, brutally honest “music industry haiku” using Bob Dylan to illustrate how the industry endlessly chases originality… then immediately tries to standardize it, replicate it, and replace it. Labels search for “the next Bob Dylan,” then a younger Bob Dylan—until even Bob Dylan himself becomes unrecognizable to the system that once needed him.
Terry argues that while the industry operates on market share, creators cannot. Artists who chase trends, comparisons, or approval end up disconnected from the only real leverage they have—their unique human blueprint. With over 11 million artists on Spotify, the paradox is this: you have zero competition if you are truly yourself.
The conversation deepens through insights from Dr. Bruce Lipton, shared via a Tony Robbins podcast, exploring how most people live 95% of their lives based on subconscious programming installed by age seven. Terry connects this science to creativity—explaining how fear, conformity, and “malware” thinking suppress authenticity, while movement, action, and consciousness awaken it.
For creators, this revelation becomes liberation. Trauma, stories, and lived experience aren’t weaknesses—they’re the raw material for songs. Artists become the first listener, channeling truth back into the world, awakening something in others through honest expression.
The episode closes with a powerful reframe: you don’t compete with noise—you transcend it. By turning inward, rejecting comparison, and embracing your unapologetic self, you become “unique… just like everybody else.”
Key TakeawaysThe music industry chases originality—but only at scale
Labels care about market share; creators must care about truth
With millions of artists online, authenticity eliminates competition
Imposter syndrome is a byproduct of suppressed uniqueness
95% of behavior is driven by early subconscious programming
Environment and beliefs influence creativity and expression
Trauma and life experiences often become the most powerful songs
Artists act as conduits—becoming the first listener
You don’t compete with trends; you turn inward and create
True sustainability comes from unapologetic originality
Suggested Episode TitlesI Just Want to Be Unique Like Everyone ElseWhy Chasing “The Next Bob Dylan” Kills Creativity
Sound Bites“Who is this Bob Dylan? … Who the hell is Bob Dylan?”“You have zero competition if you’re actually yourself.”“Labels operate on market share. Artists can’t.”“Your DNA is a library of blueprints—you choose which ones get read.”“You don’t compete with noise. You transcend it.”
Chapters00:00 The Bob Dylan haiku & industry obsession with sameness01:00 Welcome to Sold 4 a Song02:15 Imposter syndrome and creative resistance03:20 Why artists truly have no competition04:45 Market share vs creative truth05:46 Dr. Bruce Lipton, programming, and consciousness07:58 Trauma, songs, and becoming the first listener09:10 Authenticity as creative leverage10:30 Why you never compete—only turn inward11:40 Unique, just like everybody else
Episode Keywordsauthenticity, uniqueness, Bob Dylan, music industry mindset, creativity, imposter syndrome, artist identity, Dr. Bruce Lipton, consciousness, epigenetics, self-worth, creative purpose, originality, artist development
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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aIn this foundational solo episode, Terry pulls back the curtain on who he is, where he came from, and why Sold 4 a Song exists at all—especially now, in the age of streaming and AI.
He starts with a clear mission: to put power and value back into the minds, hearts, and hands of creators, at a pivotal historical moment where AI and platforms are poised to strip even more leverage from songwriters and artists. If artists don’t act now, Terry warns, their ownership and value may slip away in ways that will be almost impossible to recover.
From there, he walks through his journey:
Growing up in Espanola, Ontario, a pulp-and-paper town filled with music, family jam sessions, French folk songs, and country tunes.
Discovering songwriting at 16 on his grandmother’s piano, locking himself in the basement for years and logging only 14 days outside over a two-year span that weren’t school or work.
Attending Harris Institute in Toronto, getting placed at Arnyard Studios, and cutting his teeth with producer Arnold Lanni and engineer Michael Jack / Michael Saracini.
Recording a small band called As If that would eventually become Our Lady Peace, going on to make the Naveed and Clumsy albums.
Forming The Miller Stain Limit, signing a deal with Universal, and then getting dropped—learning brutally that “success” can evaporate overnight.
Re-learning the craft in the Pro Tools era at Silver Birch Studios, working with multicultural artists from all over the world and soaking up Arabic, African, Russian, and reggae traditions—realizing how deeply music is tied to culture, food, religion, and story.
Writing with a young Alanis Morissette, having songs considered for Jagged Little Pill, and only later realizing how profoundly that experience shaped his career and lens on value and ownership.
Terry then chronicles his move to Nashville: the three-year visa clock, the financial strain, and the uphill climb to be seen as a songwriter in a town that doesn’t care what you’ve done elsewhere—only what you can do in the room today.
The turning point comes with “Barefoot Blue Jean Night”:co-writing it with Eric Paslay and Dylan Altman, broke and almost out of runway, making a “scrappy” demo in his apartment with a laptop, a $100 mic, and $60 computer speakers. Instead of playing it safe, Terry leans into his Toronto “no rules” background: building a hooky drum groove using Stylus RMX gospel stomps and claps, adding R&B/808 textures, creating a drum hook as strong as the chorus itself.
That rough, unconventional demo is what gets Jake Owen’s attention. Producer Joey Moi recreates the feel for the master, and the song explodes—changing Jake’s life and Terry’s, and ultimately securing Terry’s U.S. green card.
From there, Terry moves into film/TV work (including placements like Mad Max), navigates divorce and burnout, and eventually has to fall back in love with music again. In that process, a new question emerges: How do I give back? He realizes he’s now fighting for “the previous version” of himself—the underdog creator who keeps getting undervalued.
That leads him into the deeper history behind the phrase “sold for a song”:
Tracing it back through Shakespeare (All’s Well That Ends Well: “sold a goodly manor for a song”).
Even further to Queen Elizabeth I, Edmund Spenser’s performance of The Faerie Queene, and Lord Burleigh’s legendary complaint: “All this for a song?” when the Queen ordered Spenser be richly paid.
The literal definition—“very cheaply, especially for less than something is worth”—becomes the backbone of Terry’s brand: a symbolic mirror of how creators have been treated for hundreds of years, long before streaming, PROs, or TikTok.
The episode closes by tying everything back to AI, ownership, and the future. Terry lays out his core mission and framework:
Worth & Value – Remember who you are and what your work is truly worth
Leverage – Use tools and tech to your advantage, not the other way around
Streamline – Design systems that buy back your time and focus
Sustain – Build a career that lasts, without selling the core of who you are
Through his upcoming book, Sold 4 a Song Artist Accelerator, and private portal, Terry is committed to going toe-to-toe with the music industry—on behalf of creators—at this critical inflection point.
Key TakeawaysThe undervaluing of creators predates Spotify by centuries
You can come from a tiny mill town and still shape global records
Scrappy, honest demos can change your entire life
Burnout and victim mentality are common—but survivable
“Sold for a song” is not just a phrase; it’s a pattern we must break
AI can either be a tool for creators or another layer of exploitation
The path forward is Worth → Leverage → Streamline → Sustain
The time to reclaim ownership is right now, not “once things settle”
Suggested Episode TitlesWhy I Built Sold 4 a Song (and Why It Matters Now More Than Ever)From Barefoot Blue Jean Night to the AI Era: My Journey & My Fight
Sound Bites“My goal is to put power and value back into the minds and hearts of creatives.”“We should be leveraging technology—not being leveraged by it.”“I grew up in a tiny pulp-and-paper town and somehow ended up writing hits and fighting for creators.”“‘Sold for a song’ literally means being paid far less than you’re worth. That’s been our reality for centuries.”“If we don’t act now in the AI era, I don’t know if we’ll ever get our leverage back.”
Chapters00:00 Cold open – the real reason Terry is doing this01:01 Welcome to Sold 4 a Song02:30 Why this solo episode, why now03:03 Streaming, AI, and the most leveraged generation of creators ever04:00 Growing up musical in Espanola, Ontario05:10 Discovering songwriting at 16 and living at the piano06:00 Harris Institute, Arnyard Studios, and early studio years07:30 As If → Our Lady Peace, Naveed and Clumsy07:50 The Miller Stain Limit and a short-lived major label deal09:00 Pro Tools, multicultural Toronto, and chasing the origins of music11:51 The move to Nashville and starting over again14:04 Writing “Barefoot Blue Jean Night” and the broke-apartment demo18:26 The Stylus RMX drum hook and Jake Owen cut20:32 Film/TV era, Mad Max, divorce, and burnout21:30 Realizing it’s time to give back to “previous you”22:43 The origin of “sold for a song” and centuries of undervaluation24:10 Why worth, leverage, streamline, sustain are the new non-negotiables24:40 AI, ownership, and why the clock is ticking25:00 Book, accelerator, and Terry’s promise to go to war for creators
Episode KeywordsAI and music, creator ownership, songwriter leverage, streaming era, artist accelerator, Barefoot Blue Jean Night, Our Lady Peace, Alanis Morissette, underpaid creators, “sold for a song” origin, Nashville journey, sync & film/TV, artist worth, Claiming your value, creator revolution.
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
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Oscar-nominated, Grammy-winning songwriter/producer Dennis Matkosky (Diana Ross, Flashdance, Al Jarreau, Boz Scaggs, Keith Urban, LeAnn Rimes) sits down with host Terrance Sawchuk to drop a masterclass on creative longevity and business ownership. From writing “Maniac” in 15 minutes and tailoring it for Flashdance with Phil Ramone, to the long road behind Keith Urban’s “You’ll Think of Me,” to discovering and championing HARDY, Dennis shares hard-won lessons on belief, persistence, and treating yourself like the CEO of your art. We get into LA vs. Nashville, film/TV cuts, admin vs. ownership, AI and streamlining, and the new “blue ocean” model where artists own code, data, and distribution.
If you’re a songwriter, artist, or producer who’s ready to stop waiting for permission and start running your career like a business, this one’s a gem.
What You’ll LearnThe real story behind “Maniac” and how lyrics were reshaped for Flashdance
Why great songs are timeless—but cuts are all about timing
Admin deals vs. publishing ownership (and when each makes sense)
How Dennis evaluates and develops talent (and why HARDY bends genres)
The mindset shift: artists as CEOs—and how to build leverage
How AI can streamline the boring stuff so you can create more
Blue-ocean strategies for an artist-owned future (own your portal, data, and distribution)
GuestDennis Matkosky — Oscar-nominated, Grammy-winning songwriter/producer. Credits include Diana Ross (“Mirror, Mirror”), Michael Sembello (“Maniac”), Al Jarreau, Boz Scaggs (“Heart of Mine”), LeAnn Rimes (“I Need You”), Keith Urban (“You’ll Think of Me”), Chicago, and more. Co-founder at Relative Music Group.
Follow Dennis:
https://www.relativemusicgroup.com/
https://www.facebook.com/dmatkosky
https://www.instagram.com/dennis_matkosky/
Links & ResourcesRelative Music Group: relativemusicgroup.com
Pull Quotes“You’re the CEO of your company. Don’t hand away the 2% you can control.” — Dennis
“Great songs are timeless; getting them cut is all timing.” — Terrance
“Own the code. Own the data. Own the distribution.” — Terrance
Chapter Guide (optional)00:00 Opening riff — Artists as CEOs02:55 Dennis’s early years (Philly roots, Sembello, jazz)05:50 “Maniac” genesis → Flashdance with Phil Ramone12:10 Grammy/Oscar season and stiff competition13:00 Writing/producing for Boz Scaggs, Al Jarreau, Chicago18:45 LA sessions → film/TV → Nashville move20:20 “I Need You” (LeAnn Rimes) and pitching strategy23:40 “You’ll Think of Me” (Keith Urban) — the long game26:05 Spotting HARDY and bending the genre30:35 Ownership, leverage, and the artist-as-CEO mindset37:20 Algorithms, radio, and the new release reality39:40 Blue-ocean playbook for artist-owned futures44:20 AI for streamlining creative businesses45:55 Dennis’s upcoming book & parting wisdom
TagsSongwriting, Music Business, Ownership, Publishing, Sync, Nashville, Flashdance, HARDY, Keith Urban, LeAnn Rimes, Creativity, AI for Creators, Independent Artists, Relative Music Group, Terrance Sawchuk
Sold 4 a Song™ Podcast hosted by Terrance Sawchuk, Billboard #1 multi-platinum songwriter, producer, artist, mixer, & entrepreneur.
Sold 4 a Song™ is a living exploration of creative worth, ownership, and the true value of music — inside the systems that monetize it.
If this episode resonates, you can follow the work at sold4asong.com.
- Visa fler
