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In this episode of Ruminations, we sit down with registered dietician and author Diana Rodgers to discuss her recent peer-reviewed paper on the nutritional benefits of animal-sourced foods. We delve into the challenges and biases she faced in getting her research published and break down common misconceptions about meat consumption. The conversation covers detailed nutritional information, the importance of protein, iron, zinc, B12, and the environmental and ethical aspects of meat production. Additionally, Diana shares her personal journey and announces her shift towards a new chapter in life centered around art and community.
+++ALL EPISODES: 👉 https://savory.global/podcastJOIN THE COMMUNITY + GET MEMBERS-ONLY PERKS: 👉 https://savory.global/memberGET INVOLVED WITH SAVORY INSTITUTE: 👉 https://savory.global/find-your-path+++TIME STAMPS:00:00 Intro
05:25 Challenges in Nutrition and Dietetics
14:32 Understanding Scientific Studies
23:56 Nutritional Benefits of Red Meat
33:59 Protein Intake and Dietary Recommendations
45:10 Exploring Protein Needs for Older Adults
46:31 Challenges in Publishing Nutrition Research
48:12 Historical Roots of Anti-Meat Bias
54:30 Nutritional Benefits of Red Meat
01:04:50 Debunking Anti-Meat Arguments
01:18:23 Advice for Vegetarians and Vegans
01:23:28 Transitioning to a New Chapter
01:27:10 Final Thoughts and Resources
+++This episode is brought to you by Savory Institute’s Regenerating Members, a global community committed to restoring grasslands. Learn more and join for just $15/month at 👉 https://savory.global/memberWant to sponsor an episode?+++MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:Considering the Nutritional Benefits and Health Implications of Red Meat in the Era of Meatless Initiatives – https://doi.org/10.3389/fnut.2025.1525011Sacred Cow documentary – https://youtu.be/hjyBUk6AQ1M?si=Y6ZvTnkeMcibbXmgSacred Cow (book) by Diana Rodgers & Robb Wolf – https://savory.global/science_library/sacred-cow-the-case-for-better-meat/Dr. Gabrielle Lyon – https://drgabriellelyon.comOlivia Robertson Moe – https://www.instagram.com/revolveprimalhealth/Rachel Paul (The College Nutritionist) – https://www.drrachelpaul.com/+++Stay in Touch with Diana
sustainabledish.com@sustainabledish
+++FIND US ON SOCIAL:YouTube: @SavoryInstituteInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/savoryinstituteLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/savory-institute/NEVER MISS AN EPISODE:SpotifyApple Podcasts+++ -
Beth Robinette is a fourth-generation cattle rancher, educator, and co-founder of New Cowgirl Camp (https://www.newcowgirlcamp.com/) who joins the podcast to talk about what it really means to build a more inclusive, resilient future for agriculture. From her roots on the Lazy R Ranch in Washington’s channeled scablands to her work leading education at UVE (a Savory Hub covering the Intermountain West region of the US), Beth shares how she’s blending business, ecology, and equity to reimagine land stewardship. The discussion covers being a second-generation Holistic Management practitioner, why creating a safe environment is essential to learning, and how cultural restoration—like digging camas with Salish youth—can deepen our relationship with the land. This is a powerful conversation about leadership, belonging, and making space for new voices in ranching.
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TIME STAMPS:[03:25] Beth's Family Ranching History[06:43] Transition to Holistic Management[10:59] Beth's Personal Journey and Education[15:32] Challenges and Insights in Ranching[21:32] New Cowgirl Camp: Empowering Women in Ranching[27:15] Community Building and Future of Agriculture[50:09] Savory Institute and Global Impact[55:12] Hunters of Color and Reciprocal Goodness[58:07] Diverse Backgrounds and Good Food[58:38] Relearning Land History[01:01:05[ Indigenous Land Management[01:04:41[ Collaboration with Salish School[01:16:33] Challenges and Adaptations in Land Management[01:35:46] Future Vision and Community Building+++
This episode is brought to you by Savory Institute’s Regenerating Members, a global community committed to restoring grasslands. Learn more and join for just $10/month at 👉 https://savory.global/member
Want to sponsor an episode?
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MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:Lazy R Ranch
New Cowgirl Camp
Roots of Resilience
Salish School of Spokane
UVE - Intermountain West Savory Hub
Savory’s Earth Day Giveaway+++
FIND US ON SOCIAL:YouTube: @SavoryInstitute Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/savoryinstitute LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/savory-institute/
NEVER MISS AN EPISODE:Spotify Apple Podcasts
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HAVE A GUEST SUGGESTION?We’d love to hear your thoughts. Suggest future guests here: https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997
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In this episode of Ruminations, we’re joined by Paul and Phyllis Van Amburgh of Dharma Lea—a 100% grass-fed, holistically managed dairy in upstate New York. They share their unlikely journey from first-time conventional dairy farmers to nationally recognized leaders in regenerative agriculture. What changed everything? Holistic Management.
We get into the weeds of what that transition really looked like—from the tough decisions and mindset shifts to the practical changes on the ground. By moving from rotational to holistic planned grazing, they extended their grazing season by 120%, slashed feed costs, and brought herd health to a whole new level—cutting mastitis rates from 73% to just 3%.
But their impact didn’t stop at the farm gate. Paul and Phyllis helped build the supply chain for Maple Hill Creamery, guiding over 125 farms in making the leap to grass-fed. Today, they mentor fellow farmers who want to build operations that are ecologically sound, financially viable, and deeply rooted in values.
This is a candid, practical, and inspiring conversation about what it really takes to go regenerative—and why it’s worth it.
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ALL EPISODES: 👉 https://savory.global/podcast
JOIN THE COMMUNITY + GET MEMBERS-ONLY PERKS: 👉 https://savory.global/member
GET INVOLVED WITH SAVORY INSTITUTE: 👉 https://savory.global/find-your-path
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TIME STAMPS:[5:33] Life on the farm
[13:00] Why they built a family-run business
[26:41] Getting into farming
[37:24] Unlearning old business habits
[43:40] Grass-fed vs grain-fed: financial insights
[57:55] Transition to 100% grass-fed dairy
[58:00] Managing yield drag & system change
[1:04:33] Improving soil health
[1:07:29] Understanding forage & nutrition
[1:16:38] From utilization to recovery mindset
[1:32:21] Planned vs rotational grazing
[1:39:09] Advice for transitioning farmers
[1:47:07] What changed slowly over time
[1:52:11] Visiting Dimbangombe in Zimbabwe
[1:59:32] Future of regenerative agriculture
[2:10:21] Closing
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This episode is brought to you by Savory Institute’s Regenerating Members, a global community committed to restoring grasslands. Learn more and join for just $10/month at 👉 https://savory.global/member
Want to sponsor an episode? [sponsorship link]
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MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:Dharma Lea DairyMaple Hill CreameryLess Stress, More Grass Case StudyAfrica Centre for Holistic ManagementSavory’s Earth Day Giveaway+++
FIND US ON SOCIAL:YouTube: @SavoryInstitute Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/savoryinstitute LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/savory-institute/
NEVER MISS AN EPISODE:Spotify Apple Podcasts
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HAVE A GUEST SUGGESTION?We’d love to hear your thoughts. Suggest future guests here: https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997
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Regenerative Business and Living Systems Design with Tre Cates
In this episode of Ruminations, host Bobby Gill delves into regenerative business practices with Tre Cates, founder of nRhythm. They explore the concepts of living systems design, organizational health, and the distinction between managing complexity versus control. Cates shares his experiences from working with the Savory Institute, the development of the Savory Hub model, and the transformation of businesses by applying regenerative principles. This episode offers deep insights into creating resilient and thriving organizations by focusing on the interconnectedness of people, processes, and the environment.
Tre Cates is the founder of nRhythm, a consulting firm helping organizations around the world design systems that align with the principles of life itself—complexity, emergence, resilience, and interconnectedness.
In this episode of @SavoryInstitute’s Ruminations podcast, Tre joins us to explore:
- What It Means to Design a Regenerative Organization- The Difference Between Complicated and Complex Systems (and -- Why It Matters)- How Businesses Can Create the Conditions for Life, Not Just Profit
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ALL EPISODES: https://savory.global/podcast
JOIN THE COMMUNITY + GET MEMBERS-ONLY PERKS: https://savory.global/member
GET INVOLVED WITH SAVORY INSTITUTE: https://savory.global/find-your-path
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TIME STAMPS:00:35 Meet Tre Cates: Founder of nRhythm
01:18 Savory Institute and Holistic Management
01:39 Exploring Complexity and Leadership
02:12 Sponsor Message: Savory Journey Giveaway
04:15 Conversation with Tre Cates Begins
05:42 Understanding the Cartesian Split
08:38 Complexity in Agriculture and Beyond
16:54 Managing Complexity vs. Control
28:27 Patterns and Principles of Living Systems
32:09 nRhythm's Approach to Regenerative Organizations
43:27 Foundational Beliefs and Operational Identity
44:52 Monitoring Health and Emergence
51:20 Understanding Governance Structures
53:00 Creating Conditions for Success
55:42 Monitoring for Emergence
56:55 Embracing Emergence in Organizations
01:11:34 Case Study: Transforming a Boutique Firm
01:18:44 The Savory Hub Network and Decentralization
01:26:13 Influential Thinkers and Schools of Thought
01:33:19 Future Patterns and Societal Shifts
01:44:00 Final Thoughts and Call to Action
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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through holistic management. Join today for just $10/month and help regenerate 400+ acres every year: https://savory.global/member
Want to sponsor an episode? https://savory.global/podcast
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MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE: nRhythm • Savory Institute • Holistic Management+++
FIND US ON SOCIAL:YouTube: @SavoryInstituteInstagram: @savoryinstituteLinkedIn: Savory Institute
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HAVE A GUEST SUGGESTION?We’d love to hear your thoughts: https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997
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In this episode of the Ruminations podcast, host Bobby Gill is joined by Dr. Paige Stanley from Colorado State University to dive deep into the science of soil health on grazing lands. They explore the latest research on carbon sequestration in arid and semi-arid rangelands, discuss the significance of different types of organic matter in carbon permanence, and introduce a new framework for understanding how grazing management affects soil carbon accumulation. The conversation also touches on the mental models of holistic managers and the potential of regenerative grazing to mitigate climate change. Tune in to learn more about Dr. Stanley's interdisciplinary approach and groundbreaking work in rangeland ecosystems.
Dr. Paige Stanley is an interdisciplinary scientist at Colorado State University, exploring how regenerative grazing can unlock soil’s carbon-storing potential and foster climate resilience.
In this episode of @SavoryInstitute’s Ruminations podcast, Dr. Stanley joins us to explore:
- How Regenerative Grazing Affects Soil Carbon in Arid Rangelands- Adaptive Multi-Paddock Grazing vs. Holistic Management- New Research That Challenges Carbon Saturation Myths
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ALL EPISODES:https://savory.global/podcast
JOIN THE COMMUNITY + GET MEMBERS-ONLY PERKS:https://savory.global/member
GET INVOLVED WITH SAVORY INSTITUTE:https://savory.global/find-your-path
+++
TIME STAMPS:00:55 Introducing Dr. Paige Stanley
03:55 Dr. Stanley's Research on AMP Grazing
08:01 Understanding Soil Carbon Dynamics
13:27 Challenges in Soil Carbon Research
21:42 Exploring Soil Texture and Carbon Sequestration
28:37 Adaptive Multi-Paddock Grazing vs. Holistic Management
32:44 Ruminating on Soil Carbon: A New Framework
39:23 Upcoming Savory Journey to Zimbabwe
39:55 Earth Day Giveaway Details
40:53 Understanding Grazing Categories
44:30 Mechanisms of Under and Overgrazing
50:37 Challenges in Soil Carbon Research
56:19 Feasibility of Soil Carbon Measurement for Ranchers
01:04:20 Technological Advances in Soil Science
01:10:51 Holistic Management and Adaptive Grazing
01:18:43 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community making real change possible on over 100 million acres. Join for just $10/month and help restore 400+ acres every year:https://savory.global/member
Want to sponsor an episode? https://savory.global/podcast
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FIND US ON SOCIAL:• YouTube: @SavoryInstitute• Instagram: @savoryinstitute• LinkedIn: Savory Institute
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HAVE A GUEST SUGGESTION?We’d love to hear your thoughts:https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997
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In the inaugural episode of the Ruminations podcast, host Bobby Gill sits down with Allan Savory, the renowned founder of Holistic Management and the Savory Institute. The conversation explores Allan’s adventurous beginnings as a young game ranger in southern Africa, his time in military leadership, politics, and ecological research—all unfolding during a transformative period in global history.
This episode highlights how a unique convergence of circumstances—colonial collapse, ecological degradation, and Allan’s cross-disciplinary career—created the conditions for the development of Holistic Management. Allan shares how insights from tracking, land stewardship, and systems thinking challenged conventional science and laid the foundation for a groundbreaking framework that has since changed the way we understand and manage complexity in agriculture.
We also get a preview of Allan’s forthcoming memoir, which captures the rich backstory behind one of the most influential ecological movements of our time.
In this premiere episode of @SavoryInstitute’s Ruminations podcast, Allan joins host Bobby Gill to reflect on:
- How a Young Game Ranger Became a Global Voice for Regeneration- The Birth of Holistic Management Amidst Colonial Collapse, War & Wildlife- Why Solving Desertification Requires More Than Just Science
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ALL EPISODES:https://savory.global/podcast
JOIN THE COMMUNITY + GET MEMBERS-ONLY PERKS:https://savory.global/member
GET INVOLVED WITH SAVORY INSTITUTE:https://savory.global/find-your-path
+++
TIME STAMPS:00:09 Allan Savory's Early Adventures
01:31 The Birth of Holistic Management
02:03 Allan's Memoir and Life Reflections
02:37 A Peek into Allan's Study
04:30 Diverse Career and Early Influences
09:25 Challenges and Insights in Wildlife Management
12:40 The Concept of Holistic Management
27:48 Contributions of Jan Smuts and André Voisin
47:03 Military Influence on Holistic Planning
51:53 Introduction to Holistic Management
53:43 The Importance of Livestock in Holistic Grazing
56:39 The Influence of John Acox
01:06:41 Early Career and Wildlife Passion
01:16:17 Tracking and Ecology Insights
01:23:52 Advanced Tracking Techniques
01:32:18 Connecting Ecology and Wildlife Management
01:33:30 The Hippo in the Swamp
01:41:28 The Monkwala Talisman
01:47:38 Rhodesian History and Ian Smith
01:53:18 Racial Tensions and Personal Growth
02:08:32 The Controversy of Elephant Culling
02:14:03 Holistic Management and Future Hopes
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This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through holistic management. Join today for just $10/month and help regenerate 400+ acres every year:https://savory.global/member
Want to sponsor an episode? https://savory.global/podcast
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MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:Savory InstituteAllan Savory's memoirHolistic Management TextbookVoisin’s Rational GrazingDiffusion of Innovations – Everett Rogers+++
FIND US ON SOCIAL:
• YouTube: @SavoryInstitute• Instagram: @savoryinstitute• LinkedIn: Savory Institute
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HAVE A GUEST SUGGESTION?We’d love to hear your thoughts:https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997
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In the premiere episode of the Savory Institute's new podcast 'Ruminations', host Bobby Gill, the Director of Development and Communications, introduces the series. He shares his journey to the Savory Institute, the mission to regenerate global grasslands through holistic management, and the broad range of topics and guests the podcast will cover. Bobby highlights the diverse and rich network behind the Savory Institute, including regional learning hubs, educators, and their land monitoring protocol. He emphasizes the podcast's goal to tell the stories of people making real change in regenerative agriculture and beyond, hoping to inspire and educate listeners from all backgrounds.
ALL EPISODES:https://savory.global/podcast
JOIN THE COMMUNITY + GET MEMBERS-ONLY PERKS:https://savory.global/member
GET INVOLVED WITH SAVORY INSTITUTE:https://savory.global/find-your-path
+++
This episode is brought to you by Savory’s Regenerating Members, a global community restoring over 100 million acres through holistic management. Join today for just $10/month and help regenerate 400+ acres every year:https://savory.global/member
Want to sponsor an episode? https://savory.global/podcast
+++
FIND US ON SOCIAL:• YouTube: @SavoryInstitute• Instagram: @savoryinstitute• LinkedIn: Savory Institute
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HAVE A GUEST SUGGESTION?We’d love to hear your thoughts:https://www.tfaforms.com/5169997
