Avsnitt
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#250 Customer Insights | Matt sits down with Shoshana Kordova, a 3x founding product marketer and former journalist who now helps B2B tech startups craft customer-infused messaging through her consultancy, Peel Product Marketing. Shoshana recently launched a customer insights playbook for the PMM Jetpack, equipping marketers with tools and templates to run more effective customer interviews.
Why a customer insights program is more than “just talking to customers” and how to turn interviews into a repeatable system that drives messaging, positioning, and case studiesHow to collaborate across teams (especially with CS and product) to get buy-in and avoid stepping on toesThe most common mistakes B2B marketers make with interviews and how to get the kind of insights you can actually use
Matt and Shoshana cover:Whether you're a product marketer, content strategist, or leading a GTM team, this episode is packed with actionable takeaways to build messaging that resonates.
Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro(02:13) - – Meet Shoshana: From Journalism to Product Marketing(03:23) - – What Is “Customer-Infused Messaging”?(05:08) - – Why Customer Insights Beat Surface-Level Deliverables(07:08) - – How to Work with CS and Sales Without Stepping on Toes(10:08) - – Navigating Competing Priorities Across Teams(12:28) - – Selling the Value of Customer Interviews Internally(16:28) - – The 6 Steps to Building a Customer Insights Program(18:23) - – Step 1: Aligning Goals with Stakeholders(20:03) - – Step 2: Building a Customer Interview Pipeline(22:08) - – Step 3: Keeping Stakeholders in the Loop (Hint: Use Slack)(27:34) - – Step 4: How to Run a Great Customer Interview(33:04) - – Focus on Problems, Not Just the Product(35:39) - – Uncovering Real ROI with Better Follow-Ups(36:49) - – Step 5: Documenting What Actually Matters(39:09) - – How to Organize Insights into a Shared Database(41:59) - – Step 6: Putting Insights to Work (Case Studies, Messaging, ICPs)(44:19) - – Should You Hire an External Interviewer?(46:34) - – What’s a Realistic Interview Cadence?(48:04) - – Other Places to Find Customer Insights (When Interviews Aren’t Possible)(49:39) - – Final Tips: Mining G2 Reviews, Webinars, and Internal Teams(50:53) - – Wrap-Up and Where to Find ShoshanaSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#249 Cold Email | In this episode, Danielle is joined by four experts in B2B outbound: Zoe Hartsfield (Apollo), Will Allred, (Lavender), Maximus Greenwald (Warmly), and Alex Fine (Understory). Together, they dive into the good, bad, and “please don’t ever send this” of cold email strategy. Each guest brings firsthand insight from scaling outbound at fast-growing B2B companies and helping clients do the same.
Danielle and the crew cover:
The biggest reasons cold emails flop and what great ones do differentlyHow to use personalization, targeting, and timing to get replies (not unsubscribes)The right way to blend automation and human touch in your outbound strategyIt’s an inside look at how marketers and founders approach outbound messaging, across strategy, execution, and scale.
(00:00) - — Intro and guest lineup(03:38) - — Why most cold emails fall flat(05:38) - — Common copy mistakes: too much “I,” not enough “you”(07:08) - — The automation vs. personalization debate(09:23) - — When *not* to send a cold email(11:38) - — What targeting gets wrong (and how to fix it)(13:38) - — Teardown #1: Robotics email with 0% replies(15:53) - — Subject line issues, tone, and CTA feedback(18:08) - — Teardown #2: CRM campaign with profanity(19:53) - — Why this email screams “marketing,” not “outbound”(23:19) - — Teardown #3: Direct debit email repurposed from a nurture(25:49) - — Why HTML-heavy emails kill deliverability(27:34) - — Teardown #4: Founder-led cold email from Breakout(29:49) - — What worked: relevance, format, and intent(32:19) - — Teardown #5: Cybersecurity email to bank execs(34:19) - — Final takeaways on relevance, timing, and strategy
TimestampsSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
Saknas det avsnitt?
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#248 Marketing Strategy | Dave sits down with Jaleh Rezaei, founder and CEO of Mutiny, the personalization platform for B2B websites. Jaleh brings a unique blend of founder perspective and deep marketing expertise from her time building go-to-market teams at VMware, Gusto, and now Mutiny. She’s on a mission to help marketers ditch the spammy, scaled playbooks of the past and refocus on what really drives pipeline today: buyer experience.
Dave and Jaleh cover:
Why the current use of AI is making marketing worse and how to use it to build better buying experiences insteadWhat marketers get wrong about speed (hint: it’s not about doing more, it’s about doing what matters)The principles of simplifying your go-to-market strategy to cut through noise and align your team around real revenue resultsMarketing is changing fast, but the teams who win will be the ones who prioritize real buyer experiences, move with speed, and stay aligned on what actually drives revenue. Jaleh breaks down how to make that shift before your strategy gets left behind.
(00:00) - – Intro(02:18) - – Why AI Is Backfiring in B2B(04:53) - – Outbound Is Broken (Here’s the Data)(07:13) - – What Buyers Actually Want(09:38) - – Gimmicks Don’t Scale(11:08) - – How to Build Marketing That Lasts(12:33) - – Why Marketing Is Harder Today(14:08) - – AI Efficiency vs. Buyer Experience(15:38) - – The Right Way to Prioritize Speed(18:34) - – Strategy First, Then Speed(20:24) - – How to Test Big Ideas Fast(22:39) - – Borrowing the YC Mindset(24:19) - – What Good Brand Marketing Looks Like(26:34) - – Best Brand Play: A Children’s Book?(28:19) - – What CEOs Really Want From Marketing(29:59) - – Simplifying Your Marketing Strategy(32:29) - – The Truth About Sales-Marketing Alignment(34:19) - – Common Execution Gaps That Hurt Revenue
TimestampsSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#247 Lead Nurturing | In this episode, Danielle is joined by Samar Owais, founder of Emails Done Right; Sheri Otto, CEO of Growth Lane Strategies; and Sofia Silva, Marketing Manager at Reachdesk.
These three email experts came together for a live roast of real B2B lead nurture emails, submitted by marketers from the Exit Five community. You’ll hear the good, the bad, and the fixable, with practical insights on how to improve your own nurture sequences.
The most common lead nurture mistakes B2B marketers make (and how to fix them)Why every email should be treated as a conversation, not just a campaignHow to write nurture emails that create connection, not clicks for clicks’ sake
Danielle, Samar, Sheri, and Sofia cover:
If you're building (or rebuilding) your nurture strategy, this one’s packed with real examples and expert feedback to guide your next send.Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro: Welcome to the Lead Nurture Roast(02:36) - – Meet the Experts: Samar, Sheri, and Sofia(06:33) - – What Is **Lead Nurturing, Really?(09:26) - – The Problem with “We” Language in Emails(11:48) - – The Biggest Mistakes B2B Marketers Make(14:13) - – Why AI Isn’t Your Copywriter(16:08) - – Teardown #1: Subject Line Gone Wrong(20:38) - – How to Build a Nurture Sequence Around a Whitepaper(23:18) - – CTA Overload and Why It Kills Clicks(28:23) - – Teardown #2: Great Open Rate, Low Engagement(32:17) - – The One-CTA Rule (And Why It Matters)(34:59) - – Structuring Long Emails for Skimmability(37:31) - – Teardown #3: Cold Lead, Wrong Email(40:04) - – Re-Engagement Emails That Actually Work(42:54) - – Use Social Proof Instead of Product Pitches(44:34) - – Teardown #4: The Overloaded Onboarding Email(47:29) - – What’s a “Micro Conversion” in SaaS Email?(52:04) - – Time-to-Value and the First Action That Matters(54:19) - – This Email Is... a Whole Sequence in One(56:39) - – Teardown #5: Trust Email or Generic Spam?(59:34) - – Why Specificity Beats Industry Buzzwords(01:01:49) - – Final Scores and Wrap-UpSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#246 Sales Alignment | Danielle welcomes Talya Heller, founder of Down to a T, a B2B consultancy helping marketers turn competitive positioning into high-impact sales assets. With experience in engineering, product management, and product marketing, Talya knows how to bridge the gap between what marketing builds and what sales actually uses.
Together they unpack:
Why most sales decks and battle cards go unused and what to build insteadHow to enable your champion to sell internally with confidenceSimple frameworks for mapping competitive positioning that teams will actually useTalya also breaks down how she researches, builds, and delivers assets that align sales, marketing, and product, all rooted in buyer empathy.
Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro & Talya’s background(02:08) - – From engineering to B2B marketing(08:53) - – What is buyer enablement?(11:08) - – Why deals stall after vendor selection(13:23) - – The problem with sales decks(15:53) - – Why battle cards don’t work(18:08) - – Talya’s competitive positioning map(24:19) - – Grouping competitors by approach(26:49) - – Market maps for sales(28:49) - – Where to get the best insights(31:19) - – New formats for enablement(33:34) - – Why context matters(35:19) - – Empathy for your sales team(37:04) - – Closing thoughts on empathy(38:09) - – Where to find Talya onlineSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#245: Cold Email | Danielle Messler sits down with Alex Fine, co-founder of Understory, the agency behind some of the most effective outbound and paid strategies in B2B right now. Alex is leading the charge on a smarter approach to outbound called “Allbound”, a tightly integrated blend of outbound, paid media, and LinkedIn tactics that actually convert.
If you’re tired of cold emails that go nowhere or ad campaigns that burn cash without ROI, this one’s for you.
Why most B2B outbound strategies fail and how Allbound fixes the disconnect between ads, email, and LinkedInThe cold email deliverability tactics that actually work in 2025 (including tools like Instantly, Smartlead, and Clay)Real-world examples of hyper-personalized, AI-powered outreach that book meetings with high-ACV prospects
Danielle and Alex cover:Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro(03:08) - – What Is “Allbound”?(05:08) - – Cold Email Isn’t Dead (But It’s Evolved)(07:38) - – Tools to Improve Deliverability(09:53) - – Personalization That Actually Works(11:23) - – Real Example: Fraud Detection SaaS Cold Email Strategy(13:08) - – How to Keep Messaging Consistent Across Channels(15:08) - – Treating Each Channel Differently(18:19) - – Ads as a “Cheat Code” in B2B(20:49) - – Building Genuinely Personalized Emails at Scale(23:49) - – From Swiffer to SaaS(27:19) - – What Sales Teaches Marketers(36:04) - – Where to Find Alex + Upcoming Exit Five Event PlugSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#244: Professional Growth | Dave is joined by Amanda Goetz, a 2x founder, 3x CMO, and the author behind the popular weekly newsletter, Life's A Game. Amanda shares her expertise in personal and professional growth, brand building, and content creation.
How Amanda transformed her LinkedIn strategy to grow her following and engagementThe impact of personal branding on social media and its role in business growthCreating a feedback loop to refine and improve content strategy
Amanda and Dave cover:Timestamps
(00:00) - - Intro(08:18) - - How to Use LinkedIn Video(11:46) - - Shifting from Twitter to LinkedIn(15:32) - - Developing a Clearer Target Market and Products(16:15) - - Building Sustainable Momentum Amid Burnout: A CMO's Perspective(20:36) - - Why Your Content Strategy Must Be Focused(27:17) - - The Brand Pyramid(28:12) - - The Emotion Behind Branding(31:42) - - People Are What Matter In Branding Success(37:20) - - The Growing Creator Economy vs. Traditional Corporations(38:38) - - Creating Emotional Brand Connections for Growth Marketing(43:10) - - How Amanda Became a Fractional CMO(45:44) - - Why Amanda Looks to Alex Lieberman for InspirationSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#243 Linkedin Ads | In this episode, Danielle Messler sits down with Anthony Blatner (LinkedIn ads expert and certified instructor) and Tagg Bozied (Head of Brand Awareness at Docebo and award-winning B2B campaign strategist) to dig into what actually works with B2B LinkedIn ads in 2025. These two have spent years in the trenches, building campaigns for some of the most niche, high-intent B2B audiences, and they’ve got the data and real stories to back up what works (and what definitely doesn’t).
The biggest mistakes B2B marketers make on LinkedIn and how to fix them fastWhy “thought leader ads” are crushing right now and how to set them up the right way (even if you’re not Dave Gerhardt)How to measure success in brand awareness campaigns (including smart ways to use dwell time, frequency, and Google Analytics)
Danielle, Anthony, and Tagg cover:Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro from Dave(01:56) - – Why This Isn’t Just a “Webinar”(03:24) - – Meet the Experts: Tagg Bozied and Anthony Blatner(05:35) - – Biggest Mistakes in LinkedIn Ads(08:06) - – How to Make LinkedIn Ads Stand Out(10:18) - – What to Know About Thought Leader Ads(14:39) - – What Does Success Look Like? Metrics That Matter(17:36) - – What’s a CTV Ad and Should You Try It?(20:40) - – Budgeting Tips for Niche Audiences(26:54) - – LinkedIn Lead Forms vs. Landing Pages(32:52) - – Proving ROI on Brand Awareness Campaigns(38:53) - – Reporting Tools and Stack Recommendations(41:35) - – Targeting Secrets and Retargeting Best Practices(44:57) - – How to Think About A/B Testing on LinkedIn(48:55) - – Wrap-Up + Where to ConnectSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#242: Content Strategy | In this episode, Danielle sits down with Brendan Hufford, founder of Growth Sprints, to talk about what actually works in content and SEO today and why most B2B strategies are broken. Brendan went from high school teacher to leading content at top SaaS companies, and now helps brands move faster and build content strategies that drive real impact.
They cover:
Why most SEO strategies are broken - and why retainers make it worseThe content checklist that took ActiveCampaign from 200K to 240K visitors in 30 daysWhy the most lucrative SEO opportunities are hiding in plain sightBrendan’s "immortal newsletter" framework that cuts production time in half while doubling engagementPlus, check out the checklist Brendan mentioned in this episode here!
Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Brendan(04:53) - – Lessons from teaching that apply directly to marketing(07:53) - – Why Brendan left education and entered the B2B world(09:23) - – Early agency and in-house marketing experience(11:08) - – Building a defensible career: audience, trust, and network(13:28) - – The Growth Sprints model: why retainers don’t make sense(14:38) - – Content strategy in bets, not buckets(15:53) - – Why SEO still works and where it actually drives results(17:23) - – Getting deep on audience, product, and internal dynamics(19:38) - – What marketers get wrong about internal buy-in(21:38) - – Real example: what a content sprint looks like in practice(23:08) - – The power of internal linking and content refreshes(26:19) - – How Google views internal linking and user signals(29:19) - – Why technical SEO is often overrated(32:19) - – Brendan’s hot take: most SEOs aren’t marketers(33:49) - – Why the “SEO takes 6 months” narrative is flawed(35:49) - – The problem with traditional retainers and content brief models(37:19) - – The immortal newsletter: how to mix evergreen + ephemeral content(40:19) - – Naming the problem, not just the category(41:49) - – Content should do 3–5 jobs at once: how to prioritize impact(44:19) - – The real value of competitor and alternatives pages(46:49) - – How to make content more useful for sales and buyer enablement(48:19) - – Brendan’s final mindset shift: create content that earns its keepSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#241: Email Strategy | Email isn’t dead – it’s just changing fast.
It’s still one of the few B2B marketing channels where you can actually own your audience and reach your ideal customers with the push of a button.
In this session from the Ultimate Roast of B2B Emails, Danielle hosts Beth O’Malley (Founder, astral.), Jay Schwedelson (Founder, Subjectline.com & GURU Media Hub), and Jaina Mistry (Director, Brand and Content Marketing at Litmus) for a tactical session on what’s actually working in email marketing in 2025.
They cover:
What an effective email marketing strategy looks like todayKey elements of great emailsHow to write irresistible subject linesAll the ins and outs of deliverability and landing in the inboxPlus, they tackle a live Q&A, hot takes on open rates, resends, clickbait, personalization, and how to fix your email marketing strategy.
Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Beth, Jay, and Jaina(04:22) - – Why bad emails are killing results(06:54) - – How to think about email beyond lead gen(09:06) - – The real problem with how B2B measures email success(10:22) - – Open rates: Are they dead or still useful?(14:46) - – Should you resend to non-openers? The great debate(19:42) - – Deliverability basics: What B2B marketers miss(23:00) - – Personalization: What actually works (and what doesn’t)(29:12) - – Why exclusion (not just segmentation) matters in email(31:27) - – AI summaries and how they’re reshaping the inbox(34:12) - – Clicks vs engagement: What you should really track(36:37) - – Why structured clicks matter more than just "more clicks"(40:22) - – How to think about email length and structure in 2025(43:33) - – Technical tips: Avoiding clipping, formatting for mobile(45:31) - – Clickbait subject lines: Where to draw the line(47:32) - – Final advice for marketersSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#240: Video Strategy | In this episode, Danielle sits down with Connor Lewis, founder of Studio Lewis, to talk all things B2B video - what works, what doesn’t, and how to actually get started. Connor spent years building in-house video from the ground up before going solo. Now, he works with B2B brands on high-performing video ads and he’s here to break down what he’s learned.
Danielle and Connor cover:
Why production value doesn’t matter as much as you thinkHow to turn existing blog posts and webinars into watchable videoWhat’s working on LinkedIn video in 2025How to get started with video without hiring an agency or a full-time teamSimple formats that make video approachableTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Connor(04:08) - – Learning video by doing: from intern to strategist(06:08) - – What’s working in B2B video on LinkedIn in 2025(07:35) - – Three types of videos that perform best(08:56) - – Why video ads aren’t the best place to start(09:49) - – How to turn top blog posts into YouTube videos that rank(11:42) - – Using video to refresh blog content and boost SEO(12:22) - – How to use video effectively for virtual and in-person events(13:16) - – Repurposing Q&A sections from webinars into high-performing short clips(15:11) - – Creating shorts from top audience questions(16:24) - – The only parts of video that really matter(17:11) - – Why “how I” beats “how to” every time(19:06) - – The “reverse Rambo” hook format and how to use it(21:05) - – How setting and authenticity improve engagement(22:34) - – Why stiff, overproduced videos are killing your reach(25:12) - – How to get started with video if you don’t have a team or budget(27:18) - – Why marketers need to get comfortable on camera(27:40) - – Podcasts as a powerful entry point into video(28:37) - – How to test video with a simple 4-part limited series(30:13) - – Low-budget options that still convert(30:41) - – Why product marketers often make the best video collaborators(31:25) - – Final advice: don’t wait until it’s perfect, just start!Send guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#239: Measurement | In this Exit Five live session, Dave sits down with Pranav Piyush, Co-Founder & CEO of Paramark (ex-PayPal, Dropbox, Adobe, BILL), to talk about the future of B2B marketing measurement.
Spoiler alert: it’s not clicks.
They break down why the old way of doing attribution doesn’t cut it anymore and why leading B2B teams are shifting toward incrementality, experimentation, and marketing mix modeling.
Dave and Pranav also cover:
The gaps in the old way of doing attributionWhat the best B2B marketing teams are doing now for attributionThe key questions CMOs face from boards and execs about measurementThree things you can do this quarter to improve your measurementTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Pranav(04:08) - – The Purple Cow mindset: why differentiation matters more than ever(05:48) - – Pranav’s background (PayPal, Dropbox, Adobe, BILL → Paramark)(06:53) - – “Measurement is Robin. Creative is Batman.”(08:08) - – Why click/touch attribution is flawed and misleading(11:38) - – The 95/5 rule: most of your audience isn’t in-market…yet(14:23) - – How top brands (Asana, DoorDash, P&G) measure beyond attribution(15:48) - – What is incrementality and why it’s more useful than attribution(18:08) - – Why revenue isn’t always the right KPI - especially in long sales cycles(20:08) - – Intro to marketing mix modeling (MMM) and how it works(22:08) - – Visualizing baseline vs. incremental impact on pipeline(23:23) - – Geo testing: how to prove a channel’s impact without attribution tools(25:23) - – The branded search trap: why you should test turning it off(29:04) - – Even Meta, Google, LinkedIn admit attribution is flawed(29:49) - – How to measure untrackable stuff (organic, content, social)(33:19) - – Why “credit” kills performance(35:09) - – Measurement for startups(38:04) - – What to do if all you track is closed-won revenue(39:49) - – Why attribution software is overkill under $100K in spend(41:04) - – Should you ask “How did you hear about us?”(43:49) - – How to carve out budget for channel testing(46:29) - – Don’t skip audience research(49:49) - – Creativity is still your #1 growth lever (measurement just supports it)(51:19) - – Wrap-up and final takeawaysSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#238: Brand | In this episode, Dave sits down with Dmitry Shamis, former Head of Brand at HubSpot and now founder of Oh Snap, to talk about what brand really means in B2B and why so many teams are stuck doing busy work instead of meaningful marketing. After leading a team of 150+ creatives and scaling HubSpot’s brand across multiple products, Dmitry shares lessons on building brands that actually stand out.
Dave and Dmitry cover:
How to stand out in a crowded marketHow to develop and refine your point of viewWhy marketers get lost in busy work and how to stop itWhat to look for when hiring great designersThe role of AI in B2B marketing today (and what it won’t replace)Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Dmitry(05:08) - – What brand actually means in B2B(07:28) - – Why your POV is the foundation of your brand(09:38) - – How to uncover a real, differentiated POV(13:37) - – How to stand out in a crowded, same-sounding market(16:12) - – Why differentiation requires alignment between product and marketing(19:02) - – Building trust with product teams(19:51) - – Busy work in marketing: how to spot it and stop it(22:33) - – Why marketers burn out and how poor prioritization is killing teams(26:44) - – Making the case for brand work when it’s hard to measure(28:19) - – The “fishing” analogy: performance vs brand marketing(32:50) - – The real opportunity with AI in B2B marketing(36:49) - – How AI can eliminate bottlenecks and speed up creative execution(38:19) - – Why Dmitry’s starting a creative agency (Oh Snap) and how it’s different(41:27) - – How to hire great designers: what to look for beyond the portfolioSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#237: Strategy | Udi Ledergor (former CMO, now Chief Evangelist at Gong) helped turn Gong into one of B2B’s most iconic brands—and now he’s sharing how they scaled it to a multi-billion dollar valuation. In this episode, Dave sits down with Udi to unpack lessons from building Gong’s category, brand, and marketing engine (and why B2B marketing needs way more courage).
You’ll learn:
Lessons from building Gong from 0 to $100M in revenueHow to make B2B marketing not boringHow to measure and justify brand investments in marketingWhy you need to be more courageous with your marketingUdi also shares stories from his new book Courageous Marketing, featuring specific plays and strategies any B2B marketer can steal.
Timestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Udi(07:08) - – Early career lessons and building a marketing role from scratch(10:08) - – How Gong achieved early product-market fit(14:08) - – The importance of picking the right company and founder(16:08) - – Why Gong’s focus, clarity, and positioning stood out from day one(18:18) - – Why Udi wrote Courageous Marketing and what it’s about(19:08) - – What “courageous marketing” actually means(22:08) - – Defining brand personality before visual identity(25:59) - – Campaign breakdown: Times Square billboards, employee spotlights, and perception hacks(29:19) - – The “punching above your weight” formula for early-stage brands(32:49) - – How to measure soft ROI and prove brand impact(36:19) - – Super Bowl ad, Michael Lewis podcast, and tying brand to pipeline(41:04) - – How to budget for experiments and get CFO/CEO buy-in(42:19) - – Building a courageous team: culture, process, and psychological safety(45:19) - – Gong Labs: Turning product data into content with staying power(48:19) - – Product + marketing alignment: the real unlock(49:49) - – Where AI fits in the future of courageous marketing(52:09) - – Udi’s book Courageous Marketing (and why you should go read it)Send guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#236: Product Marketing | Product marketers are no strangers to change. Whether it’s navigating new responsibilities, proving impact to leadership, or balancing short-term wins with long-term strategy, the role is constantly evolving - and in 2025, that evolution is only accelerating.
This Exit Five Live session is built to help you stay ahead. Dave sits down with Natalie Marcotullio (Head of Growth & Product Marketing at Navattic), Jason Oakley (Founder of Productive PMM), and Eric Holland (Senior PMM at Betterworks and Co-Founder of DemoDash) for a tactical discussion on how to sharpen your skills, adapt to a shifting landscape, and deliver measurable impact.
They cover:
What a successful product marketing function looks like in B2BTools, frameworks, and metrics that actually matterHow to align with sales and customer successTrends to watch in 2025 and beyondTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Natalie, Jason, and Eric(03:08) - – Why product marketing is the most important function in B2B marketing(04:58) - – Defining the role: What should product marketing actually own?(07:08) - – How PMM impacts revenue, growth, and pipeline(08:38) - – Differentiation: What it really takes and why most companies get it wrong(11:08) - – Real examples of effective positioning in crowded markets(15:38) - – What bad product marketing looks like(17:08) - – Why PMMs need to market the product more (and not just during launches)(20:08) - – Launch marketing, momentum, and creating "marketable moments"(22:08) - – Why PMM charters don’t work - and what to do instead(24:08) - – How to measure product marketing impact (with or without KPIs)(31:49) - – Tying assets and enablement to revenue(33:19) - – Tracking usage without a big tech stack(36:19) - – Who owns positioning: PMM vs brand?(38:19) - – How to shine as a PMM in a sales-led org(42:49) - – The death of one-pagers and what to use instead(45:19) - – What to look for when hiring a great product marketerSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#235: Strategy |In this episode, Matt sits down with Aditya Vempaty, VP of Marketing at MoEngage, to talk about a topic every marketing leader has wrestled with: reporting on the right metrics. Aditya has led marketing at companies like Nutanix, Amplitude, and Synthego - and he’s learned how to build dashboards and reporting frameworks that actually communicate marketing’s impact across leadership, sales, and finance.
Matt and Aditya cover:
Why marketing metrics should translate performance into a common language the business understandsThe four buckets of metrics every B2B team should trackHow often you should be reporting on metricsThe exact 7 metrics Aditya uses to report up, down, and across the orgTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Aditya(03:20) - – Why communicating marketing’s impact is a challenge for many teams(05:56) - – The importance of using a common language when reporting to leadership(08:34) - – Breaking marketing metrics into four key buckets(11:49) - – How pipeline coverage connects marketing to revenue(14:18) - – Reporting on efficiency: CAC, cost per opportunity, and more(17:33) - – The role of awareness metrics and how to contextualize them(21:37) - – How marketing and sales alignment can be measured effectively(24:06) - – The 7 core marketing metrics Aditya reports on regularly(27:49) - – How often should marketing be reporting metrics?(30:33) - – Dashboards, recurring meetings, and what execs actually care about(33:25) - – Advice for first-time marketing leaders on building reporting habits(35:39) - – Why clarity beats complexity when it comes to data(38:21) - – Final thoughtsSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#234: Messaging | In this episode, Dave sits down with Emma Stratton, founder of Punchy, to break down what great B2B messaging actually looks like - and how to get it right. Emma has worked with hundreds of B2B tech companies to sharpen their positioning, eliminate vague copy, and train marketing teams to write with clarity and impact. They cover what makes messaging actually resonate and how to spot and fix abstract or weak copy. They also dive into Emma’s process for creating message-market fit, doing customer research, and working with execs and cross-functional teams.
And BONUS: they spend the last 20 minutes talking about personal development, productivity, journaling, and managing your mental energy to be a better marketer (and human).
Dave and Emma also cover:
How to go from vague to punchy by writing with specificity and buyer empathyWhy most B2B messaging falls flat and how to avoid the “sea of sameness”How to use customer interviews, sales calls, and concrete language to create strong messagingWhy writing, meditation, and personal rituals are so important for creative energyTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Emma(04:13) - – What makes B2B messaging actually good(07:55) - – Common messaging mistakes (and why "clarity > clever")(10:53) - – Positioning vs. messaging: what’s the difference?(15:06) - – Why it's hard to name great B2B marketing examples(17:30) - – How to sharpen weak messaging and fix vague positioning statements(20:38) - – Simplifying complex products without dumbing it down(24:59) - – How to write for buyers (not just execs)(28:31) - – Using customer interviews and research to build strong messaging(33:09) - – Standing out in a crowded, buzzword-filled market(35:53) - – How storytelling fits into B2B messaging(38:59) - – Messaging advice for early-stage founders and startups(42:14) - – How often should you revisit and update messaging?(44:24) - – Productivity, managing your energy, and staying focused(47:39) - – Journaling, mindfulness, and being intentional with your time(51:34) - – Final takeawaysSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#233: Inside Exit Five | In this episode, Matt Carnevale (Head of Community at Exit Five) joins the team at Circle to break down how we’ve doubled Exit Five community membership and boosted engagement—all by treating Exit Five like a product. He shares our playbook: audience growth, engagement systems, how we use member feedback to shape what we build, and why “curate, don’t create” has been key to scaling. If you’re running (or joining) a B2B community, this is how you make it work.
Matt covers:
Why we think of community like a product, not just a channelHow Exit Five grew community membership over 100% in under a yearThe systems we use to drive 40% monthly active user engagementThe power of “tripwires,” onboarding, and member matchmakingHow feedback loops shape what we buildTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Matt(03:38) - – Exit Five’s approach to community(06:08) - – What it means to treat community like a product(10:08) - – Why audience is the foundation of community growth(13:08) - – How Exit Five builds and converts audience from LinkedIn(16:08) - – Using content tripwires to drive signups(18:08) - – Offers that work: Why we use a 7-day free trial(21:08) - – How Exit Five got started as a paid community(24:08) - – The product mindset: build, test, iterate(28:19) - – Using member feedback to drive product decisions(30:19) - – Real example: member matchmaking feature(32:19) - – Promoting new community features like product launches(35:19) - – How we drive 40% monthly active usage(37:19) - – The value of member-led events and how we do them(40:19) - – Other plays: tagging experts, matchmaking, onboarding(43:19) - – Why self-promo was hurting our community and what changed when we cut it(45:19) - – Final takeaways + advice for small communities(49:19) - – Audience Q&A: re-engagement, matchmaking, content cadenceSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#232: Sales | Dave sits down with Jen Allen-Knuth, founder of DemandJen. Jen shares her insights from her 15+ years in B2B Sales, from managing a quota to building great working relationships with marketing.
Jen and Dave cover:
Co-creating content with Marketing and Sales that drives better customer engagement and grows your pipelineHow Jen successfully built her audience using video on LinkedIn and leveraged it to start DemandJenHow companies should focus on genuine diversity efforts rather than superficial inclusivityTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Jen(07:18) - – Why you should have a mentor and how to get one(09:08) - – Sales experiences and becoming a Chief Evangelist(12:39) - – Making the leap from side hustle to full-time(17:06) - – Why your career experiences should be diverse(21:41) - – The shallow impact of diversity panels(25:45) - – How Jen built her personal brand(29:06) - – Creating unscripted content that’s still clear(32:38) - – Being authentic in marketing(37:33) - – Don’t use templates for customer conversations(43:55) - – Strong relationships between product marketing and sales(44:42) - – Being customer-centric(50:04) - – Why you need to be a good storyteller(51:53) - – Challenges of data analysisSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more -
#230: Messaging | In this episode, Matt sits down with Talia Wolf, founder and CEO of GetUplift, to unpack what’s really wrong with most B2B websites – and how to fix it. After reviewing 100+ member-submitted sites from the Exit Five community, Talia shares what she sees over and over again: messaging that’s too focused on the product, poor design flow, and a lack of real customer understanding.
Matt and Talia cover:
Why most B2B sites focus too much on features and not enough on buyer emotionHow to use emotional targeting and customer research to write copy that convertsThe biggest design mistakes B2B marketers are making (and how to fix them)How to get stakeholder buy-in for website changesWhy great websites start with strong product marketingTimestamps
(00:00) - – Intro to Talia(03:12) - – Why most B2B websites fail to convert(05:38) - – The common thread across 100+ website reviews from Exit Five members(08:23) - – Why focusing on features instead of emotion kills conversions(11:11) - – What is emotional targeting (and how to actually use it)?(14:26) - – The power of customer research in website optimization(17:48) - – How to apply emotional triggers to your homepage copy(21:17) - – Mistakes B2B companies make with above-the-fold content(24:19) - – Why you should write copy before designing the site(28:47) - – Structuring your site around buyer intent and behavior(32:04) - – How to get internal buy-in for messaging and UX changes(35:21) - – The difference between product marketing and “just copywriting”(38:37) - – The role of hierarchy, visual flow, and CTA placement(42:03) - – When to simplify and when to educate on B2B websites(45:25) - – Final takeaways and practical steps to start improving your siteSend guest pitches and ideas to [email protected]
Join the Exit Five Newsletter here: https://www.exitfive.com/newsletter
Check out the Exit Five job board: https://jobs.exitfive.com/
Become an Exit Five member: https://community.exitfive.com/checkout/exit-five-membership***
Today's episode is brought to you by Knak.
Email (in my humble opinion) is the still the greatest marketing channel of all-time.
It’s the only way you can truly “own” your audience.
But when it comes to building the emails - if you’ve ever tried building an email in an enterprise marketing automation platform, you know how painful it can be. Templates are too rigid, editing code can break things and the whole process just takes forever.
Frustrated by clunky email builders? You need Knak.Tired of ‘hoping’ the email you sent looks good across all devices? Just test in Knak first.Big team making it hard to collaborate and get approvals? Definitely Knak.
That’s why we love Knak here at Exit Five. Knak a no-code email platform that makes it easy to create on-brand, high-performing emails - without the bottlenecks.And the best part? Everything takes a fraction of the time.
See Knak in action at knak.com/exit-five. Or just let them know you heard about Knak on Exit Five.
***
Thanks to my friends at hatch.fm for producing this episode and handling all of the Exit Five podcast production.
They give you unlimited podcast editing and strategy for your B2B podcast.Get unlimited podcast editing and on-demand strategy for one low monthly cost. Just upload your episode, and they take care of the rest.Visit hatch.fm to learn more - Visa fler
