![Ep 32: Linda Shider [P-FUNK/GARRY SHIDER]](https://is3-ssl.mzstatic.com/image/thumb/Podcasts124/v4/de/a3/2d/dea32d91-7b17-b43d-6350-1adcb355c1a0/mza_3141148681661237101.png/250x250bb.jpg)
Avsnitt
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When singer/musician/songwriter LINDA SHIDER met the folks in Parliament-Funkadelic, she was working as a stewardess for Pan Am. A friend of hers had just moved to San Francisco, so she invited Linda to come visit. That friend in turn introduced her to a woman who was dating Bernie Worrell, wizard of the boards, and from there she became acquainted with the rest of the funk family, including GARRY SHIDER, whom she wound up hanging out with at a party in L.A. Linda “Legz” had a boyfriend at the time, but she had already been an admirer of the band. “To me, they were like the black Rolling Stones,” she says. “Their aura… their vibe… They were just so intense, and you know they were real sexy onstage.”
Garry kept making comments about Linda and trying to make moves, but she would always rebuff him. Then one day, when the band was at a hotel, some guy came rushing in with a gun, looking for George Clinton, who may or may not have been with his girl. Garry swooped in to protect Linda from the ensuing gunfire by pushing her into a phone booth. He was her hero, and they decided to be a couple soon after.
She went on the road with him–following the tour bus in her car, or flying in for certain gigs. Then she joined them onstage for the first time–at Madison Square Garden. She even wound up on the cover of Rock & Soul magazine. But she wasn’t just some random hanger-on in the entourage. She was a leader with a deep background in civil rights advocacy who had fronted her own band, Legz, belting out heavy rock tunes like “Back in Black” by AC/DC. They also released the epic single “It Don’t Come Easy,” a impressively intricate and gooey deep cut which exhibits her complex compositional chops.
Indeed, this particular skill led to her becoming one of the very few credited woman songwriters in P-Funk history. It all started with a baby grand which lived in a hallway at United Sound in Detroit, where most of the P-Funk stuff was recorded. A gifted pianist, she just sat down and started playing. Somebody’s ears perked up. “George came by and he said ‘Hm, I like that,’” she recalls. “And he said, ‘Garry… figure out the chords and stuff and let’s go record that bad boy… I think Ima use that for Parlet.’”
Garry and the fellas did just that, and a unique track of music began to take form, a mid-tempo, haunting yet poppy combo of funk and prog rock. “Once I heard the whole musical thing gelling,” she continues, “that’s when I came up with the lyrics.” The tune sounded like it was coming from outer space, but she didn’t have to look far for inspiration. “It was a love song,” she says. “A lot of stuff that Garry and I did [was] that kind of material because we were so in love with each other. You know, we were hot and heavy and we just kinda like shared it with people.” The song was called “Are You Dreaming?” and arrived to the world as part of Parlet’s classic debut, the Pleasure Principle.
Mrs. Shider was also part of another momentous event in P history: the birth of Garry’s iconic stage outfit, or perhaps we can call it a uniform: the diaper, man. But was it an actual diaper? “It was always a towel,” reveals Linda. “They’d stay at the Holiday Inn a lot, so it has the Holiday Inn logo down the middle.” The story goes that Garry decided to give it a try after seeing George put one on that one time. Garry chose to combine the diaper look with a pacifier and some thigh-high boots. Everyone responded so positively that the simple ensemble stuck thereafter. But did Garry wear underwear under there? “No he did not,’ laughs Linda. “Sometimes the willy would kinda pop out if the diaper was too small… It was kinda scary sometimes as well, you know what was gonna happen… ‘Oh, god. Here we go.’ All the groupies would be like ‘Yes!’”
Like his lovely spouse, Garry Shider was a particularly loyal funk soldier, the only one who stayed with George while all the other members were coming and going–from the day he and Boogie Cordell Mosson left United Soul to join the P, until the unfortunate day that he passed. And as bandleader for (at least) 35 years, Mr. Shider was the herald of the P, the one who would kick off every show, sometimes just playing a little guitar first, then taking the crowd to the highest heights with his golden voice.
Even after saying all of that, it is hard to describe what Garry has fully done for that band and its history. “In the studio, he was the vocal arranger,” says Linda. “He’d produce. Most of the time George was off doing drugs somewhere or sleeping with some chick.” But despite her husband's massive contribution to the history and songbook of Parliament-Funkadelic, he always remained humble. As Linda explains, “One of his favorite sayings was ‘I’m no better than my surroundings.’ He said that all the time… He was like ‘I can’t do what I’m doing unless there’s people around me who are keepin up.’’ This philosophy tied in nicely with another one of his trusty sayings: ‘Get in where you fit in.’ To his wife, this meant: “Don’t oversing. Don’t overplay… Just kinda blend, go with the flow. He knew how to get the best out of people.”
Alas, Garry’s humility was perhaps his greatest weakness. Linda was constantly trying to get him to stick up for himself, but always to no avail. “I could make deals for Garry with other people, but he would never let me confront George about maybe a pay increase or something like that,” she laments. “He’d say, ‘You’re gonna turn him off, and it’s gonna probably blow up in your face anyway, so just leave that alone.’” Case in point: Garry was once offered $1 million to replace Lionel Ritchie when he left the Commodores! (George was paying Garry $150 a show at the time). “I said ‘Garry, he just offered you a million dollars,’”she remembers. “‘And you’re gonna turn that down?’ And he would do that every time someone else came up and offered him another option.”
Still, Garry lived his adult life doing exactly what he wanted to do, and not a lot of folks can say that. “He loved being in that group,” says Linda, “and he had a thing for George, like a father kind of relationship – even though it was one-sided… When he first met Garry, Garry was like 16. He wined and dined him… And once he got into the group, he just used him like he used everybody else.” In the end, Linda begged her husband not to go on the road, but he was there to the very end.
Nowadays, since Funk doesn’t really have a retirement fund, Ms. Linda still keeps busy. She paints, makes jewelry and is part of annual the Funkateer’s Ball in Bethesda, MD every September. She also continues to write, going so far as to create the funky comic book, DIAPERMAN, featuring Garry as the far-out titular superhero. “I always remembered when Garry was floating on that thin wire over the stadiums and coliseums and stuff, how scary it was,” she says, explaining how she came up with the concept. “I felt like, since he was the one that volunteered to do it, that he earned some credit for that… And it was his 70th birthday in July, so I figured it was a good time to do it.”
In this wide-ranging and extremely candid interview, Mrs. Shider talks about her days as a preferred extra in Robocop and other Hollywood movies, her work with Stokely Carmichael and run-ins with the Klan, and how much she loved to sing “Red Hot Mama” onstage. She also reveals details about her husband’s final days, her efforts to preserve his legacy, why ladies have always been important to P-Funk, and how badly George ruined that one song they did.
Produced and Hosted by Ace Alan
Executive Producer Scott Sheppard
w/ Content Produced by Linda Shider
Website, Merch & Graphics by 3chards
Sound Engineered by Grace Coleman @ Different Fur Studios – SF, CA
Filmed by Domenique Scioli w/ Don Scioli for ZAN Media
Sound & Video Editing, MIxing & Graphics by Nick “WAES” Carden for Off Hand Records – Oak, CA
w/ thanks to Christian Low, Shaunna Hall, Dawn Silva, & Chris Lander
Featuring:
“It Don’t Come Easy” by Legz w/ Linda Shider
“Desert Flower” by Children of Production feat. Linda Shider, Garry Shider, & Gary “Mudbone” Cooper
“I Remember” from Tale of Two Funkys feat. Garry Shider & Linda Shider
“Glory of Love” from Tale of Two Funkys feat. Linda Shider
“V.I.P” by the Neon Romeoz
Copyright © 2023 Isaac Bradbury Productions
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When DAWN SILVA – (Brides of Funkenstein, P-Funk, GAP Band, All My funky Friends] – shopped her autobiography, The FUNK QUEEN to book publishers, they didn’t exactly grasp the entire vision. “Everybody said the same thing,” she says. “‘You can’t do it.’” This is because the OG funkateer had created something you don’t see on shelves every day. “Mine is not only a table book with classic photos,” she explains. “It also has an autobiography, and there‘s about maybe five books within that one book.” Gathering the photos was a tale unto itself, starting with a man by the name of Steve Labelle, an ex-police officer turned photographer who traveled with Parliament Funkadelic from 1976 to 1981. “He was a fanatic,” she recalls. “So he went out on the road with us for all those years and he took all these photos… His health took a turn for the worse and he had been sitting on those photos for about 30 years… So he asked me to make him a promise that, if he sent those photos to me to me, I would put them in my book.”
So she raised the capital and had it manufactured herself—a seven pound (!) hardcover masterpiece in the form of a beautifully printed, glossy package containing over 500 pages of rich funk history, way more than knee deep with amazing and tragic tales, as well as brushes with funk and soul greatness that will inspire ladies young and old while imbuing the fellas with a greater respective for Dawn’s legacy. And just like everything else in her storied career, she had done exactly what the powers that be had said she couldn’t do. “I took a chance because everyone said I couldn’t do it and it wouldn’t work,” she confirms. “And it’s working.”
Taking chances is what made Dawn a professional singer in the first place. As a young lady, her first major singing gig was as a member of a latterday version of Sly & the Family Stone. Then she jumped ship—mothership that is—and, along with other funk queens whom Dawn calls “thoroughbreds”—she appeared across all P-Funk platforms, from Parliament’s Motor Booty Affair and Funkentelechy vs the Placebo Syndrome, to Funkadelic’s One Nation Under Groove and Uncle Jam Wants You. Her voice can also be heard all over such essential, stanky classics as Eddie Hazel’s beloved solo album Game, Dames & Guitar Thangs, and the Sweat Band and Horny Horns albums. Even more importantly, she took center stage to co-lead the BRIDES OF FUNKENSTEIN, whose funktastic albums Funk or Walk and Never Buy Texas from a Cowboy are still much admired today.
Dawn did eventually break away, however, recording and touring with artists such as Ice Cube, Roy Ayers, the GAP Band, and even the Platters. But her best work was not behind her. She decided to put the album out herself on her own independent label. She also expanded her reach by being an early adopter of online forums—where a million plus fans could follow her directly—and entered into indie licensing deals in places like Holland, Germany, France, Japan, China, Thailand, and Sierra Leone. “I ended up selling over a quarter of a million CDs out of my kitchen,” she says, “from a ‘dead’ market, supposedly.” If all that weren’t impressive enough for a woman in funk, her promotional activity overseas led to a headlining gig (!) at the mammoth North Sea Jazz Festival in the Netherlands alongside Chaka Khan, Herbie Hancock, and the Yellowjackets. And by the way: Funky Friends is still selling today. “I proved to the naysayers, to corporate record companies in the states that here was a very viable market for the funk,” Dawn surmises proudly. “Actually, it’s even bigger today than it was then. That’s why I continue on.”
In this thoughtful, revealing, and illuminating interview, Dawn promotes the legacy of other fem funk legends, from Malia Franklin to Gail Muldrow, and how they were instrumental in pushing P-Funk to the top of the heap despite not getting the recognition they are still due. She also reveals how the Sly Stone Fam paid more and was better organized than the Clinton camp, and recalls how the late, great Glenn Goins taught her to sing funky lyrics with character. On top of all that, Dawn discusses why her friend James Baker’s New Birth was one of the most influential self-contained Black bands in funk history, exciting news about her plans to finally put out certain unreleased material, and the importance of her African-Indigenous-European lineage.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Executive Producer Scott Sheppard
w/ Content Produced by Dawn Silva
Website & Graphics by 3chards
Recorded & Filmed @Different Fur Studios, San Francisco
Engineered by Grace Coleman
Video shot by Cedric Letsch w/ Jarrett Rogers
Video & Sound Editing + Graphics by Nick “WAES” Carden for Off Hand Records, Oakland
Intro song “Inertia” by Ace Alan (feat. Stymie, Mojo Powell, Chris Powell, and Steve Krchniak) from the album A Wiggle In Time
Also featuring “I’d Rather Be With You,” “Break Me Off,” & “All My Funky Friends” by Dawn Silva from the album All My Funky Friends
Xtra special thanx to: Shaunna Hall, Henry Mayers, Chris Campbell, Larry Dominoe, Tracy ‘Alan,’ and New Rising Publishing
an Issac Bradbury Production © 2022
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Saknas det avsnitt?
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As an undergrad at Cal Berkeley in the early 80s, RICKEY VINCENT— (History of Funk show and book/ Party Music/ Phool 4 the Funk)— stumbled into a music history course. It was quite dense with Black culture, but on the very last day of the 2nd semester, the teacher came to class with his scratchy James Brown 45s, including “Superbad.” Young Rickey found this to be exciting yet problematic. “‘If I taught a class like that,’ he thought to himself, ‘I would start with James Brown!”
This proved to be a good call, because there seemed to be a certain point on the timeline where all pontification on Black culture inexplicably stopped. “There’s all this writing about blues and soul and the 60s and civil rights,” explains Rickey. “I got no problems with that.” But the 1970s brought a new priority that had yet to be expounded upon. “It’s about the Bomb!” he declares. “It’s about the funk… Where’s the chapter about putting it on the One? Where’s the chapter on James Brown changing the language and the rhythm and putting it all down? No one had written about that.”
Ultimately, what we got was a lot: the HISTORY OF FUNK radio show — a celebration of all things stanky which is still going strong every Friday on KPFA.org — and FUNK: The Music, The People, and the Rhythm of the ONE — an essential tome which should be required reading in any self-respecting household. Indeed, thanks to Rick’s reflections, interviews, and vinyl archeology, we learn about the Five Dynasties of Funk — beginning with the Period of Unification — the Tendencies of Funk, the “heterogenous sound ideal,” and how James Brown invented extended play, changing our expectations of what a song could do. Overall, the professor found that the Funk is not just a look or a sound, but also a particular approach that nobody had really spoken on yet. “Cuz there’s ways to say it,” explains Rick in regards to describing the music, which is more like a movement, organically unifying elements of rock, jazz, blues and gospel. “You can say it from an ethnomusicological point of view… [or] you can look at it as a Black Power thing… These folks were saying ‘All of this is ours.’”
We are honored to have Rickey Vincent grace us with his essence, and can’t wait to hang with him some more in the future. In this wide-ranging, thought-provoking interview, Rickey talks about how funk artists “arranged the rage,” the importance of visual artists such as Pedro Bell and Overton Lloyd, and why Jimi Hendrix was a fully formed, fully realized Black man who changed the sound of the Isley Brothers forever. Rick also discusses the rise and importance of Sly Stone, how funk artists of today are decentralized and resigned to a life of playing off the grid, and why we need a new Don Cornelius. If all that weren’t enough, we also have two performances by the FUNKANAUTS with emcees DUB ESQUIRE, MWNSTR and MEL YEL. Funky New Year to all!
an Issac Bradbury Production © 2022
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“I remember I got paid $20 for a gig, man,” says RUSTEE ALLEN, funk bassist extraordinaire, first introduced to the world via the transcendent soul staple FRESH by none other than Sly & the Family Stone. “I thought I made a ton of money!” he laughs. “I didn’t even know you even got paid for playing,” agrees his good friend and fellow Bay Area legend LEVI SEACER JR., a guitarist who went from playing hardcore jazz in local clubs to touring the world with PRINCE and his New Power Generation. “That’s how innocent I was about it… When I got my first check I’m like ‘What’s this?’”
Rustee was first spotted by the Sly camp as a youngster playing in support of local legend Johnny Talbot, much admired by all the top Bay Area funkateers at the time. Along with drummer WILLIE WILD, (who would later be part of the original lineup of Graham Central Station), Rustee was chosen to back up LITTLE SISTER, an offshoot of Sly’s Fam featuring Vet Stone and piloted by Freddie Stone. Next thing Rustee knew, he was “auditioning” to join the Fam as a full-fledged member—in front of 30,000 people in Virginia! Soon after that, Rustee was in the studio for the Fresh sessions, laying down tunes in basically one take each. “The first takes are the best ones anyway,” says Rustee.
As for Levi, he spent his youth gigging at spots like Earl’s Solano Club in the East Bay, playing jazz with ladies such as Rosie Gaines and Sheila Escovedo. “Playing was like taking a glass of water,” says Levi. “Just natural.” His confidence and skill got him noticed by Don Cornelius of Soul Train fame, who put him to work. Then one day Levi stopped by an audition that Escovedo — now known as Sheila E — was holding for bass players. Though Levi was a guitar man, she asked him to take the gig once she had heard him play “A Love Bizarre” on the four-string. This of course put him in the same orbit as PRINCE himself— who would eventually bring him into the fold not only as a player, but also as writer and producer. Like Rustee, Levi had found himself thrust into the spotlight, breathing the rarefied air of an internationally acclaimed artist with a new band.
Rustee’s return to Aced Out is a pivotal moment for us, as he was our very first guest for our pilot episode just a little over four years ago. In this inspirational interview, Rustee and Levi describe what made Sly and Prince amazing bandleaders, and what it was really like within those soul circles. As well, Rustee describes why his mother told him he was her most adventurous child, and what it was like onstage and off during Sly’s Lifetime Achievement Award performance at the 2006 Grammys, while Levi breaks down how Prince was like a “cool computer” and why every musician in Minneapolis hated the New Power Generation—at first, that is. If all that weren’t enough, the purple brothas also bring a band in the studio to perform Rustee’s single “You’re the One!”
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
Executive Producer Scott Sheppard
Website and Graphics by 3chards
Engineered by Grace Coleman at Different Fur Studios, San Francisco CA
Video & Sound Editing + Interview Mix & Graphics by Nick “Waes” Carden for Off Hand Records, Oakland CA
Video Production by Saboor Bidar
Musical Performance:
TONY PROVIDENCE — drums
CARL WHEELER — keys
MORGAN DAY – guitar
CARL NORDE — vocals
LEVI SEACER JR. — guitar, vocals
RUSTEE ALLEN — bass, vocals
Musical Performance Mix by Levi Seacer Jr.
Rap verses by Corey the Great
an Issac Bradbury Production © 2022
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visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and read more
At just age 20, STEVIE PANNELL, then strictly a bassist, wrote a song in his grandmother’s basement. He thought it was kinda special, so he went to Detroit and managed to present the tune to a man by the name of George Clinton. “It was right after ‘Knee Deep’” Stevie recalls. The funk doctor dug what Stevie had come up with, so he told the kid to cut a demo. He fulfilled this request, including Jerome Ali on guitar. When George heard that version, he gave it the green light. “He said, ‘Go ahead and cut it for real,’” says Stevie.
So they did just that— at Superdisc studios. Ron Dunbar was enlisted to produce the track, vocalist Jeanette Washington helped Stevie work out some lyrics, and the Horny Horns — featuring Fred Wesley, Maceo Parker, Richard “Kush” Griffith, and Rick Gardner – were brought in to enhance the mix with that bona fide P-Funk flavor. “Being almost like a teenager and you got the Horny Horns playing on your stuff,” says Stevie, “I felt pretty good.” The song became “FUNK UNTIL THE EDGE OF TIME,” an ooey gooey stank classic featured on the album Play Me Or Trade Me (1980) by PARLET, (and deemed worthy of inclusion on the Best of Parlet compilation). And that’s how Stevie officially got pulled into the Parliament Funkadelic Thang. He felt like family almost immediately. “It was fun,” he reports. “Too much fun sometimes.”
Throughout these years and beyond, Stevie — who had been playing bass since he got a Sears model at age 15 — started getting more and more into playing the guitar. For him, the transition was natural. “You know, you’re playing with a band and you put your instrument down and everybody kinda switches up at halftime, so to speak,” he explains. “The bass player will go get on the drums; the guitar player will go get on the bass … There was always a guitar just laying around… You just kinda start playin it.” And the man plays it well — just check out the three funktastic live performances from this very episode for living proof! And keep an eye out for his upcoming EP, simply entitled STEVIE P, which also features his brother, accomplished player Chris Bruce.
And though the man prefers to let the music do the talking, he did rap with us a bit as well. In this down-to-earth and jam-filled episode, Stevie recalls watching Bootsy Collins lay bass tracks for “Getting to Know You” from the Clones of Dr. Funkenstein, explains why his younger brother Chris Bruce is his teacher, and describes being mentored by such heavyweights as Garry Shider, Lige Curry, and Billy “Bass” Nelson. Pannell also talks about his favorite gear, his friendship with Kevin Goins — (Quazar, brother to the late Glenn Goins) — and that time Bernie Worrell’s freaky keyboard lines scared his mom out of the studio during the recording of Tales of Kid Funkadelic.
an Issac Bradbury Production © 2022
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“Keepin that funk alive, to me, there’s no more of an important mission.” So declares PATRYCE “CHOC’LET” BANKS, cofounder of one of the most important bands in all of funk history: Graham Central Station. “That’s my mission,” she promises. “To keep the funk alive until the wheels fall off.” And she has been doing just that ever since the formation of the band’s classic lineup with her former boo, uber innovative Sly & the Fam bassist Larry Graham, along with drummer Willie Wild, keyboardist Hershall Happiness, organist Robert “Butch” Sam, & guitarist David Dynamite. Together they hit the ground running from the jump. Word got out immediately that the band was superbad—folks would even get dressed up just to check out their rehearsals! Their constant practicing and performing at spots like the Orphanage in San Francisco led to the creation of their groundbreaking self-titled debut—(Choc’let’s personal favorite).
Yet even the most diehard funkateers might not realize that, before it was called Graham Central Station, the band was originally called HOT CHOC’LET, formed as a project for her to get down with while Larry was on the road. But after Graham had finally decided to relinquish his Family Stone membership, he joined the group, which then became his namesake. Choc’let wasn’t mad about the new moniker, though. “I was with it because… how could you go wrong with Larry Graham in the group?” she says. “I think it was even my idea maybe a little bit.”
Graham’s breaking away from the Sly camp meant GCS could seriously get to work. “We would rehearse all the time,” remembers Choc’let. “Almost every night… And we were just getting tighter and tighter.” And audiences were easily falling in love with the band’s celebratory intensity. “The music that we played was deeply infused with gospel music,” she confirms. “So that gave it the feeling of a revival… because of the way that it makes you feel and the way it gets you caught up.” In fact, audience members from San Francisco to Philly to D.C. would bring tambourines, whistles, and whatever percussion instrument they could find so they could get in on the action. “They’d be playing along with us,” she says.
Choc’let’s latest appearance on Aced Out—her third—is a superfunk extravaganza. In addition to another great interview, she performs not one, but TWO Bay Area funk classics live in the studio with Jay, Ace and other members of the Funkanauts fam. And in case you were wondering, the answer is yes—she brought her Rhythm King aka F-U-N-K Box. In this back-to-to school, in-person interview, Choc talks about why she thinks Sly was a better bandleader than Larry, the highs and lows of her reunion tour with GCS in the mid-90s, and why she dislikes the album version of “I Can’t Stand the Rain.” She also reveals how Willie and Hershall originally came up with “The Jam” at rehearsal, how she recruited her old friend Butch to join the group, and why the Bay Area brand of funk has never been duplicated.
an Issac Bradbury Production © 2022
visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more
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visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more
“As long as you’re consistent, things can happen.” So says solo artist JAY DOUBLE YOU!—who began his funk career as a pro drummer in the late 70s at Don Davis’ legendary United Sound Studios in Detroit. His golden opportunity came in the form of a session with none other than OG Parliament vocalist Fuzzy Haskins, who had landed his own solo deal at Westbound. “Fuzzy, he gave me my first major session,” says Jay Dub, then known as Jim Wright. “He lived not too far from my mom’s house.” Indeed, for young Jim, Parliament-Funkadelic had been a family affair ever since grade school, when he first got to know Bernie Worrell, George Clinton and the rest of the P-Funk camp through his big sister, vocalist Debbie Wright.
Jay Dub remembers that first official session well. “Fuzzy was gonna play drums,” Dub explains, “cause normally he played drums on his stuff… I happened to be in the studio… I was like ‘Hey Fuzz. Wassup man? Can I give it a go?’ Me knowin’ him, he said ‘Okay Jim.’” Even so, young Wright knew full well that a chance wasn’t a guarantee, as friendship and nepotism didn’t get you very far when it came to laying down the funk. “You had to be quick, ‘cause money is being spent,” he explains. “You didn’t get too many chances.”
So Jay Dub went over to the drums and sat down, with Glenn Goins, Garry Shider, & Cordell “Boogie” Mosson holding their instruments and staring at him like: Why is Debbie’s little brother in here when we’re about to record? But little did they know, the Kid was ready. “They counted off, and I hit it in one take, man,” reports Jay. “Pocket. Timing. Solid. And from there I end up doing two more songs that night with ‘em. I would do a song, they would say ‘Take a break. Let us mix. We’ll call you for the next one.’” Seven hours later and $400 richer, young Mr. Wright had been fully matriculated into P University.
Word spread to George C about what went down. “Fuzzy gave me that shot, and from there I guess George heard it,” recalls Jay Dub. “And next thing I knew, I was called down to the studio.” Significantly, Dr. Funkenstein wound up pulling Jay Dub into a marathon session with the nimble-fingered bassist Rodney “Skeet” Curtis, recording songs that were turned into funky headwreckers which wound up on such classic records as Parlet’s Pleasure Principle and Bernie Worrell’s All the Woo in the World. All of this established Jay Dub’s reputation as a pocket drummer, and some serious heads within the camp were starting to take notice.
Yet, by the time the 1980s came along, the wind was starting to blow in a different direction. The drum machine, once a novelty, was becoming more significant in the music industry by the day, predicting a cruel fate for live drummers. A still quite young Mr. Wright saw the writing on the studio wall and decided it was time to expand his skills. Enter Don Davis, owner of United Sound and mentor to local talent. “He was great to me,” Dub remembers of Don. “Anyone that had enough confidence, he would give you a shot… He would at least throw you in the studio to do some demos.” And when Jay Dub found out producers got paid double scale, he really got inspired.
So he improved his keyboard skills, grabbed the mic, and began to record his own ideas instead of someone else’s. “It’s a growth thing until the end, basically,” he says of his evolution toward becoming a singer/songwriter. “You’re always learning. You’re always trying to adjust if you choose to move forward.” As it turned out, part of moving forward was getting out of his deal with Davis in order to go independent. From there, Jim, now Jay Double, put out his own singles and LPs. He even started his own clothing line.
We first met and talked to Jay Double You! for Episode 5 of Aced Out back in the fall of 2019, when we were still a struggling little podcast trying find our footing. He gave us a fascinating and fun interview that focused heavily on his P-Funk days but also featured some of his super dope solo work. But the “fun with a K” didn’t stop there, not by a long shot. As it turned out, Dub not only enjoyed his moment in the spotlight, but also connected spiritually with Aced Out’s mission and raison d’etre: to give props where props are due.
“It’s hard for musicians to give each other credit,” laments Jay Dub. “I say, ‘Genius, recognize genius.’” And we here at Aced Out know firsthand that the man practices what he preaches.
Indeed, Dub recognized the opportunity to share the wealth and, with our blessing and gratitude, got on the phone to recruit some old friends for the cause. Consequently, the man has been an integral part of Aced Out’s ever-expanding body of work, garnering us classic interviews with Joe “Pep” Harris of Undisputed Truth and the late Robin Russell of New Birth, as well as his fellow P-Funk alumni Rick Gardner of the Horny Horns, Steve Boyd, Andre Foxxe, and Grady Thomas.
For this second appearance on Aced Out, Jay Dub traveled all the way from Suwanee, GA to join us in the Bay Area. In this intimate, in-person interview, Dub describes his transition from player to producer, explains how his subconscious guides his songwriting process, and reveals the secret to Tiki Fulwood’s high-hat technique. Jay Dub also raps about why Junie Morrison loved singing over his drum tracks, learning rudiments from Tyrone Lampkin, and that time he made George Clinton bacon and eggs for breakfast. If all that weren’t enough, Jay Stone & Ace Alan and a buncha Bay Area heavy hitters (listed below) help Jay Dub perform the title track to his funktastic solo joint, I’ll See You Soon (2001)!
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
Executive Producer: Scott Sheppard
w/ Content Produced by Jay Double You!
Website, Art & Graphics by 3chards
w/ major props to Nat CollinsLive Version of “I’ll See You Soon” Featuring:
Jay Double You! — clavinet, vocals
Femi Andrades — vocals
Vanessa Love — vocals
Alan Williams — trombone
Al Lazard — sax
Ocea Savage — synth
Kyle “Coyote” Collins — synth percussion
Chris McGrew — drums
Jay Stone — guitar
Ace Alan — bassEngineered by Chris McGrew for Wally’s Hyde Out @ Hyde Street Studios, San Francisco
Video by RoAn Gibson for X Racer Productions
With thanks to Maryzelle Ungo
Sound Editing, Video Editing & Graphics by Nick “WAES” Carden for Off Hand Records in Oakland
Theme song “I Can Never Be” by the FUNKANAUTS from the album Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth
an Issac Bradbury Production © 2022
visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more
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visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more
In the early 1980s, when percussionist extraordinaire JUAN ESCOVEDO was in his early 20s, he was working for his cousin as a landscaper at different homes around the Bay Area, CA. However, he also just so happened to be in heavy rotation on the then-very-popular MTV, appearing as part of his sister Sheila E’s band in the video for her smash hit “Glamorous Life” along with their siblings Zina and Peter Michael. The song got played so much that people started to recognize Juan while he was mowing lawns, though he felt too awkward to admit that it was him. It got to the point where he called his sis, talking bout: “Sheila, everybody’s noticing me now because of the video. You gotta hire me.”
As it turned out, the request wasn’t unwarranted. In fact, Sheila’s mentor and co-producer PRINCE had already been scratching his chin regarding her live show, trying to figure how he could get her to step out from behind the timbales and take the mic center stage. Having another percussionist who could recreate her patterns onstage would be ideal. So Juan got the gig! And like a true Escovedo, he not only knew how to navigate life as a hired gun, but also how to keep getting called back. “You never want to overplay to where they tell you ‘Shut up,’” he explains. “Or ‘Be quiet’ or ‘You’re playing too much.’ I’d rather somebody say ‘Can you give me more?’”
These days, Juan’s musical journey has reached its apotheosis with the release of his first solo album, The J, a crowning achievement that has been a long time coming. Co-written with Michael “Angel” Alverado, the album features Martin Kember of Color Me Badd, Andy Vargas of Santana, Juan’s longtime pal El DeBarge, and of course the “E” Family. In this engaging and heart-filled interview, Juan recounts his early love for the trumpet, explains why he used to be called “Goldie,” and describes how they put together those amazing outfits he wore while touring with Prince. Juan also reveals his thoughts on recording with a click track, explains why he has a standing invitation to play with El DeBarge any time he comes to town, and discusses working with kids through Elevate Oakland, a program intended to bring music back to public schools.
visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more
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** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
In the late 80s, when wonder woman of funk and rock bass STARR CULLARS was in her senior year in college, Prince—who was then in the midst of working on the Lovesexy album—offered her a spot with his crew. This was after a grueling audition process, in which Starr muscled her way into Paisley Park, bum-rushed the legendary Alan Leeds with her demo, then finally got the chance to jam in B flat with Sheila E., Dr. Fink and the Purple One himself. Starr was young, hungry and had been waiting for this opportunity for a long time, so you might not believe what she told Prince when he finally made the offer. “I got more respect by saying ‘No,’” she says. She had seen the writing on the wall, that she would wind up as some kind of concubine like Vanity or Apollonia. Thus, Starr said she’d catch him on the flipside.
Fast forward just a little bit later, and Starr had become “AllStarr”— a P-Funk Allstar that is. Indeed, Cullars had been swooped up by the George Clinton camp. Funny thing was, George was signed to the Paisley Park label at the time! So when Prince saw her with his hero Dr. Funkenstein, he tripped out. Suddenly, the grass had gotten a helluva lot greener. “George and Prince actually started a war over me,” she recalls. “Prince wanted myself, Michael Hampton, and Belita Woods to come over, and George was like ‘Hell no. She’s Funkadelic. She ain’t goin’ nowhere!’” Well, actually Starr went a lot of places—the Lollapalooza tour for starters—with the late Garry Shider as band director, guitarist Blackbyrd McKnight as conductor, and bassist Lige Curry as mentor.
It is also important to remember that becoming an official funkateer is no small feat, as the often underestimated Parliament-Funkadelic songbook is a motha to master. “You’re in the group, so it’s your responsibility to learn this catalog,” she confirms. “You need to know all 50,000 of these songs.” She knew she was being taken to school, so she paid attention, made sure she did her homework, and turned it in right on time. “It is a responsibility that is put upon you to step up to the challenge,” she says. “It’s a university. Straight up.” Her official tenure ended in 2002, but she will always be a member in good standing of the “funk mob.” In fact, she recently attended George’s 80th birthday shindig.
Upon completing this master class, Starr fronted a power trio, opening shows for Bad Brains and her buddy Vernon Reid’s Living Colour. Thanks to her uncle’s AM radio, Cullars has been a hard rocker since her girlhood days in Philly, studying the low-end machinations of cats like Geddy Lee of Rush and Chris Squire of Yes, whom she calls an “underrated, unsung genius.” However, as she tells it, she wasn’t officially accepted into the rock genre until 2011, when she appeared as a cast member in the 2nd season of the VH1 reality show Rock N’ Roll Fantasy Camp. She auditioned by singing and playing “Tom Sawyer,” then was teamed up with Mark Hudson, Grammy-winning producer of Aerosmith and Ozzy Osbourne. She rocked the gig so hard, at one point Paul Stanley of Kiss had to jump on her mic and join her for a duet.
Starr’s latest solo joint, LIVING GALAXY proves her rock royalty status, with positive power anthems that stretch out like “Let Your Star Shine” and “I’ll Kick Your Motha Funkin Ass.” Her lyrics certainly reflect her superhero stage persona, with advice and affirmations distilled in a cold can of whoop-ass. And this femme fatale of the 5-string has a lot of wisdom to share. To young ladies considering a career in the music biz, she says: “Do not let anyone try to manipulate or convince you to do something that you know is adversely wrong to your being.”
And to musicians in general, she advises: “Stay true to your vison. Stay true to your path… And always remember: the Amazon warrior is there to protect and defend you and your vison of music. And I will kick somebody’s motherfunkin ass if they say different.”
Ms. Starr came up to the Bay from San Diego to grace us with her presence—and she brought her bass! In this entertaining and inspiring interview, Starr talks about what P-Funk drummers she’s worked with, how Rodney “Skeet” Curtis and Lige Curry encouraged her to start playing 5-string, and what it was like to play “Red Hot Mama” onstage with Buddy Miles. She also discusses being hated on by “jealous” Duff McKagan of Guns & Roses, working on an upcoming documentary about the women of P-Funk with Malia Franklin’s son Seth, and that time she met Jack Bruce of Cream and he gave her “permission” to play “Sunshine of Your Love.” As if all that weren’t enough, she also performs a couple songs LIVE!
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
Camera by Chris Weldon
Website, Editing, & Art by 3chards
…but we couldn’t have done it without Scott Sheppard
Theme song “I Can Never Be” by The Funkanauts, from the album Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth. Get it where music is sold. RIP Brotha P.
** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
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** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
“The funk is the stench that you smell after you work really hard.” So says MURGA BOOKER, drummer, percussionist, shaman & card-carrying funkateer. And he would know. After all, from 1980 to ‘85, Booker was deeply embedded in the P-Funk camp, working with George Clinton and everyone else around Disc Ltd. Studios in Detroit. He was snatched up by Rubber Band drummer Frankie “Cash” Waddy and Bootsy Collins himself after they had heard him play the Moroccan clay drums at his pad. They were also impressed by Booker’s work with Weather Report, bassist Michael Henderson, and Detroit soul group the Fantastic Four. By then, Muruga had figured out how to make himself indispensable to producers and bandleaders alike. “I saw everybody in Detroit at Motown playing congas and bongos and maybe some timbales.” He explains. “So I went to Israeli and Greek doumbek and Moroccan clay drums… By having those instruments, I was not in any direct competition.”
This explains the sounds of albums like the Electric Spanking of War Babies, which you might have noticed has a lot more varied and freaky percussion in the mix than Funkadelic records previous. Muruga’s funky hands are also busy on Clinton solo joints such as Computer Games (1982) and You Shouldn’t Nuf Bit Fish (1983), the P-Funk AllStars’ Urban Dance Floor Guerillas (1983), and the lesser known gem, a Bootsy project called GodMama (1981).
But that’s not all. Being around George during this period also put Murugua in direct proximity to Sly Stone, whom Booker was able to entice to play bass (!) on his project, Muruga and the Soda Jerks, a quirky, New Wave-sounding version of the P signed and produced by Clinton. But Muruga’s contribution to Parliament-Funkadelic was not only musical but also medicinal. He served as the group’s masseuse and yoga instructor, teaching Bernie Worrell, George, Sly, et al breathing techniques in between bites of Booker’s mother’s paprikash.
But Muruga’s musical journey didn’t start with the P — not by a long shot. In fact, as a teenager in 1960, Steve (not yet Muruga) Booker already had a hit. The band was called the Low Rocks and the song was “Blueberry Jam,” a super-sped up reworking of “Blueberry Hill” by Fats Domino. “We were the young garage punks of the era” says Booker, who was recruited directly from the audience when the previous Low Rocks drummer abruptly quit at a house party. The gig wound up lasting only a year, but the band had some exciting opportunities, including backing up Little Stevie Wonder in a battle of the bands.
Soon after that, Steve Booker began to see the drums not just as an instrument but also as a theory of life. He basically moved into Detroit’s legendary blues and folk club the Chess Mate, where he would eventually become bandleader. There he would play hours-long drum solos every night. But the young Serbian stickman still lacked some key ingredients. One night, after he had finished yet another one of his extended excursions, a Black gentleman approached. “I see what you’re trying to do,” he told Booker. But rather then launching into a lecture, the man handed him a cassette tape of Drums of Passion by Nigerian drummer Babatunde Olatunji.
And just like that, Booker’s life changed. He spent the next two weeks in his mom’s living room, eight hours per day, dancing to Drums and seeing how the music made his body move. Things were starting to make sense. “If you do not love Africa or it’s people, then you cannot love the blues, or jazz, or rock and roll,” he says. The lessons came in handy when he played support for none other than John Lee Hooker, whom he grew to admire deeply. “I realized that Hooker was not just a blues man, but he was a spiritual ju ju man, a healer,” says Booker. “Also he was a storyteller… That comes from griot. The griot is the storyteller of the tribe.” The pairing of the two went so well they were featured as a double bill, “Hooker & Booker.”
Booker also had some of the best jams in his life at The Scene club in New York, where the top musicians of the day would go to let it all hang out musically when they weren’t in the studio or on tour. There the Band of Gypsys’ Buddy Miles served as a musical lightning rod of sorts. “When you go play the top clubs like The Scene,” Booker explains, “it’s top musicians going there, but jamming and intermingling and exchanging with each other… That’s the place where a George Clinton or a Sly Stone or a Mitch Mitchell or a Larry Coryell could go. But Buddy Miles… He was creating an atmosphere that drew all of those musicians like bees to honey.”
By the late 60’s into the 70s, Booker’s deep plunges into musical depths had evolved into an intense curiosity and appreciation for spiritual contemplation—even more so than many peers of the era. This phase of his journey truly began on Day 1 of the iconic Woodstock Festival, where he landed in a helicopter to perform with Tim Hardin. It was there that he found himself in the presence of Swami Satchidananda, with whom Booker would live in ashram for two years as a celibate monk. In fact, it was Satchidananda who gave Muruga his name.
As a result of such intense studies, Muruga became very adept at tuning in rather than tuning out, and adapting his more avant garde, exploratory tendencies to a centered principle. “A musician has to listen,” he explains. “Then you respond.” But he contends that he reached his highest plateau as a drummer once he mastered the concept of ambience and space, which he defines as: “to play the space as well as the note, and to create ambience with the space within the notes.” This seemingly unlikely marriage of freedom and discipline ultimately leads to Muruga’s theory of employing “law and grace” when serving up the Funk. “1-2-3-4 is a law,” he teaches. “On the one is the law… But grace is ‘I’m being in the oneness’ while I am playing.” In other words, the law guides you until you are ready to transcend it, to exist in the groove. “You must know this,” he insists. “Otherwise you don’t even know funk.”
Today, Muruga lives in Ann Arbor and is as jovial and active as ever, an orthodox priest and patented inventor of the Nada drum with a catalog of music that is deep and wide. In this expansive, inspiring and often hilarious interview, Muruga talks about how he used to add wah-wah’s and phasers to his cymbals in order to “wake people up” by reenacting the then-ongoing Vietnam War onstage—causing half an audience in the South to give him a standing ovation, and the other half to walk out. Muruga also talks about why the rhythmic concept of “the push and drag” is the essence of life, mistakes drummers tend to make when playing the blues, and why he got scared the first time he heard the drum machine. As if that weren’t enough, Muruga also describes being made fun of by Don Rickles for 20 minutes straight, the magic of Sly Stone’s recording techniques, why Richie Havens is an “illuminary,” and that time he jammed one-on-one with JIMI HENDRIX on bass.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Aaron Booker & Andre
Foxxe
Website & Art by 3chards
Engineered by Nick “Waes” Carden at the Blue Room in Oakland, CA
But we couldn’t have done it without Mawnstr and especially Scott SheppardIntro track “I Can Never Be” from Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth by the Funkanauts. Go get it wherever music is sold. RIP Brotha P.
Rest in Power ROBIN RUSSELL of New Birth
(Aug 27, 1952 — Sep 8, 2021)** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
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** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
The powerpack West Coast hip hop duo GOOCH GANG began out of necessity. Just over 10 years ago, LA-raised, longtime Bay Area Cali resident MWNSTR recorded a single with WAES, “Brutalizin.” When they realized the cut needed another verse, they instantly thought of KALIBAN, whom Mwnstr had known since the late 90s. That’s when he would see the dude cutting his teeth at open mics at spots like Leimert Park, South Central, and Inglewood.
But Kaliban’s approach was quite different, and it didn’t include putting his name on a signup sheet. “My theory was like: everybody and their mom were signin up for these open mics,” he explains. “So I’d wait for you outside really like the bully and splatter shit over the sidewalk.”
Mwnstr can confirm this. “There was super-talented people that would sign on the sheet and then battle onstage in these places,” he remembers. “This dude [Kaliban] was just like a fuckin weirdo. He’d pull up in the parking lot… He would go up to like cyphers and just bomb people — I’m talkin about people that had a name at the time. And he was goin at people’s throats.”
As for the verse that Kaliban wound up adding to Mwsntr’s track? “He just killed it.” Then it came time to take it to the stage. But there was a catch. “I’d always been in a group,” says Mwnstr. “I was in a group with P.E.A.C.E. of Freestyle Fellowship, and my other homey Dranged. I’d always be on someone else’s stuff… So I said ‘man I ‘m shouldering this whole shit. I need a capable other rapper with me.” So he commissioned Kal to ride with him on the Vans Warped Tour.
Now it was on. And before they made it back home, they had already come up with the group concept: they named themselves after “The Gooch,” an unseen but often spoken about schoolyard bully from the classic 80s sitcom Different Strokes starring Gary Coleman. Immediately afterward, they went into the studio and recorded what is still one of their dopest cuts: “Gin Rummy.”
Fast forward to 2021 and you got Gooch’s latest album, SWRVD, a banger that sounds like it was designed for live shows instead of a pair of headphones. And it shows both lyrically and sonically how serious they take their craft. Even more importantly, though there are most definitely no pop tunes on this release, the fellas exceed the expectations of your garden variety, present-day MCs.
In fact, for those who think they are entitled to hold a mic up to their faces, Kaliban offers some advice: “Don’t’ cheapen the sport because a lotta people put blood sweat in tears into this industry that we call hip hop. And I think what they’re doin right now is waterin it down and tryna act like anybody can do this. It’s like ‘No. Everybody can’t do this shit. ‘“
His partner in rhyme puts it a bit less diplomatically: “Man, fuck 99.9% of this shit,” Mwnstr surmises. “It’s not ‘cause I can’t relate or I’m out of touch… I just like originality—Period.”
In this candid and occasionally off-the-rails interview, Mwnstr and Ace discuss how they first met and became friends over 20 years ago, and Kaliban speaks on what it’s like having a brand new baby girl, aka “Super Poops.” The fellas also discuss the lack of diversity in today’s music industry, a future Gooch Gang/Funkanauts collaboration, how hipsters played out beards and face tattoos, and why Mwnstr wants to kick Adam Levine in the small of his back.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Jay Double You!
Website & Art by 3chards
Engineered by Nick “Waes” Carden at the Blue Room in Oakland, CABut we couldn’t have done it without Mawnstr and especially Scott Sheppard
** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
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** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
Lifetime Achievement Grammy winner, Rock and Roll Hall of Famer, and Original P-FunkateerGRADY THOMAS’ first job in the music biz wasn’t all that glamorous. “I had a job working at a record plant,” he explains. “I used to drive a truck around to all the stores delivering records and stuff.” One day, something amazing snuck up on him. “I was driving” he remembers, “and all of a sudden, I heard our record on the radio.” That song was “(I Wanna) Testify” by the PARLIAMENTS, a little doo wop group he had with his barbershop buddies Calvin Simon, Fuzzy Haskins, Ray Davis, and George Clinton. Grady was so shocked he almost ran off the road. “I liked to have an accident,” he laughs. At a stop, he discovered that the single was among the records he was about to carry into the store. “That was the start of us going from local yokels to a respectable group,” he says.
Born 80 years ago in Newark, New Jersey, Grady was musically inclined from an early age. He started playing drums on pots and pans at 9, then moved on to bongos. His pops played the saxophone, so Grady told him he wanted to learn, too. His dad handed him the clarinet. Grady was definitively nonplussed. He couldn’t stand that “corny” sound. So he might as well sing. At Cleveland Junior High, he did just that with his buddy Calvin Simon—or “Big Cal” as “Shady” Grady calls him, “tall drink of water.”
But our story really begins with a hairdo all the brothers wanted back then: the process, where lye is used to straighten one’s curls. As a young man, Grady had one like any respectable soul singer, but it needed upkeep. “You’d get your hair done one week, and the next week your hair started falling apart,” Grady explains. “We had to go back and get a reset.” He usually went to his favorite spot, Supreme, but one day, in need of hairdo surgery once again, he found himself in a van parked in front of some dude’s house. There a barber reset Grady’s ‘do with nothing but a comb and a glass of water. “And that guy happened to be GC,” he says, aka George Clinton.
Sometime after that, Grady relocated to Plainfield, the Parliaments’ home base. They picked up Fuzzy Haskins from another band along the way, while Grady played the role of bass vocalist. But then they saw Ray Davis singing bass with another group and were blown away by his sound. They had to make room for him. “I told George… ‘Let me move up to baritone and see if we can get Ray,” explains Grady. “Ray always wanted to be with us, you know? I pulled Ray over with us and then we were all set.”
It’s important to remember that Grady was present for not only the formation of the Parliaments, but also their backing band, Funkadelic. A kid named Billy Nelson who hung around the barbershop was on guitar at first, but they needed someone new before he switched over to bass. Billy said he knew this guy named Eddie, so they had him come to Grady’s house to audition. “But you know what?” says Grady of the teenaged Eddie Hazel. “He wasn’t that doggone good… We told him ‘You sound good man, but don’t call us. We’ll call you.’” When Eddie came back sometime later, it was clear he had taken the criticism to heart. “Man, he was a terror,” recalls Grady of Hazel’s much improved guitar skills. “He was so bad.”
Most P-Funk fans know how the tale goes from there. The group’s humble vocal quintet origins began to blend with then give way to a whole new sound that was more about rockin FUNK. And from the self-titled Funkadelic and Parliament’s Osmium (1970), to the Clones of Dr. Funkenstein and Hardcore Jollies(1976), Grady had a blast taking it to the stage as part of the ever-expanding Parliament-Funkadelic caravan. “In them days, man, we was so happy and loving each other,” he says.
But throughout, there were red flags that weren’t always heeded in real time. According to Thomas, some vocal hooks that GC wound up taking credit for actually sprang forth at live shows. Examples of such jam-fueled compositions are “You and Your Folks, Me and My Folks,” “I Got A Thing, You Got A Thing,” and other anthems. “Some of them songs we started on stage,” confirms Grady. “Next thing I know, some smart guy went to the studio without us and finished them.”
Indeed, the joys of success often made it hard to see that his best interests weren’t always being taken into account, especially when it came to credit and money. “I was just enjoying myself, making people happy… and dropping acid,” says Grady. “I wasn’t thinkin about no business. I was out there — sex, drugs, and rock and roll. I didn’t have to work at General Motors… We were ridin around the country… That was such a wonderful time.”
But by the time the late 70s came around, things stopped feeling so wonderful. George had brought in so many band members and inter-related musical entities that the OGs felt pushed to the side, with little financial reward to show for it. So Fuzzy, Calvin, and Grady put together a group, got a deal, and released Connections & Disconnections in 1980, co-produced with Greg Errico, drummer for Sly & the Family Stone and producer of Betty Davis. (The album has since been reissued under the name Who’s a Funkadelic?)
The fact that they called the group Funkadelic turned out to be a legal issue that annoyed the hell out of George, but the album itself is a gooey headwrecker, with funktastic tracks like “Connections,” “Call the Doctor,” “Who’s a Funkadelic?” and “The Witch,” a Wizard of Oz-inspired, 10-minute opus of dopeness created mostly by Grady, who was encouraged to write something that celebrated their newfound freedom. On composing the lyrics, Thomas quips: “It wasn’t hard to do because at that time we were so relieved not to be handled by the witch.”
Grady would wind up going back to sing with the P-Funk All-Stars here and there, but eventually he broke off to start a group with the other fellas again. This time they brought Ray Davis along and dubbed the conglomerate Original P — all the Parliaments except GC. They did an album for Westbound, What Dat Shakin’ (1998), and took the act on the road. Grady still talks about these times favorably today. “As much as I loved being a member of Parliament-Funkadelic,” he says, “this was really the best time of my life because now we was in control of our own destiny.” Thankfully, part of Grady’s destiny included receiving accolades for his work with P-Funk. In 1997, Prince inducted him along with 14 other original members of Parliament-Funkadelic into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Grady was also present to receive a Lifetime Achievement Award at the Grammys.
Today Grady lives in Stone Mountain, Georgia, an area he loves. And after surviving eye surgery, a stroke, and congenital heart failure, he’s managed to push any hard feelings toward GC to the side. “Me personally, I wish them the best,” he says of Clinton and his current crew. “I wasn’t tryin to outdo them. We was just tryin to do it… The good times outweigh the bad times regardless.” And the door is always open for Thomas to come back for another Mothership ride. “I know I could go back there anytime I want. All I got to do is show up.” But this time he’ll make sure he’s well protected with a contract.
In this rare gem of an interview, Grady raps about riding with the Parliaments from New Jersey to Chicago to audition for Motown—where Martha Reeves was a secretary at the time—and the group’s transition from doo woppers to psychedelic hippie flower children. Grady also talks about how he got his personal purple style, being mistaken for George by journalists, how Tiki Fulwood became the drummer for Funkadelic, and why Ray Davis was the best bass singer ever.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Jay Double You!
Website & Art by 3chards
Engineered by Nick “Waes” Carden at the Blue Room in Oakland, CA
But we couldn’t have done it without Mawnstr and especially Scott Sheppard
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** visit acedoutpodcast.com to see photos and more **
2021 is the year that MARSHALL THOMPSON—driving force and choreographer for Chicago hitmakers the CHI-LITES—shimmies from star to superstar status. Specifically, his group has been selected for inclusion among this year’s additions to the Hollywood Walk of Fame. And it’s been a long time coming. Between 1969 and 1974, the Chi-Lites sold millions of copies of their 11 top ten hits, including their eternal crowning achievements, “Have You Seen Her” (from [For God’s Sake] Give More Power to the People, 1971) and “Oh Girl” (from A Lonely Man, 1972).
The honor of receiving a Hollywood star brings things full circle for Thompson, as Gladys Knight will be performing for the occasion. She’s the one who gave Marshall his first big break—on the drums. As a teen, he was always sneaking into the Regal Theatre, only to be tossed out into the snow by the bouncer. But when he found out that Knight would be appearing, he hatched a plan. He rehearsed for weeks in the family basement, mastering the beats to all of her songs. Then he went and got himself some slick threads: cross tie, patent leather shoes, black slacks, and white shirt. When he showed up at the Regal on the big night, he looked like all the other fellas in the house band. So he walked right in with everybody else, the bouncer none the wiser.
Now this was big time. The band was at least two dozen pieces, led by none other than Red Saunders! Yet his drummer just couldn’t get the feel down. This was Thompson’s big chance. “The drummer couldn’t play the music,” he recalls “So I raised my hand… ‘Hey Ms. Gladys! Can I play your show?’ She said, ‘Come on up here. Showtime is in about 2 hours and this guy’s messin up.’” He got the gig and played with her for the week. From there, he got a chance to record with Jackie Wilson, and toured with Major Lance.
Despite all this success on the skins, dancing and singing would prove to be Thompson’s true calling. He was part of a group called the Desideros with Creadel “Red” Jones. They were frenemies with another clique of singers, the Chanteurs, which included Robert “Squirrel” Lester and songwriter Eugene Record. They would battle all the time. “They could sing real good, and we could dance real good,” Marshall explains. So when both bands broke up, they knew it would be a smart play to join forces. “We went over to their group and I taught them to dance and they had to teach us how to sing like them,” he says.
Marshall & the Hi-Lites was born. Throughout the 60s, they pounded the pavement, trying to make it. They recorded singles on local labels, but by the time they got signed to Brunswick, they discovered another band was already using the ‘Hi-Lites’ name. So they decided to change it to ‘Chi-Lites’ in honor of their homebase. That was the good luck charm, because not long after the 70s rolled in, they scored their first million-selling single, “(For God’s Sake) Give More Power to the People.”
But “Have You Seen Her” was the real groundbreaker. It was a B-side at first, a tune that the Chi-Lites’ band hadn’t even bothered to rehearse for live shows. Then one night, when the group was out on the road at a gig, the crowd started screaming and hollering for the song. So they sang it a cappella, over and over again for 15 minutes. After that, they were selling 10k copies per day. The amazing part was the song clocked in at over five minutes, twice as long as the average single in those days. “We didn’t think we were gonna get it on the radio,” says Marshall. “It was too long… But the record started selling so much they said ‘Leave it like it is.’”
From there, the hits just kept coming. And along the way, Marshall made some amazing contributions to music history outside of the group as well. In this rare gem of an interview, Marshall talks about being managed by Muhammad Ali in the early years, how he started Soul Train with his good friend Don Cornelius, and helping Joe Jackson and the Jackson Five get their start, introducing them to Bobby Taylor. Thompson also raps about being the Chi-Lite’s official hairdresser, why engineer Bruce Vadim built a special microphone for each member, and how they developed their dance moves and harmonies.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Renee Michele Collins, Nat Collins, & Jay Stone
Website & Art by 3chards
In-Studio Pics by Debbie Jue
Engineered by Nick “Waes” Carden at the Blue Room in Oakland, CABut we couldn’t have done it without Mawnstr and especially Scott Sheppard
Intro track “I Can Never Be” from Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth by the Funkanauts. Go get it wherever music is sold. RIP Brotha P.
Next Episode: Grady Thomas
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By the time guitar hero ANDRE FOXXE (P-Funk/Jimmy G and the Tackheads/Incorporated Thang Band/Psychedelic Ghetto Pimpz) was in his early 20s, he had a production deal with the legendary Don Davis at United Sound, the funk pride of Detroit. Amazingly, that gave him free reign in a place where Johnnie Taylor and Aretha Franklin were also actively laying tracks. And of course, George Clinton was there as well. Andre still had much to learn, but he was so glad he wasn’t working some job or back out on the street ducking bullets, he just acted like he knew while soaking everything up. “All I did was watch George Clinton… and took notes in my mind,” he explains, “I just imitated what I saw them do… And I never told nobody I didn’t know what the fuck I was doin.”
Indeed, Foxxe had the drive and talent to be in the room. But how did he get there in the first place? As it so happens, he literally walked through the door. It all started one fateful day in 1979, when a friend of Andre’s who kept bragging he was buddies with someone in PARLET asked him for a ride to the Funk Festival at the Pontiac Silverdome. When Andre showed up at the dude’s house, he was surprised to see Parliament-Funkadelic singers Ray Davis, Jessica Cleaves, Shirley Hayden, and Sheila Horne (aka Amuka) there as well. All hopped in 18-year-old Andre’s little yellow Duster and they went to the gig.
Once there, they parted company and left Andre to wander around by himself. “I’m walking down this little hallway,” he remembers. “I hear good music playing behind this door. It wasn’t marked or anything. So, I’m inquisitive… I open the door and walk in. It was George Clinton and Bootsy Collins listening to a song called ‘Knee Deep’ that they were working on at the time. “
Well damn. Andre’s presence didn’t seem to bother the two funk superheroes, so he stayed put. That’s when he noticed this kid, a bit younger than him, standing there, too. “I said, ‘What you doin in here?’” Andre recalls. “He goes, ‘That’s my dad right there.’ And I was like ‘That ain’t your dad!’ He goes, ‘What are YOU doin in here?’ I go ‘I just heard that music.’” As it turned out, the kid was Tracey aka Trey Lewd, who then invited Andre to join him onstage to sing part of “Flashlight” that very night.
Two weeks later, Clinton and songwriter/producer Ron Dunbar offered Andre a job as a driver. They even got him some new wheels for the gig. “Everybody that was within Parliament-Funkadelic from ‘79 to like ‘81 I drove around in this green van,” he says. Meanwhile, Andre’s skills as a multi-instrumentalist—though he was still keeping quiet about them for the most part—were starting to come into play. He joined Trey’s project Plastic Brain Slam for a time, along with Steve Pannell and Trey’s brother Daryl Clinton.
That fizzled out, but Clinton and Davis were starting to take notice of Andre’s musical acumen. He was pulled into George’s little brother’s project, Jimmy G and the Tackheads, who put out the fantastic and underrated Federation of Tackheads (1985). Then Jimmy G fell off and Andre found himself in the driver’s seat of the Incorporated Thang Band’s Lifestyles of the Roach and Famous (1988). Throughout, Andre was also writing and recording with serious cats like the almighty Junie Morrison and Blackbyrd McKnight, contributing cuts to Clinton joints like You Shouldn’t-Nuf Bit Fish (1983) and R&B Skeletons in the Closet (1986). But receiving credit and money for this valuable work wasn’t always in the cards. So it’s good that Foxxe further solidified his contributions to the P with his classic solo joint, I’m Funk and I’m Proud (P-Vine, 1994)—featuring a who’s who of funkateers—as well as releases from his Psychedelic Ghetto Pimpz.
However, despite Andre’s determination and success, his transition from driver to player within the P-Funk team wasn’t necessarily a smooth one. “When I started doing it, of course nobody took me serious,” he explains. “Hell, I just picked you up from the airport!” Unfortunately, when his guitar game got strong enough that he was offered a job in the band, things didn’t get better. In fact, they kinda got worse. “That’s when I really started catchin it,” he laments. “And when I decided to develop an image in that thang… that set a few people back as well.” Specifically, the O.G.’s didn’t seem to appreciate Andre grabbing eyeballs with his stage outfit: a bridal gown, which he first put on as a dare inspired by his recent marriage as well as his dedication to the Funk. But even George seemed to be hating on it. “From there on… I just got a little resistance from those guys,” he says. “It was weird… I thought it was part of the gig. I didn’t know it was creating animosity… I was bringing my A game.”
But Andre persisted, and over the course of the mid 80s to 2014 he performed with the P-Funk AllStars, sharing the stage with Blackbyrd, Garry Shider, Mike Hampton, and Billy Bass. “We all were expected to do the job,” says Andre about holding his own while doing the gig. “You’re not on the stage if you’re unqualified… Because, if you can’t do it, there’s 15 other cats that can come up here and outdo you. So if you got the blessing to do this job you better do these parts… And that’s how I was able to stay focused.”
But life as a funk soldier wasn’t always what it was cracked up to be, and Andre was constantly in and out of the lineup. “I think I’ve been fired more than anybody in the whole P-Funk organization,” he quips. But nowadays the wisdom of hindsight has overruled any ill will he’s had toward George Clinton in the past. “I’ve said some bad things about that cat, and I’m sure he said some bad things about me too,” he admits, “But I realized I really love the dude… He was like Dad…. In families and relationships, you go back and forth with the parental figures… I can see his worth to the world and the music industry. I get it now. Because he’s a very valuable dude. He should be an American treasure, if you ask me.”
In this unique, insightful hangout session, Foxxe talks about first wanting to play bass because of his love for Jermaine Jackson, becoming a guitar player while high on mescaline at Garry and Linda Shider’s house, and what P-Funk songs he helped create but never got credit for. He also talks about touring in Africa with afrobeat drummer/innovator Tony Allen, working as an A&R guy for Japan’s P-Vine records, his lifelong friendship with Amp Fiddler, and what it was like having EDDIE “Maggot Brain” HAZEL as a mentor and roommate for four years.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Jay Double You! & Andre Foxxe
Website & Art by 3chards
Engineered by Nick “Waes” Carden at the Blue Room in Oakland, CABut we couldn’t have done it without Mawnstr and especially Scott Sheppard
Intro track “I Can Never Be” from Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth by the Funkanauts. Go get it wherever music is sold. RIP Brotha P.
This episode is dedicated to Bay Area Legend SHOCK G (August 25, 1963 – April 22, 2021)
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“When you think of Motown, you think of Detroit,” explains timbale player RICHARD SEGOVIA, celebrating his 42nd year with his band PURO BANDIDO. “When you think of LATIN ROCK, it’s right there in the MISSION”—the Mission District that is, the legendary San Francisco neighborhood where the genre was born. And a very young Segovia—now affectionately known to the community as the “Mayor of the Mission”—was right there to see the birth of this new sound.
According to Richard, it all started with the Aliens, a five-piece formed at Mission High School in 1964 by Nicaraguan and El Salvadorian immigrants inspired by Ritchie Valens and the neighboring Haight Ashbury scene. “They were the first kinda Latin Rock band,” Segovia explains. One night, CARLOS SANTANA, then a promising young guitarist playing in a blues band, went to see the Aliens at a club called the Night Life. Santana was inspired—it occurred to him that he needed lots of percussion to give his music that special fire. That’s where his fellow future Rock and Roll Hall of Famer JOSE “CHEPITO” AREAS came in. “It was Chepito who brought percussion into Santana,” Segovia asserts. “Chepito brought the conga, the timbale, and added that to blues—changed the whole thing… Everybody wanted to play music after that.”
Suddenly the hood’s troubled youth—with the crime and violence always inevitable where there is lack of money and opportunity—found a new direction. “We went from the battle of the barrios to the battle of the bands,” confirms Segovia. For his part, he joined his first band, Dungeon Sounds, on timbales because the drummer and conga positions had already been taken. They played everywhere they could, doing songs by Santana, Malo, and Azteca. “That was our top 40,” he says.
The band broke up after a couple years, but Richard kept going, joining Por Vida and then Mbuhai, the latter band challenging his musical abilities considerably. “These guys were way over my head,” he confirms. “The conga player didn’t want to play with me because I didn’t know shit!” They practiced five days a week and, as always, it was sink or swim. “Nobody gave up any information back then,” he explains. “Either you had it, or you didn’t… Nobody’s gonna teach you. You got to learn it on your own… If you didn’t get it right away—‘Next!’”
Meanwhile, the Latin Rock scene wasn’t off on an island of its own. Everybody was paying attention and needed some for themselves, even super funk blasters like Larry Graham, who offered Mbuhai an opening slot with Graham Central Station in Redwood City. As it turned out, Clive Davis and many other record execs were in the crowd that night. The next day, Brent Dangerfield, who’d produced Santana, offered to produce Mbuhai for CBS Records.
If that weren’t enough, a gig opening for Graham Central Station at the Soul Train club on Broadway led to Don Cornelius asking Mbuhai to be his house band. Next thing they knew, they were supporting acts like Minnie Riperton, Stevie Wonder, Isaac Hayes, the Bar Kays, and Eddie Kendricks. Unfortunately, the Mbuhai album was recorded yet shelved due to circumstances outside the band’s control. But all of this experience had taught Richard how to be a leader himself. So from 1979 to today, he has presided over his badass band PURO BANDIDO—with guitarist Johnny Gunn as his “co-jefe” since ’85.
But music is just a portion of what Segovia brings to Latin Rock culture. He is also a major producer and promoter of its artistic aesthetic, a drive that culminates into his crowning achievement: turning his own home into an SF landmark. A few years ago, he was approached by the Precita Eyes Muralists Association, a local nonprofit that does all the murals in the Mission. Under a grant from the California Arts Commission and through the Urban Youth Arts Program, Segovia was asked if he wanted to have his house—the same one on the corner of York & 25th that his parents had bought in the early 60s—to be covered with a mural. He could choose the theme, anything he wanted.
Chewing on this opportunity, Segovia went to visit his buddy, Ishmael Versoza aka “Irish,” keyboardist and original member of the Fabulous Malibus, who later became Malo. Richard saw that Irish had some cool old band pictures on the wall. The conclusion was obvious. “I’ve been a Latin Rock player for 52 years,” says Richard, recalling his thought process. “Why don’t I dedicate the mural to Carlos Santana for bringing Latin Rock music to the Mission District?”
Soon, artists from age 5 to 45 were covering his house, dubbed CASA BANDIDO, with wonderful paintings of almost 100 Latin Rock Legends, including Carlos’ late brother Jorge Santana, great friend to Segovia and co-creator of the Mission anthem, Malo’s “Suavecito.” As Richard explains, “I decided to preserve what we have left—because all the techies are coming into the neighborhood buying up all our stuff and I wanted the neighborhood to know I aint’ goin nowhere, man. I’m sticking here. I’m gonna die here.”
Finally, Segovia is a true community leader, a man who knows how to organize with boundless energy when it comes to working with kids, teaching them how to be safe and play a little music. He has received numerous honors and countless thank-you letters over the years from citizens and politicians alike. In fact, before he passed, SF Mayor Ed Lee announced that September 17th is Richard Segovia Day. On October 16, 2021, Richard will hold a free concert at La Raza Park, where he will pay tribute to the too many greats who have left us recently, including Jorge Santana, Armando Parraza, Malo singer Arcelio Garcia, Raul Rico, and Rudy Salas. And before the show, he will unveil additions to his mural, including Pete, Sheila E., and the rest of the Escovedo family.
In this energetic, educational, and laughter-filled interview, the Mayor discusses the African roots of the clave, why he loved Bill Graham, and playing for Eddie Money from ‘85 until his passing. Richard also talks about how his uncle Michael V. Rios designed the cover for Santana’s Grammy-winning Supernatural album at Casa Bandido, what it’s like hanging out with Al Hendrix, father to Jimi, and what the lyrics to “La Cucaracha” are really about. If all of that weren’t enough, Jay and Ace had so much fun with Richard that, less than two weeks after this interview was recorded, they performed with him alongside members of Puro Bandido, and Irish (!) from Malo at an event at the house.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted & Coproduced by Jay Stone
Website & Art by 3chards
In-studio Photos and by Debbie Jue
Engineered by Dominic Brown at Soul Graffiti Studios in Oakland, CA with thanks to & Justin Ancheta, Andrew, & Alex Scammon…but we couldn’t have done it without Scott Sheppard
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If you’ve hit up a GEORGE CLINTON & the P-FUNK ALL-STARS show anytime over the last 30 years, you’ve seen a whole lotta STEVE BOYD, the golden-voiced Detroit doo wop master originally of the group FIVE SPECIAL, best known for their hit “Why Leave Us Alone,” (produced by Wayne Henderson of the Jazz Crusaders). But when Boyd first toured with the Funkensteins, it was as an opening act.
It was the early 90s. Boyd had recently signed a solo deal with iconic funk label Westbound Records, (Funkadelic/Ohio Players/et al), and it was time to promote his album Even Steven. So the record company sent him and his band Private School out on the road with the P, an obvious fit for Steve’s stuff. Besides, he’d already known the Parliament-Funkadelic fam going back to the late 70s, when they shared Detroit’s United Sound as home base. That’s why Steve wasn’t exactly shocked when, once the six-month campaign was over, George turned to him and said, “You might as well stay on with me and be in the group.”
Next thing Boyd knew, dope dawg Michael “Clip” Payne was pulling his coat and showing him how to P-form like an All-Star. “I learned all my lyrics and where to stand,” he remembers. “When to come onstage, when to leave.” But onboarding the P-Funk train made sense from the jump. “Going from doo wop to P-Funk was an easy transition for me,” he explains. “The Parliaments, they started out with doo wop, so it was just like a continuation for them—to keep that flavor goin on that keeps right inside of the funk.” And from then to right about now, Boyd has been a major part of each and every P-Funk performance, averaging about 200 dates a year, five hours per show, doin the damn thing and regularly steppin in to swing down for the late, great Glenn Goins on stank standards like “Funkin’ for Fun” and “Bop Gun.”
Indeed, Boyd has come a long way since the days of his youth, gangbanging and stealing cars with his crew in Detroit. In fact, it was the then-thriving independent music scene—best exemplified by United Sound, studio of legendary producer Don Davis—that steered Steve in a different direction. “I was born into the environment of doo wop and record making and songwriting,” he confirms. And when he was brought into Five Special as a replacement, he soon found himself at U.S. as well. “It pretty much was like a record-making machine there at United Sound with all the various projects goin on at that time,” he remembers. “From Anita Baker, Brides of Funkenstein, Parlet, the Dramatics, Aretha Franklin… It was a whole big party goin on.”
Some of this funky elbow bumping resulted in essential ingredients for any funkateers’ collection: the self-titled debut Five Special (1979) and the filthy-mac-nasty-infused follow-up Special Edition (1980), featuring no less than Bernie Worrell and the Horny Horns to name a few, with the kick-off infectious banger “Jam (Let’s Take It To The Streets).” The group’s breakup failed to slow Steve down. He stayed in the studio throughout the 80s on into the 90s and beyond as a highly sought-after commodity, shining like a dogstar as writer and performer on P-Funk albums like Dope Dogs (1994), The Awesome Power of a Fully Operational Mothership (1996) and How Late Do U Have 2BB4UR Absent? (2005). But you’re missing out if you sleep on Boyd’s solo joints, well-written and produced releases like The Lost Tapes Vol. 1 (2008) and 4:20 Drive Time (2001). His latest 5-song EP, Live in Austin Texas (2019), is especially funktastic, featuring Clip Payne, Mike “Kidd Funkadelic” Hampton, and Kendra Foster from D’Angelo’s crew.
These days you might catch Steve at his mom’s house in South Carolina, listening to a podcast while watching the news on ten different streams at once. Or he might be in Atlanta, recording music with his son. But wherever he is, he’s not gonna take the idea of George Clinton being “retired” all that seriously. “He gon’ do it till he drop, man,” Steve asserts. “He ain’t ready to stop yet… I can tell you don’t nobody be fillin out no applications.”
In this super laid back hangout session, Steve explains what a “40-minute Funkadelic” is, recalls his days as a Golden Gloves welterweight boxer, runs down why it’s fun singing with George Clinton, and describes giving Anthony Keidis some help with his vocals throughout the Red Hot Chili Peppers’ Freaky Styley sessions. Boyd also talks about getting personal compliments and singing advice from Aretha Franklin, helping out El DeBarge in a street fight before a recording session in San Francisco, the strong possibility of a Five Special reunion going down in the near future, and that time Prince served him purple rice at Paisley Park.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Jay Double You! & Steve Boyd
Website & Art by 3chards
Engineered, Edited & Photographed by Nick “Waes” Carden at the Blue Room in Oakland, CA
Official Poster Art by Steven Yu w/ Thanx to Debbie Jue
But we couldn’t have done it without Mawnstr and especially Scott Sheppard -
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FUNK FAM:
This is your boy Ace. Like the rest of you, last year brought us our share of heartbreak. Specifically, on Nov 6, 2020, we lost a member of the FUNKANAUTS—guitar wizard, bassologist, soul rock encyclopedia, and Bay Area CA legend PATRICK OWENS, whom many of us knew as BROTHA P. We dedicate this special episode to him and humbly submit it to help heal the heart and soul of the devoted family he left behind as well as the multitude of musicians who loved him.
Pat knew more about funk than anyone else in the room at any given time, quick to clown us for lacking knowledge about this or that with the quip: “You didn’t know that?” But he was also a roots reggae master, highly respected and sought out by expert practitioners of the craft. All told, he played with a lot of players, rocked many a crowd, and taught us a lot about anything we needed to know.
Patrick hardly told anyone how sick he was until it was too late, so his passing was a shock to all of us. Indeed, we’re still trying to process this, looking for a little closure. That’s why we wanted to take some time to regroup and make sure we did this right. A big part of that is gathering the people to represent for our Brotha P properly. And you are a big part of Pat’s legacy too. So get ready to sit back, dig, and lend us your ears.
First of all, joining Jay Stone and I in the studio, we are pleased to welcome the almighty-bigfoot-Funkanaut-OG-drummer John “MACFAB” Flaherty. He and Jay set the stage by telling us how the Nauts came to be and how Patrick became an essential ingredient in the stanky stew. Next we check in with P’s mom Dorothy, then chop it up with P’s cousin Theresa, who loved him like a sister. After that, we holla at Richard Lindsey, whose P-Funk tribute band Purifiedment Funkensurance Patrick had been musical director for a spell. Then we speak with some cats who also gigged with Brotha P a lot and loved him like a brother: Trinidadian bad azz drummer Tony D Drumologist, guitarist and studio engineer Ron van Leeuwaarde, and roots reggae bassist Densfield Alexander. Finally, P’s cousin Jackie Owens helps us send him off with a final tribute.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted & Coproduced by Jay Stone and John “MacFab” Flaherty
w/ Content Produced by Theresa Owens Ree Ree
Website & Art by 3chards
In-studio Photos by Debbie Jue
Engineered by Dominic Brown at Soul Graffiti Studios in Oakland, CA with thanks to Justin Ancheta
…but we couldn’t have done it without Scott Sheppard -
“I have literally danced my entire life,” says SWEET LD, OG member of MC HAMMER and the POSSE and its pioneering, all-women offshoot OAKTOWN 357. And as a young lady living in the East Bay, CA in the 80s, that was just about all LD aka Suhayla Sabir and her friends ever wanted to do. She especially loved to frequent a place called Silk’s in Emeryville because it had three floors, each with its own jams to get down to. “Silk’s was my spot,” she recalls. “We were always there. We would go and get in as soon as we could—stand in that long line—and then we would stay until the sun came up. That was just our M.O.”
Suhayla was there one night when she noticed MC Hammer, who was just trying to get his feet wet as an artist/performer at the time. He was no joke on the floor, just killing the cabbage patch, a dance she had just learned herself—but not like that! She became so fixated that afterwards she and her friends followed him to a gas station. Hammer, paying himself the compliment that she was trying to flirt, was caught off guard when she simply asked: “Can you teach me to do the cabbage patch?”
Weeks later, she was part of his core clique. “We were literally just hanging out. It was just about the dance. We would just tear that dance floor up.” In other words, she had no thoughts of bustin moves professionally, much less making music herself. But that all changed one night when Hammer asked her and a friend if they wanted to be in a music video. “We were excited because we thought that being in a video meant that we were just going to be cute,” she says. “You know—wear the cute outfit, be the cute girl… He had something totally different in mind.”
So Suhayla found herself at long, rigorous rehearsals, running choreography and sweating from mid-afternoon till midnight. “We were not excited about that initially,” she says. Music videos were still pretty new at that time and she had never thought about what went into making one. “It became like ‘Do we have to keep showing up?’ Cuz we were really showing up out of good faith… It was kind of a confusing time.” Meanwhile, two key sistas entered the scene as well: Phyllis Charles and Tabitha Zee King-Brooks.
Eventually, Hammer did clue the ladies in: he wanted them to be backup dancers for his whole show. They performed everywhere they could as MC Hammer and the Posse, and the ladies—aka Sweet LD, Lil P, and Terrible T—brought their high-voltage, superhype dance style to classic videos like “Let’s Get It Started,” “Pump It Up,” and “Turn This Mutha Out.” Things began to build so fast that Hammer negotiated a deal to partner his Bust-It imprint with Capitol Records. That’s when he began formulating a plan to produce a female rapper. He had been auditioning girls for the gig when, messing around between songs at a rehearsal, Lil P grabbed a mic and started busting the song “Tramp” by Salt-N-Pepa. Hammer liked what he heard and approached P about becoming a solo artist. She agreed—but only if her homegirls Terrible T and Sweet LD would rap with her.
Oaktown 357 was born, and their debut Wild & Loose (1989) was a smash, with hit singles/videos for “Yeah Yeah Yeah” and “Straight at You.” Now the ladies were busier than ever—on the road opening for Hammer and then doing his set, all while training new dancers as they came into the fold. But things took a hard turn when the Posse appeared on the Arsenio Hall Show. Backstage after the taping, everyone was presented with a check—for an amount that actually seemed decent. For the ladies of Oaktown, it was a revelation. With Hammer, they had always been wondering about getting paid, or why they weren’t. This seemed to confirm that their blood and sweat was worth a lot more.
Lil P left outright, leaving Terrible T and LD to regroup amongst themselves. “I could understand why Lil P left,” remembers LD. “But… I wanted to know that I could see it through. So we talked and we determined between the two of us that we would stay… and that we would work well enough together to make them change their minds about how they treated us.” The sistas soldiered on without missing a step, enjoying hit singles/videos for remixes of “We Like It” and the smash “Juicy Gotcha Crazy.” They also appeared on the West Coast classic antiviolence cut “We’re All in the Same Gang” alongside N.W.A., Tone Loc, and Ice T. And the ladies stepped up their game for their follow-up album Fully Loaded (1991), a crowning achievement and one of the most underrated gems of the era.
Today, as a mom, fitness instructor, and published poet, Sweet LD remains proud of Oaktown 357’s legacy. “We did the damn thing—period,” she asserts. “We invested in ourselves to show up and do the work and then we created something and shared it with everybody in this world. And today they still look at us as someone who changed the dynamic for women in hip hop.” Indeed! In this inspiring, behind-the-scenes interview, Sweet LD raps about growing up watching her cousin Choc’let get down with Graham Central Station, how Hammer taught her how to “build” a dance in order to tell a story, and why the deceptive nature of the music industry means you need to ask questions. She also talks about how 357 songs were created in the studio, her recent comeback performances alongside acts like Lady of Rage and 702, and that time Prince personally gave her a tour of Paisley Park and kissed her hand.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Patryce “Choc’Let” Banks and Sweet LD
Website & Art by 3chards
In-studio Photos by Debbie Jue
Engineered by Dominic Brown, Alex Scammon, & Justin Ancheta at Soul Graffiti Studios in Oakland, CA
…but we couldn’t have done it without Scott Sheppard -
When SHIRLEY HAYDEN [PARLET/P-FUNK] auditioned for Parliament-Funkadelic in singer Malia Franklin’s family basement, she was scared. It was the late 70s and, like every other artist raised in Detroit, she had already been a fan of George Clinton’s clan, then in the midst of recording the stank staple One Nation Under a Groove. “It was a hell of an audition,” she remembers. “The band was hot as hell and I had to show them what I had.” But Hayden was a triple threat—with the look, ability, and charisma to get it done. “It was natural,” she says.
It was so natural in fact that Shirley found herself recording, rehearsing and touring for such classics as Motor Booty Affair (1978), Gloryhallastoopid (1979), and Trombipulation (1980) —all while learning to navigate the waters without getting wet. “Each opportunity I was given to sing, to perform, I pushed myself into taking it because I was somewhat shy,” she explains. “There’s a lot of different characters going on around here and I don’t know who’s who. It’s always 15, 20, 30 people around. I was trying to fit in… How do I fit in?”
Evidently, Shirley fit in just right. She was chosen to join a “second phase“ version of sister group PARLET, replacing the legendary Debbie Wright — (sister to Jim Wright aka Jay Double You!, and Shirley’s former boo) — and appearing on Invasion of the Booty Snatchers (1979) and Play Me Or Trade Me (1980). Hayden recalls it as a fun, beautiful, creative time. “The female energy,” she says. “We were all young and learning… I was an empty vessel just willing to soak it all in.”
Nonetheless, as exciting as it all was, Shirley also remembers things could get frustrating. “Here it is,” she says, recreating her headspace at the time. “Your dream is happening. You’re singing on a professional level… You’ve gone to the next level of your craft, which is exciting… You’re accepted by the masses.” Yet she found herself asking the same question over and over: “How am I going to get paid for doing this?” Indeed, which way the cash flowed wasn’t always clear, and she had responsibilities outside of going to yet another after-party—most importantly, a young daughter whom she had to leave for short periods in order to work. “I could not afford to hang,” she says.
On top of that, there was friction between bandmates—particularly about who should be out front. “It was vicious,” says Hayden, “because it created this tension.” However, it all seemed to be part of Dr. Funkenstein’s diabolical plan. “That’s what I believe George Clinton loved,” she explains. “He was fed off of the tension… He wanted to take all that energy and take it to the stage. That’s what made the show so exciting — because people were releasing all their inhibitions.” Still, the strain often meant that animosity and ambition overruled sisterly love. “It is a shame,” Shirley surmises. “And I don’t know why because each one of you is a star. The light shines on all of us… Why can’t we share the spotlight?”
Hayden also has her issues with how the ladies of the P-Funk canon have been acknowledged since—or not so much. “I’m a little disappointed and don’t understand as to why the women haven’t really been spoken of by George Clinton publicly,” she says. “We’re still fighting for our place in the Parliament musical history of things… Our vocals were ultra-important, played a big part in the shaping of that sound.” It especially hurt her feelings when she was not invited to participate in Parliament-Funkadelic’s 2019 Lifetime Achievement Grammy Award ceremonies or celebrations, relegating her to watching it on TV in her living room. But instead of being bitter, she has an optimistic belief that her due is on the horizon. “There are parties and events and awards that are in the future,” she asserts. “And I’m looking forward to the accolades that are coming… This music is eternal. It’s timeless.”
Shirley still lives in Detroit, making always-on-the-one jams with a crew called Black Planet, which includes Danny “Blackman” Harris and Sean “Papa” Franklin. But she never knew how important what she took to the stage back then would still be right now. “To look back and see the growth and the evolution is just mesmerizing,” she says. “To see how far I’ve come in my life… There was a lot of beautiful creative energy flowing at that time. So I am very appreciative of being chosen to be part of the sister group Parlet... I really do thank George Clinton for the opportunity. Had no idea that it would be part of my life today. I’m very proud of the work that we did.”
In this chillaxed, edutaining interview, Ms. Hayden describes the hidden meanings behind P-Funk lyrics, her love for jazz vocalists like Sarah Vaughn and “auntie” Billie Holiday, and what it was like working with Kid Rock during his rise to fame— earning herself gold, platinum, and diamond albums with residuals that still provide for her family today. Shirley also talks about that time Jeanette Washington screamed at her over the phone, why she thinks Trombipulation is underrated, and her deep personal relationship with her big bother and role model Garry Shider.
Produced & Hosted by Ace Alan
Cohosted by Jay Stone
w/ Content Produced by Patryce “Choc’Let” Banks and Jay Stone
Website & Art by 3chards
In-studio Photos by Debbie Jue
Engineered by Justin Ancheta & Alex Scammon w/ Domick Brown at Soul Graffiti Studios in Oakland, CA
…but we couldn’t have done it without Scott Sheppard -
WAYNE FOOTE aka “Foote Funk” never would have thought he’d be asked to replace Steve Arrington as lead singer in monster funk outfit SLAVE. After all, he was 19 years old, living with his folks just outside San Francisco in Daly City, while Slave were based out of Dayton, Ohio—part of the Ohio Player lineage and knee deep in a super-stank scene that included Zapp, Faze-O, Lakeside, Heatwave & Dayton. So how did this California kid wind up onstage opening shows with “Slide?”
Well, Wayne came up as a dancer, a kid in a troupe called the Master Locks. But by age 14 he found out he could sing Stevie Wonder songs acapella, plus funk up the drums and any other instrument he could get his hands on. So he had a group called Master Funk with buddy/bassist Darren Jones—until he left to start producing artists himself. That’s when someone connected Wayne with a woman named Kim who had two sisters that could sing.
So Foote went to their home in Pacifica to start showing the sisters the parts for a song they were to record. But after the ladies heard Wayne’s pipes, they said: “Naw, we don’t want you to produce us.” What? Wayne asked. “We want Mark to hear you.” Mark who? “Mark Adams.” Mark Adams, the bassist from Slave?! “That’s my husband,” said Kim. “We want you to be the new singer for Slave… We need you to replace Steve Arrington.”
Well, Wayne didn’t really believe what he was hearing. But sure enough, about a week later, he was cooking pancakes at home when the doorbell rang. He opened the door… it was Mark Adams! “That made a believer outta me,” remembers Wayne. He had every Slave album in his room. But he met the moment. “Instead of fainting,” he says, “I started singing for him.” Soon after that visit, Adams called Wayne and offered him a one-way ticket to Ohio, a per diem, and an apartment.
By spring of ’83, Foote was funkin with Slave. “These rehearsals were extremely intense,” says Wayne. “This was not a party for me… We would practice Monday through Friday, eight hours a day. I mean there was no breaks. If you had a cold, if you didn’t feel good—sorry! You gonna watch what we do. You sit to the side… I almost had a heart attack, man. This whole experience was extremely overwhelming for me. But I absorbed it and I lived it.”
Foote wound up becoming best buddies with Mark Hicks aka Drac, Slave’s guitar legend who played through over a dozen Marshall amps at once. Drac even showed Foote the garage at his mom and dad’s where Slave was first formed. And Wayne just loved writing with the group. “We would write for hours,” he says. “Listening to instrumental music by Slave was an experience in itself.”
But the honeymoon was over when it came time to release their album Bad Enuff. Not only had they not paid Foote yet, but management wouldn’t even hook him up with funds to get his curl done for the album cover! And when he found out that he had been denied a lot of songwriting credit to boot, he quit and went back to California. Adams managed to lure him back months later to record New Plateau, an album on which singer/guitarist Danny Webster himself asked Foote to take the lead. The music was beautiful, with songs like “E.Z. Lovin’ You,” but lack of proper credit induced Foote to split for good and go solo.
Today, Foote Funk is clean and sober, living in SF, ready to tour again while also making films and art. In this laughter-filled, revealing interview, Wayne talks about the many problems with Slave’s management, his struggles with alcohol, being treated like royalty in England, and almost cutting his finger trying to play like Mark Adams. Foote also raps about trombonist Floyd Miller being the backbone of the group, the intense rivalry between Drac and Danny Webster, getting a good luck hug from Roger Troutman at the airport when Foote first joined Slave, and that time Webster hit him in the solar plexus with a guitar onstage.
- Visa fler
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