Avsnitt
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Are you ready for a living abroad story with an unexpected twist? What if I told you that a TCK, who has traversed the globe and faced earthquake disasters, is now crowd-funding a memoir that unveils his journey through polarized worlds? This is not your ordinary travelogue. Join me in uncovering the heart-wrenching and inspiring stories that have shaped Michael Sullivan's life. Stay tuned for a peek into a world where personal growth and societal impact collide in unexpected ways. Trust me, this is a narrative you don't want to miss.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Discover the transformative benefits of therapy for personal growth and self-awareness.
Navigate the unique challenges and growth opportunities of being a Third Culture Kid.
Unleash the power of personal storytelling through memoir writing for self-discovery and connection.
Learn how to build bridges and foster understanding in a polarized world.
Explore the profound impact of immigration on personal and societal levels.
My special guest is Michael Sullivan
As the host of the "Where Are You From? A TCK Podcast," Michael Sullivan brings a wealth of personal and professional experiences to the table. Growing up and living as an expat in different countries, from Thailand to the Philippines, and now residing in Turkey as an English language expert, Michael's journey as a Third Culture Kid (TCK) is both captivating and insightful. His forthcoming book, "Building Bridges: Can We Love and Relate in a Polarized World," dives into the impact of immigration and the challenges of cultural identity, offering a fresh and empathetic take on these pertinent issues. With his unique blend of memoir storytelling and global perspective, Michael is a compelling guest for anyone seeking personal growth, self-awareness, and a deeper understanding of the world's diverse cultures.
We don't have to be completely comfortable with the way other people think, but we certainly can learn something from them. - Michael Sullivan
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the Podcast and Guest
00:01:03 - Sponsorship and Personal Growth
00:02:40 - Welcoming Michael Sullivan
00:05:28 - Connection through Global Experiences
00:12:21 - Immigration and Understanding Perspectives
00:16:03 - Journey from Venezuela to New Mexico
00:17:12 - Unresolved Grief and Pain
00:18:07 - Bridging First and Third Worlds
00:20:51 - Overcoming Fear and Embracing Differences
00:31:53 - Hope for the Future
00:33:25 - The importance of understanding others
00:34:48 - The necessity of facing challenges
00:37:03 - The process of healing and growth
00:40:17 - Finding purpose in adversity
00:43:53 - Crowdfunding the book
00:48:02 - Building Bridges and Making a Difference
00:48:40 - Exclusive Interview with Michael Sullivan
00:49:15 - Join the Difference Maker Community
00:49:40 - Connect and Share in the Community
00:50:28 - Keep Making a Difference -
Do you want to understand how survivors of religious trauma are finding the strength to reclaim their lives and make a difference? Join us as we explore a story of resilience, transformation, and healing in the face of religious abuse and domestic violence. We'll be sharing the solution so that you can achieve that result. Get ready to hear a shocking and moving story of how a survivor escaped when her life depended on it.
Trauma took your past, but it does not have to have your present and your future, too. And you are the one in charge of that. - Tia Levings
In this episode, you will be able to:
Explore personal stories of escaping Christian patriarchy and find inspiration for your own journey to empowerment.
Learn about the profound impact of religious trauma on mental health and discover strategies for healing and resilience.
Uncover the complexities of domestic violence within religious contexts and gain insights into supporting survivors.
Gain a deep understanding of deconstructing fundamentalism in modern politics and its implications on society.
Discover effective strategies for healing and recovery from religious abuse, empowering yourself to move forward with strength and confidence.
My special guest is Tia Levings
Tia Levings is an insightful writer, podcaster, and speaker, with a focus on the realities of Christian fundamentalism, evangelical patriarchy, and religious trauma. Her expertise has been featured in notable publications such as Salon, the Huffington Post, and Newsweek. As a content strategist, Tia delves into the impact of religious trauma on mental health, domestic violence within religious contexts, and the deconstruction of fundamentalism in modern politics, shedding light on these critical issues. Her forthcoming memoir, "A Well Trained Wife," chronicles her personal journey of escaping Christian patriarchy, presenting a compelling and courageous narrative that promises to resonate with those seeking empowerment and healing from religious abuse. Tia's work is driven by her passion for advocating resilience and recovery from religious trauma. Tia is on Instagram, LinkedIn, TikTok
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introducing Tia Levings
00:01:17 - Trigger Warning and Self-Care
00:02:25 - Growing Up in Mainstream Fundamentalism
00:05:22 - Trauma and Dogmatism
00:07:42 - Effects of Fundamentalism on Women
00:14:08 - The Influence of High Control Religion
00:15:34 - The Pressure of Traditional Gender Roles
00:16:55 - Red Flags and High Control Religion
00:20:47 - The Manipulative Nature of Patriarchy
00:25:53 - Addressing Pushbacks and Myths
00:27:34 - The Incredulity of Religious Trauma
00:28:22 - Challenges in Seeking Justice
00:29:26 - Empowering Survivors
00:32:35 - Finding Solidarity and Community
00:38:27 - Building Healthy Relationships
00:41:09 - The Impact of Religious Trauma
00:43:18 - Coping with Discomfort and Denial
00:44:50 - Healing from Religious Trauma
00:46:31 - Advocating for Survivors
00:53:18 - Taking Action and Making a Difference
00:56:22 - Understanding Mental Illness and Abuse
00:57:11 - Seeking Justice for Mica
00:57:45 - Supporting Victims of Domestic Violence
00:58:30 - Making a Difference -
Saknas det avsnitt?
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Hey there, difference makers and global leaders! Ever feel like you've been told to just "toughen up" when facing life's challenges? Maybe you've tried to push through the pain and suffering, only to find yourself feeling overwhelmed and exhausted? If that sounds familiar, you're not alone. Let's talk about building resilience and embracing vulnerability to navigate life's twists and turns in a healthier way.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Strengthen your leadership skills by building resilience in the face of challenges.
Unlock your potential for success by cultivating a growth mindset.
Discover the power of self-care in navigating life's obstacles and maintaining balance.
Master strategies for overcoming jet lag to make the most of your travels.
Embrace vulnerability and emotions to unlock personal growth and self-discovery.
Resilience isn't necessarily about avoiding adversity, because let's just be real. Life has pain and suffering in it. And if we ignore that, that's not increasing our resilience. It's only burying that deep inside our bodies in a way that it will spill out later through some unresolved grief. - Lori Adams Brown
Building Resilience as a Leader
Effective leadership involves building resilience to navigate challenges and setbacks. Resilient leaders can inspire and motivate others through their own ability to bounce back from adversity. By embracing vulnerability and learning from difficult experiences, leaders can cultivate resilience that strengthens their decision-making and problem-solving skills.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Visit www.betterhelp.com/difference for 10% off your first month of therapy with BetterHelp. This offer is specifically for the listeners of the podcast and is a gift from the host to help you understand what it takes to move forward in a healthier way.
Join the Patreon community Difference Makers at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference to access exclusive episodes, interact with other listeners, and receive sneak peeks into upcoming events and giveaways. Different tiers are available, starting at $5 a month.
Share your tips and tricks for building resilience, especially for those who travel and work through jet lag, speak at events and conferences, and maintain connections with family back home. Engage with the community and contribute to the conversation.
Reach out to the host if you're in a location where she's traveling and would like to meet. Listeners are encouraged to connect with the host during her travels and share how the podcast has impacted them.
Embrace challenges, cultivate resilience, and discover the strength and courage within yourself. Prioritize self-care and resilience-building, and model this behavior for others to give them permission to do the same. Let the host know how you're building resilience on social media or in our Difference Makers community.
Resilience isn't just about weathering the storm. It's actually about learning to find joy, and find even joy memories in your own past that can help you walk through that resilience. - Lori Adams Brown
Resilience isn't just about weathering the storm. It's actually about learning to find joy, and find even joy memories in your own past that can help you walk through that resilience. - Lori Adams Brown
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Embracing Resilience in Life
00:02:00 - Resilience During Travel
00:03:07 - Prioritizing Self-Compassion
00:05:09 - Discovering Inner Resilience
00:08:15 - Cultivating Resilience
00:13:23 - Building Resilience During Travel
00:15:13 - Cultivating a Growth Mindset
00:19:43 - Building Resilient Communities
00:21:40 - Finding Joy and Resilience
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If you're feeling overwhelmed by the complexities of racial justice and faith intersections, and wondering how to truly make a difference, then you are not alone! The struggle to understand the historical context and apply it to modern-day challenges can be daunting. Many may be seeking guidance on how to effectively navigate these issues and create meaningful change.
Jemar Tisby, the New York Times bestselling author of "The Color of Compromise," is a historian, author, and speaker. His work has been featured in reputable platforms such as CNN, the Washington Post, the Atlantic, and the New York Times. Jemar's expertise in addressing the truth about the American church's complicity in racism makes him a significant voice in the intersection of faith and racial justice. As a PhD candidate in history at the University of Mississippi, his commitment to shedding light on historical lessons from abolitionist movements and advocating for social reform through interracial solidarity is evident in his work. Jemar's impact extends beyond academia as he is the founder and president of the Witness of Black Christian Collective and the co-host of the Pass the Mic podcast. His dedication to historical research and advocacy for justice makes him an influential figure in the conversation on racial equity and social change.
Doug Strong, an esteemed author and professor with a wealth of knowledge in American religious history, specifically focusing on the 19th-century revivalism and social reform, is a vital voice in the discussion of faith and racial justice. With an MDIV and a PhD from Princeton Theological Seminary, Doug's expertise and dedication to understanding the historical abolitionist movements bring valuable insights to the current social and racial justice landscape. As a committed pastor and a professor at Seattle Pacific University, Doug's passion for intercultural learning and his extensive experience in leading students on international trips underscore his commitment to shaping a global perspective on faith and justice. His contributions to the Awakening to Justice: Faithful Voices from the Abolitionist Past project reflect his deep understanding of the impact of historical narratives on contemporary social reform.
The theological, the Christian principle of loving your neighbor as yourself is still applicable in that situation. And what it forces us to do is to try to perceive the world from another person's perspective, which is what a world of difference podcast is all about. - Jemar Tisby
In this episode, you will be able to:
Explore the profound impact of faith on driving meaningful change in racial justice movements.
Uncover valuable historical insights and powerful tactics used by abolitionist movements to inspire modern-day activism.
Discover the pivotal role of interracial solidarity in advancing social reform and creating lasting change.
Learn actionable strategies from historical abolitionists to empower and guide today's activists in their advocacy work.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Visit awakeningtojustice.com for free resources related to the book Awakening to Justice: Faithful Voices from the Abolitionist Past, including a discussion guide, sermon ideas, music suggestions, worship song ideas, and a 35-minute film documentary.
Order a copy of "Awakening to Justice," at: https://www.ivpress.com/awakening-to-justice and get a discount just for A World of Difference podcast listeners with promo code: IVPPOD20
Subscribe to Jemar Tisby's substack at jemartisby.substack.com for more of his writing and insights on racial justice and faith.
The justification follows the action. In the case of us race-based chattel slavery, slaveholders were going to get their money. They were going to find laborers. They were going to increase their bottom line by not paying them. And then they were going to come up with the rationale and the reasoning to justify it. - Jemar Tisby -
Does this sound familiar? Have you ever felt the pressure of unrealistic expectations weighing you down, leaving you questioning your worth? It's a struggle many of us face, especially as women, and it can be incredibly disheartening. But what if there was a way to break free from the cycle and embrace your true self-worth? Let's dive into how embracing individuality and self-worth through empowering messages in music can transform your life.
My special guest is Shannan Copland
Shannan Copland, an indie pop artist based in Portland, Oregon, is recognized for her impactful and relatable music as a singer/songwriter. Born and raised in the SF Bay Area, California, she studied music from a young age, with a strong foundation in piano and vocal training. Collaborating with musicians and educators globally, including ones in Norway, Italy, and Portugal, has enriched her musical style with diverse cultural influences. With a love for piano and voice, she involved herself in every musical opportunity available and her passion for songwriting ignited during her teenage years. After high school, Shannan toured the United States with a group singing in schools and also performed in a theater. Her upcoming release "Enough" is poised to further empower women by promoting self-worth and authenticity. Shannan's music contains powerful messages that resonate with audiences, offering a source of strength and self-acceptance, particularly for women navigating their unique journeys.
Shannan and her husband spent the first decade of their marriage mostly living abroad in Portugal and Italy where they started a non-profit organization together. Working with talented musicians, artists and individuals from around the globe combined with her experiences living abroad have influenced her perspectives on life and the world around her which also reflect in her songwriting. Now, as she releases her own music, Shannan hopes to encourage, inspire, and provoke deeper thought through her music for listeners.
Her newest single “Enough” releases on April 12 and serves as the underlying anthem of much of her music. With its driving pop rock beat, “Enough” inspires listeners to be their authentic selves, reject image management, and not let other’s opinions or standards hold them back from achieving their aspirations.
"You are enough. The world may think otherwise of you, but it doesn't matter. Their opinions do not change your worth. Stand in that worth." - Shannan Copland
In this episode, you will be able to:
Discover how Shannan Copland's indie pop music inspires self-acceptance and empowerment for women.
Explore the profound impact of music on boosting self-worth and confidence for women.
Uncover the creative songwriting process and inspirational sources behind empowering music for women.
Understand the diverse cultural perspectives on modesty and beauty and their influence on harmful expectations for women.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Sign up for Shannan Copland's newsletter on her website, ShannanCopland.com, to get an early sneak peek and listen to her new song Enough before its official release on April 12.
Follow Shannan Copland on Instagram and other social platforms at ShannonCoplandmusic to stay updated on her latest releases and news.
Listen to Shannan Copland's new song Enough on Spotify or your preferred music streaming platform on April 12, and share it with your friends and family to spread the empowering message.
Stay tuned for Shannan Copland's upcoming releases, including a fun summer song and an emotional track for Mother's Day, to continue experiencing her meaningful and thought-provoking music.
"I want people to, after they hear this song, just to feel liberated and feel that they're worthy and that they can go out and face whatever challenges they have ahead in their own skin and be confident in that." - Shannan Copland -
Unlearning silence isn't just about finding your voice; it's about recognizing the ways we've all been complicit in silencing others. And the surprising insights from a Harvard lecturer will have you rethinking the impact of silence in your world. Join the conversation to uncover the hidden ways we contribute to silence and discover how to foster inclusive communication. It's time to unlearn the silence that holds us back. Stay tuned for the unexpected wisdom that will leave you reevaluating your role in creating a more inclusive world.
My special guest is Elaine Lin Hering.
Elaine Lin Hering is a renowned facilitator, speaker, and writer with extensive experience in communication, collaboration, and conflict management. Drawing from her background as a former managing partner of Triad Consulting Group and a lecturer at Harvard Law School, Elaine's expertise spans across various industries and continents, working with corporate, government, and nonprofit clients. Her personal journey as an immigrant from Taiwan to the United States adds a unique perspective to her work, diving deep into the impact of cultural differences on communication and strategies for inclusive leadership. With her compelling insights and vulnerability, Elaine's book, Unlearning Silence: How to Speak Your Mind, Unleash Talent, and Live More Fully, resonates with individuals seeking to navigate the complexities of silence and voice in personal and professional growth.
In what ways are the often very well-intentioned people around me, such as my manager, who in their heart of hearts wants to support me, actually silencing me? - Elaine Lin Hering
In this episode, you will be able to:
Embrace the power of inclusive communication and unlearn silence in professional environments.
Enhance your communication and collaboration skills to foster a more inclusive work environment.
Explore the impact of cultural differences on communication and how it influences team dynamics.
Discover effective strategies for inclusive leadership and building stronger team dynamics.
Understand the role of silence in personal and professional growth, and how it can positively impact your workplace interactions.
Embrace the Power of Inclusive Communication
Inclusive communication in professional environments is essential for fostering a sense of belonging and diversity. By embracing diverse voices and perspectives, teams can collaborate more effectively and achieve better results. Creating a space where everyone feels heard and valued cultivates a positive work culture and promotes innovation.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Join the Difference Maker Community at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference to access exclusive episodes and support the show for as little as $5 a month.
Follow Lori Adams-Brown on Twitter @loriadbr and on Instagram @loriadamsbrown to stay connected and share your suggestions for future guests on the show.
Check out Elaine Lin Hering's book Unlearning How to Speak Your Mind, Unleash Talent, and Live More Fully to gain deeper insights into unlearning silence and fostering a more inclusive environment.
Consider reaching out to Lori Adams-Brown to share your stories and experiences, as well as to suggest individuals who are making a difference and could be featured on the podcast.
Explore the wisdom and advice shared by Elaine Lin Hering in the exclusive episode available in the Difference Maker Community, where she provides insights on self-care, resilience, and navigating challenging spaces.
Being explicit doesn't mean that you have to be direct. Being explicit means, 'Oh, read the air. That's what is happening here. Can we name it?' - Elaine Lin Hering -
Did you know that the Equal Rights Amendment, aimed at guaranteeing equal rights regardless of sex, has not yet been enshrined in the US Constitution? It's a surprising reality, especially when considering the global efforts for women's equality. In this episode, we'll uncover the resilience, setbacks, and ongoing advocacy surrounding the ERA in the United States, while also delving into the international bill of rights for women known as CEDAW. But here's the kicker - despite strides made through international efforts, disparities persist, underscoring the need for continued advocacy and support. Join us as we unravel the surprising history and explore what can be done to champion gender equality. This is a call to action for making a real difference in the fight for women's rights. Stay tuned for an eye-opening revelation that will spark your curiosity and inspire you to take action.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Discover the transformative benefits of therapy for personal growth and empowerment.
Uncover the profound impact and historical significance of the Equal Rights Amendment.
Explore the global efforts and impact of CEDAW in advancing women's equality worldwide.
Learn about the pivotal role of grassroots campaigns in driving political movements for gender equality.
Understand the vital importance of voting for advocates of gender equality in creating lasting change.
It's time. It's 2024, and all these other countries around the world have signed the CEDAW agreement, and the United States still hasn't. And also, we don't have an ERA for our own constitution, so what can we do? - Lori Adams Brown
Global efforts of CEDAW
The Convention on the Elimination of all forms of discrimination against women (CEDAW) is an international treaty that aims to end discrimination against women in all forms. Global efforts under CEDAW highlight the importance of gender equality and the need for legislative measures to protect and promote women's rights. Supporting CEDAW initiatives can contribute to creating a more just and equal society for all individuals.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Visit www.betterhelp.com/difference to get 10% off your first month of therapy.
Donate to Justice Revival at www.justicerevival.org/donate to contribute to initiatives aimed at advancing gender equality, including efforts to promote the ratification of the ERA and uphold the principles of CEDAW.
Join the #Faith4ERA campaign at Justice Revival with any faith community to bring your experience and perspective around the movement for women's rights.
Join the Difference Maker community at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifferences to access exclusive episodes, interact with exclusive posts, share your thoughts, and influence the direction of the podcast.
Support organizations dedicated to the cause of gender equality, such as Justice Revival, by donating and standing in solidarity with women everywhere to ensure that the promise of equality becomes a reality for all.
Human rights, women's rights, which are human rights, is so important. There's a lot of things we can get wrong, but that should just be a basic foundation. - Lori Adams Brown
Impactful Equal Rights Amendment
The Equal Rights Amendment (ERA) in the US aims to constitutionally guarantee equal rights under the law for all genders. Despite facing hurdles and delays, the ERA remains critical in advancing gender equality and ensuring fair treatment for all individuals. Advocating for the ratification of the ERA is essential to promoting equal rights and opportunities for women and girls.
Together, we can come together with our differences, male allies, women on behalf of our daughters and granddaughters and future generations, but also for us now. - Lori Adams Brown -
If you're feeling like you're struggling to truly connect with others and make a significant impact as a leader, then you are not alone! The traditional approach of just speaking and not truly understanding others may not be yielding the results you desire. Instead of the impactful leadership and positive change you seek, you might be experiencing a lack of meaningful connections and a sense of frustration in your efforts to influence others.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Mastering the art of active listening to understand and connect with others on a deeper level.
Enhancing leadership skills through powerful and effective communication strategies.
Unveiling the impact of body language on successful and impactful global communication.
Implementing proven strategies to propel global podcast growth and reach a wider audience.
Harnessing the transformative power of empathy to drive positive social change on a global scale.
Listening to understand is not just a kindness, but it's actually a superpower for you as a leader, as someone with influence.- Lori Adams-Brown
Mastering the Art of Active Listening: Truly successful communication revolves around the power of active listening. This skill requires patience, humility, and a readiness to prioritize the narrative of others over personal agendas. When leveraged effectively, active listening can foster fruitful dialogues that enable empathy, mutual understanding, and growth.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Write down a call to action from this podcast and add it as your "plus one" for today. This could be a specific action or behavior that you want to implement based on what you've learned.
Tell someone else about your call to action from this podcast. Sharing it with someone else increases the likelihood of following through.
Message the host on social media and share what your call to action was from this podcast. This can help in being accountable and receiving feedback or encouragement.
Invest in yourself as a leader and influencer by learning how to listen to understand better. This could involve seeking out resources, courses, or workshops on active listening and empathy.
Keep making a difference wherever you are by actively practicing intentional, empathetic, and open-minded listening in your daily interactions.
When we hear each other and truly listen to understand, with our differences, we make better decisions, we make greater impact on all the things we're trying to make better in the world. - Lori Adams-Brown
Enhancing Leadership Through Communication: How one communicates as a leader significantly impacts their effectiveness. Central to this is the ability to listen with intent, as this enables better understanding of diverse perspectives and fosters empathetic collaborations. In honing this skill, leaders can transform their teams and communities, paving the way for progressive dialogue and change.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:01 - Introduction to the Power of Listening
00:02:05 - The Skill of Listening to Understand
00:06:59 - The Impact of Listening to Understand
00:10:05 - The Importance of Body Language in Communication
00:13:15 - The Power of Listening to Understand
00:14:07 - Imagine the Impact of Listening to Understand
00:15:34 - Harnessing the Superpower of Listening to Understand
00:15:55 - Taking Action and Making a Difference
00:16:54 - Making the World a Better Place
Imagine if our world leaders, our policymakers, and imagine our influencers embracing the superpower of listening to understand.
- Lori Adams-Brown
Impact of Body Language: Communication transcends the use of verbal language, with body language accounting for a significant part of how messages are exchanged. Nuanced gestures, postures, and facial expressions often speak louder than words, providing insights into one's emotions and intentions. This underscores the need for leaders to be mindful of their body language to ensure constructive, empathetic communication.
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:01 - Introduction to the Power of Listening
Lori introduces the podcast episode and emphasizes the importance of listening to understand in shaping our world and making a positive impact.
00:02:05 - The Skill of Listening to Understand
Lori delves into the skill of listening to understand and highlights the importance of paying attention in a world filled with distractions. She emphasizes the need to go beyond simply hearing words and to listen for facts, feelings, and values.
00:06:59 - The Impact of Listening to Understand
Lori discusses how listening to understand can lead to empathizing, suspending judgment, and asking clarifying questions. She emphasizes the importance of deeper relationships and making better decisions through truly listening and understanding others.
00:10:05 - The Importance of Body Language in Communication
Lori explores the significance of body language in communication, pointing out that it accounts for 55% of how we communicate. She highlights the complexities of navigating different cultures and the role of body language in diplomacy and effective leadership.
00:13:15 - The Power of Listening to Understand
Lori discusses how effective listening can lead to empathy, collaboration, and growth in leadership, diplomacy, and social change.
00:14:07 - Imagine the Impact of Listening to Understand
Lori emphasizes the transformative impact of listening to understand in global conflicts, social justice, climate change, and workplace environments.
00:15:34 - Harnessing the Superpower of Listening to Understand
Lori encourages listeners to cultivate the superpower of listening to understand and highlights the importance of diverse perspectives in solving global problems.
00:15:55 - Taking Action and Making a Difference
Lori motivates listeners to take action by writing down their call to action, sharing it with others, and investing in themselves as leaders and influencers.
00:16:54 - Making the World a Better Place
Lori concludes by thanking global listeners for joining the journey of exploration and emphasizes the importance of listening with intention, empathy, and an open mind for making a difference in the world.
For those who are different and want to make a difference.
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If you're feeling the weight of past trauma and struggling to find healing, then you are not alone! Many individuals have tried traditional methods of healing without finding the relief they seek. Instead of finding validation and empowerment through conventional means, there's a unique path to healing waiting to be discovered through creativity and art.
My special guest is Erin Hung
Erin Hung, an artist residing in Hong Kong, brings two decades of experience in the art and design space, collaborating with prominent global brands such as Chronicle Books, American Greetings, Liberty of London, and Selfridges. Her creative journey, spanning from illustration work to murals and community art, is intertwined with her deep commitment to advocacy. A graduate from Central St. Martins School of Art and Sotheby's Institute in London, Erin's practice now revolves around amplifying voices at the fringes, working closely with mental health organizations and NGOs like UNHCR. Her profound insight into the healing power of creativity, stemming from her own experiences with religious trauma, has led her to spearhead the social media movement "A to Z of trauma recovery," inviting survivors and marginalized communities to heal creatively together. With her compelling art and thoughtful advocacy, Erin is a beacon of inspiration and empowerment.
Therapy is not just for those who are in crisis, although it's definitely for that. But therapy is also a place where you're just stepping into your own skin, figuring out who you are, what it is you're offering to the world around us, and how you're making the world a better place. - Lori Adams Brown
In this episode, you will be able to:
Discover the transformative power of healing through creativity and art for personal growth and emotional well-being.
Uncover the impact of spiritual abuse on faith and explore ways to navigate and heal from this trauma.
Embrace the role of therapy as a catalyst for personal growth and self-discovery, unlocking your full potential.
Navigate the intricate layers of cultural and religious identity, finding empowerment and validation through self-exploration.
Experience the profound benefits of somatic practices for trauma recovery, fostering a deeper connection between mind and body.
Impact of Spiritual Abuse
Erin Hung shares her candid experiences of spiritual abuse within her faith community, highlighting an issue that is oftentimes overlooked or swept under the rug. Such experiences can cause an individual to internalize pain and shame, profoundly impacting their perceptions of self and their relationship with their faith. As Erin rightly emphasizes, acknowledging and addressing the impacts of spiritual abuse is crucial in the journey towards healing.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Follow Erin Hung on Instagram at @erinhung_studio to see her beautiful art and stay updated on her latest projects and movements.
Contribute to the A to Z of trauma recovery movement by using the hashtag #AtoZofTraumaRecovery on social media to share your own creative expressions and join the community of healing and support.
Explore the A to Z of trauma recovery hashtag on social media to view the diverse and impactful artwork and expressions shared by others in the community.
Engage in right brain activities such as art, creativity, and expression to process and heal from trauma, allowing yourself to explore your own creative impulses and find healing through artistic endeavors.
Reach out to Lori Adams-Brown to share your thoughts and experiences, and to connect with others who are navigating similar journeys of healing and recovery.
I think for people, when they say they are not creative or they're not artistically inclined, I want to try and be the person that brings that piece. That's like, maybe if I ignite this match, you might burn a fire. It might kindle a fire that could help you on your way. - Erin Hung
Transformative Power of Healing
Art has a powerful potential to heal, as guest Erin Hung explores in her personal journey of self-discovery and recovery. Channeling our creative impulses can serve as a means of processing personal experiences and finding solace, particularly when navigating trauma. As Erin notes, the exploration of art can foster empowerment, liberation, and ultimately, transformative healing.
If we don't answer to what the creative impulse or the thing that God put inside us and fully explore that, then it's very hard to imagine a way forward for ourselves and for the church. - Erin Hung
Role of Therapy as Catalyst
Therapy, particularly non-verbal modalities such as art and somatic body work, can act as a catalyst for trauma recovery. Erin Hung recounted how these therapeutic methods empowered her to process her personal traumas, finding a language for her experiences that words could not capture. As a creative outlet, therapy can enable an individual unparalleled self-expression, providing a pathway towards understanding, acceptance, and healing.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introducing the Podcast and Guest Erin Hung
00:02:41 - Erin's Journey as an Artist and Advocate
00:10:29 - Cultural Influence on Faith and Interpretation of Scriptures
00:14:28 - Decolonizing Scriptures and Cultural Identity
00:16:17 - Disentangling Cultural Norms and Global Conversations
00:18:23 - Understanding Family Trauma and Shame Culture
00:19:23 - Overcoming Shame and Sharing Personal Trauma
00:20:32 - Decolonizing Faith and Silence
00:21:10 - Healing Through Creativity and Somatic Work
00:27:47 - Experiencing Spiritual Abuse and Gaslighting
00:35:11 - Realization of Making a Difference
00:36:39 - Healing Through Creativity
00:39:39 - The Power of Creativity
00:42:41 - A to Z of Trauma Recovery
00:49:42 - Embracing Beauty and Joy
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introducing the Podcast and Guest Erin Hung
Lori introduces the podcast and guest Erin Hung, an artist living in Hong Kong, known for her illustration work, murals, and community art. Erin's background in the evangelical faith and her journey through religious trauma is also mentioned.
00:02:41 - Erin's Journey as an Artist and Advocate
Erin shares her upbringing in an evangelical family in Hong Kong, her experiences with art and faith, and the cultural pressures she faced as a creative individual within her community. She also discusses the intersection of her faith with her artistic sensibilities.
00:10:29 - Cultural Influence on Faith and Interpretation of Scriptures
Erin delves into the impact of cultural undertones in Chinese churches, specifically the concept of Filio piety and its influence on interpretation of biblical teachings. She reflects on the need to challenge traditional interpretations and explore diverse perspectives within the faith community.
00:14:28 - Decolonizing Scriptures and Cultural Identity
Erin discusses the concept of decolonizing scriptures and its relevance to her own faith experience, particularly in the context of being Chinese and the impact of colonization on cultural identity. She highlights the growing global conversation around colonization and the need for broader understanding.
00:16:17 - Disentangling Cultural Norms and Global Conversations
Erin shares her journey of disentangling cultural norms and understanding the broader historical and global conversations surrounding colonization. She emphasizes the importance of gaining a broader worldview to challenge entrenched cultural dynamics and promote
00:18:23 - Understanding Family Trauma and Shame Culture
Erin discusses the intergenerational trauma within families and the shame culture that perpetuates silence about taboo topics, making others uncomfortable and bringing shame onto oneself and the family.
00:19:23 - Overcoming Shame and Sharing Personal Trauma
Erin shares her openness about discussing personal childhood trauma, acknowledging the potential shame it brings to friends and family, and the collective nature of shame within the community.
00:20:32 - Decolonizing Faith and Silence
Erin delves into the intertwining of faith, church abuse, submission, and shame, highlighting the tendency to silence uncomfortable truths, sweep issues under the rug, and the challenges of decolonizing these ingrained dynamics.
00:21:10 - Healing Through Creativity and Somatic Work
Erin shares her journey of healing through somatic activities like art and gardening, emphasizing how these activities helped her process trauma and connect with her spirituality in a new way.
00:27:47 - Experiencing Spiritual Abuse and Gaslighting
Erin reflects on her experiences of spiritual abuse, gaslighting, and the struggle to find her voice within church settings, ultimately leading to her pursuit of therapy to gain clarity and language for unhealthy dynamics.
00:35:11 - Realization of Making a Difference
Erin reflects on her realization that making a difference does not depend on credentials. She shares her journey of trying to make a difference and the examination of why it wasn't working.
00:36:39 - Healing Through Creativity
Erin discusses her artistic expression as a means of healing. She shares her fear of not leaving a mark in the world and the importance of exploring creativity for healing and personal growth.
00:39:39 - The Power of Creativity
Erin emphasizes the importance of creativity in finding solutions and moving forward. She encourages people to explore their creative impulses and imaginations, highlighting the need for outside-the-box thinking.
00:42:41 - A to Z of Trauma Recovery
Erin introduces the A to Z of trauma recovery movement she started, emphasizing the inclusivity and diversity in the community. She shares how creative expression is a powerful tool for healing and processing trauma.
00:49:42 - Embracing Beauty and Joy
The host reflects on the importance of adding beauty, joy, and hope in life to build resilience in facing hard times. Erin's story serves as a reminder of the power of artistic expression in navigating life's challenges.
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Hey there, are you feeling disillusioned with modern Christianity? Have you been told to just accept the status quo and keep quiet about your doubts and concerns? It can be frustrating to feel like you're not getting the authentic experience you're seeking, especially when it comes to your faith. If you're tired of the ineffective advice to just go along with it, let's explore a better way to understand the history and context of early Christians that can revitalize your faith, whatever your faith background and bring new perspective to your journey. Let's dive into the compelling insights that can reignite your passion for authentic faith, even if that seems a little strange in your current religious context.
My special guest is Dr. Nijay Gupta
Dr. Nijay Gupta, a distinguished professor of New Testament at Northern Seminary, is widely recognized for his scholarly contributions to early Christian studies. Residing in Portland, Oregon, Dr. Gupta also serves as a co-host of the acclaimed Slow Theology podcast and is the founder of the influential Crux Sola blog. With an extensive repertoire of published works, including "Strange Religion," and "Tell Her Story," Dr. Gupta's comprehensive understanding of the historical and cultural context of early Christianity renders him a leading authority in the field. His latest book provides an insightful examination of the ways in which early Christians diverged from the prevalent religious and cultural norms of the Roman Empire, offering a compelling narrative that enriches our understanding of this pivotal era.
I want to believe that is a great and beautiful thing for anyone who feels like their movement has gone astray, whether it's a political movement, a religious movement, a social movement, we can always say, what are the good and beautiful and true things that made us who we are at the beginning? How can we come back to that now? - Dr. Nijay Gupta
In this episode, you will be able to:
Embrace the uniqueness of early Christian teachings to deepen your understanding of faith and spirituality.
Experience a paradigm shift in your perception of religion by exploring the roots of early Christianity.
Explore the profound impact of early Christian theology on modern belief systems and moral values.
Challenge yourself to embody the concept of loving one's enemies and understand its significance in daily life.
Discover the importance of prioritizing self-care and well-being through the lens of early Christian teachings.
Experience a Paradigm Shift
The early Christian revolution led to a paradigm shift, moving from power-driven religious practices towards a focus on goodness and authenticity. It revolutionized societal perceptions, promoting a familial relationship with God over a hierarchical one. This shift redefined societal values, placing emphasis on the inherent dignity of every individual, thus influencing modern perceptions of self-worth and individual rights.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Check out Nijay Gupta's latest book Strange Religion: How Early Christians Contrasted with Roman Religion and Culture available from Brazos Press for a deep dive into the contrast between ancient and modern perspectives on Christianity.
Join the exclusive Difference Maker community on Patreon at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference to access deeper conversations with guests like Nijay Gupta and enjoy exclusive content, including videos and interactions with the host.
Connect with Lori Adams-Brown at Podcast Movement Evolutions in LA at the end of March and attend her breakout session on having a global podcast.
Listen to the Slow Theology podcast co-hosted by Nijay Gupta and Dr. AJ Swoboda for discussions on deconstruction, faith, and navigating a complex world.
Engage with the World of Difference podcast by reaching out to Lori Adams-Brown on social media to share how the podcast has impacted your life and work.
Check out Nijay Gupta's latest book Strange Religion: How Early Christians Contrasted with Roman Religion and Culture available from Brazos Press for a deep dive into the contrast between ancient and modern perspectives on Christianity.
Join the exclusive Difference Maker community on Patreon at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference to access deeper conversations with guests like Nijay Gupta and enjoy exclusive content, including videos and interactions with the host.
Connect with Lori Adams-Brown at Podcast Movement Evolutions in LA at the end of March and attend her breakout session on having a global podcast.
Listen to the Slow Theology podcast co-hosted by Nijay Gupta and Dr. AJ Swaboda for discussions on deconstruction, faith, and navigating a complex world.
Engage with the World of Difference podcast by reaching out to Lori Adams-Brown on social media to share how the podcast has impacted your life and work.
Let suffering speak for the atrocities that are done then and now in the name of Jesus by Christians who should know better. But there's so much in scripture that has done so many good things for the things we take for granted right now. - Dr. Nijay Gupta
Embrace the Uniqueness
Embracing the uniqueness of early Christianity involves accepting its inherent non-conformity, individuality, and authenticity. It requires acknowledging the contrast between early Christian ideals and the current negative perceptions that have tainted the contemporary church. This embrace urges us to strive for a return to the faith's original, 'weird' roots, without the distortions prevalent in current mega-church culture.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the Podcast
00:01:05 - Sponsorship and Therapy
00:01:27 - Introduction of Dr. Nijay Gupta
00:02:23 - The Concept of "Strange Religion,"
00:11:43 - Contrasting Ancient and Modern Religious Practices
00:14:24 - Early Christian Environment
00:17:29 - Religion in the Ancient World
00:19:47 - Gods and Fear
00:21:42 - Paradigm Shift
00:26:39 - Christianity's Evolution
00:29:47 - The Challenge of Loving Your Enemies
00:32:40 - Divisions and Unity
00:33:22 - Suspending Judgment
00:34:23 - Uncovering the Original Message
00:40:39 - The Impact of Early Christians
00:43:12 - Excitement for Podcast Movement Evolutions
00:43:36 - Meeting Listeners
00:43:56 - Gratitude and Encouragement
00:44:20 - Shoutout to Nijay Gupta
00:44:45 - Closing Remarks
Experience a Paradigm Shift
The early Christian revolution led to a paradigm shift, moving from power-driven religious practices towards a focus on goodness and authenticity. It revolutionized societal perceptions, promoting a familial relationship with God over a hierarchical one. This shift redefined societal values, placing emphasis on the inherent dignity of every individual, thus influencing modern perceptions of self-worth and individual rights.
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the Podcast
Lori Adams Brown introduces the World of Difference podcast and its focus on those who are different and want to make a difference. The podcast is sponsored by Betterhelp, emphasizing the importance of therapy for personal growth and understanding strengths.
00:01:05 - Sponsorship and Therapy
Lori highlights the role of therapy in personal development and offers a 10% discount for Betterhelp. She encourages listeners to consider the benefits of talking to a professional about life's challenges and self-discovery.
00:01:27 - Introduction of Dr. Nijay Gupta
Lori introduces Dr. Nijay Gupta, a professor of New Testament at Northern Seminary, highlighting his expertise and previous works. She previews the discussion of his latest book, "Strange Religion," and its focus on early Christians contrasting with Roman culture.
00:02:23 - The Concept of "Strange Religion,"
Dr. Nijay Gupta explains the concept behind his book, "Strange Religion," drawing parallels between the unique individuality of Portland, Oregon, and the early Christians' commitment to a different way of living and beliefs. He emphasizes the need to rediscover the original, revolutionary essence of Christianity.
00:11:43 - Contrasting Ancient and Modern Religious Practices
Dr. Nijay Gupta discusses the differences between ancient Roman religion and modern Western views of religion. He highlights the public, obligatory, and practical nature of ancient Roman religion, contrasting it with the optional and personal approach often seen in modern
00:14:24 - Early Christian Environment
Dr. Nijay Gupta discusses the environment in which early Christians grew up, where religion was an obligation and a question of power and obedience to gods.
00:17:29 - Religion in the Ancient World
Gupta compares the saturation of religion in the ancient world to modern sports culture, highlighting the obligatory nature of religion during that time.
00:19:47 - Gods and Fear
Gupta explores the fear and power dynamics associated with the gods in the ancient world, and how early Christians rejected this paradigm by emphasizing a loving parental relationship with God.
00:21:42 - Paradigm Shift
The conversation delves into how early Christians shifted the religious paradigm from power and coercion to one of inherent dignity for all individuals, leading to a different socio-economic outlook.
00:26:39 - Christianity's Evolution
Gupta reflects on the need for Christianity to constantly evolve and change for the better, drawing inspiration from historical figures like Dietrich von Hoeffer and emphasizing the importance of returning to the core ideas of the faith.
00:29:47 - The Challenge of Loving Your Enemies
Dr. Nijay Gupta discusses the difficulty of Jesus' teaching to love your enemies and how it applies to our world today, especially in the face of political strife.
00:32:40 - Divisions and Unity
Dr. Gupta talks about how divisions exist not only in the political sphere but also in various parts of the world and emphasizes the importance of loving our enemies as a way to overcome these divisions and unite people.
00:33:22 - Suspending Judgment
The conversation delves into the challenge of suspending judgment, especially in today's society, and how it relates to the teachings of Jesus in the Bible.
00:34:23 - Uncovering the Original Message
Dr. Gupta shares the importance of revisiting the original teachings of Christianity and scripture, encouraging readers to look beyond the negative aspects and discover the timeless truths within.
00:40:39 - The Impact of Early Christians
The conversation concludes with a discussion on the impact of early Christians in history and how their values and ideals continue to influence social change and justice movements today.
00:43:12 - Excitement for Podcast Movement Evolutions
Lori shares her excitement for attending Podcast Movement Evolutions in LA and meeting up with listeners. She mentions the opportunity to meet Amy Poehler and her previous experience of hearing will Ferrell.
00:43:36 - Meeting Listeners
Lori expresses her eagerness to meet listeners of the podcast at the event and encourages them to come up and say hi. She values connecting with her audience and appreciates their support.
00:43:56 - Gratitude and Encouragement
Lori expresses gratitude to the listeners for taking the time to tune in and emphasizes the importance of self-care. She encourages everyone to keep making a difference in their own way, wherever they are.
00:44:20 - Shoutout to Nijay Gupta
Lori acknowledges Dr. Nijay Gupta and his perspective shared in the conversation, thanking him for his insights and contribution to the episode.
00:44:45 - Closing Remarks
Lori wraps up the episode with a reminder of the value each listener holds and encourages them to continue making a positive impact in the world.
Impactful Theology
Early Christian theology was transformative, marking a stark departure from the ancient Roman religious practices and fostering a culture of empathy and love. The teachings of Jesus, particularly those focused on love and compassion towards one’s enemies, remains relevant even in today's divisive world. Through a careful examination of our attitudes towards others, especially those with differing ideologies, we can more fully embody these teachings, fostering social transformation and bringing about meaningful change.
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Hey, have you ever felt like you're trying to do the right thing in your business, but it just feels like too much? Like you want to merge profit with purpose, but it seems overwhelming. You're not alone. Many leaders struggle with this, and it can lead to burnout and exhaustion. Let's tackle this together and find a way to align your values with your business practices without feeling overwhelmed.
My special guest is Bessi Graham
Today, we are honored to have Bessi Graham as our guest on the show, joining us from Melbourne, Australia. Bessi is a highly respected entrepreneur with over two decades of experience working closely with business owners, government entities, and major funding bodies. Her extensive involvement ranges from grassroots initiatives with business owners in the Pacific Islands to impactful contributions at the United Nations headquarters in Geneva. Bessi's unparalleled perspective and deep understanding of merging profit and purpose have made her a sought-after authority in the realm of ethical and sustainable business practices. Her commitment to guiding individuals in aligning their values with their business endeavors has led to the creation of impactful legacies. With her wealth of experience in ethical and purpose-driven enterprises, Bessi brings invaluable insights to our discussion today.
I think regardless of where your leadership position is in the organization, it's starting with those pieces of where do I have decision making control, or at least some influence, and then how do I shape things from there towards this idea of business where we're unapologetically pursuing both? - Bessi Graham
In this episode, you will be able to:
Discover how to merge profit and purpose for a more sustainable business model.
Explore the importance of authentic leadership values in driving organizational success.
Learn the benefits of embracing diversity in decision-making processes for better business outcomes.
Humanize your leadership style to create a more inclusive and empowering workplace environment.
Find out how to effectively balance profit with social impact for a meaningful and successful business.
Diversity in decision-making
Diversity fuels creativity, fosters a broader perspective, and aids in making more informed decisions. Bessi advocates for diverse perspectives in decision-making processes and leadership roles, believing it leads to a more inclusive and effective work environment. She stresses the value of stepping out of one's comfort zone to gain a deeper understanding of various contexts, making decision-making a shared and holistic process.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Visit Bessi Graham's website at Bessigraham.com to learn more about her work and access valuable resources.
Download a free resource from Bessi Graham's website that includes five essential questions for decisive leaders to gain clarity on important decisions.
Join the Patreon community at www.patreon.com/aWorldofDifference to access an exclusive interview with Bessi Graham, where she delves deeper into self-leadership and resilience for leaders.
You need to apprentice with the problem. Don't just assume you understand something. Don't think that good intentions are good enough. - Bessi Graham
Authentic leadership values
Leadership, as per Bessi, should echo authentic values. It is important that leaders' actions align with their stated values to build trust, credibility, and influence. Moreover, these values should inform decision-making processes ensuring organisational integrity and fostering a culture of honesty and transparency.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Bridging Profit and Purpose
00:06:49 - Impact of Living Abroad
00:10:14 - Humanizing Leadership
00:14:06 - Influence of Values
00:15:14 - Meaningful Values
00:16:04 - The Importance of Core Values
00:17:10 - Aligning Values with Action
00:18:11 - Core Values in Organizations
00:19:03 - Decision Cascade and Clarity
00:25:00 - Bridging Systemic and Grassroots Perspectives
00:31:08 - Apprenticing with the Problem
00:36:17 - Balancing Purpose and Profit
00:39:57 - Shaping Decision-Making
00:42:19 - Purpose and Opportunity
00:43:44 - Connecting with Bessie
00:45:55 - Learning from Experience
00:46:32 - Resilience and Self-Leadership
00:47:07 - Taking a Break without Compromising Impact
00:47:45 - Embracing Individuality
We need to hold these two. This goes back to your both and mindset. Right. So as a leader, being able to hold two things that seem contradictory and say they're equally true. - Bessi Graham
Merge profit and purpose
Bessi Graham emphasizes that profitability and purpose are not mutually exclusive. One can create a business model that aligns with personal values, promotes social impact, and ensures financial success. The trick lies in understanding customer value, and in finding ways to create and capture said value while benefiting society.
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Bridging Profit and Purpose
Bessie discusses the importance of merging money and meaning in business. She emphasizes the need for leaders to uncover their unconscious beliefs about the purpose of business and how it impacts decision-making.
00:06:49 - Impact of Living Abroad
Bessie shares how her experiences living in different countries shaped her perspective as a leader. She highlights the value of diverse perspectives and the importance of intentionally seeking out different viewpoints in leadership.
00:10:14 - Humanizing Leadership
Bessie delves into the concept of humanizing leadership and the need to treat employees as more than just cogs in a wheel. She emphasizes the importance of integrating purpose into business decisions and creating a more holistic approach to leadership.
00:14:06 - Influence of Values
Bessie discusses the influence of values on decision-making as a leader. She emphasizes the need for leaders to understand and articulate their values, and how values drive behavior in business settings.
00:15:14 - Meaningful Values
Bessie explores the deeper meaning of values in business and challenges the superficial approach often taken. She emphasizes the importance of values as a guiding force in decision-making and living authentically as a leader.
00:16:04 - The Importance of Core Values
Bessi discusses the significance of identifying and living by core values. She emphasizes intentionally cultivating conditions that allow individuals to live in alignment with their values, leading to better decision-making and natural best performance.
00:17:10 - Aligning Values with Action
Bessi emphasizes the need for values to inform decision-making and actions. She highlights the importance of having values as filters for decision-making, particularly in fast-paced environments, to maintain integrity and alignment.
00:18:11 - Core Values in Organizations
Bessi stresses the need for clarity in company core values, cautioning against superficial or simplistic lists. She emphasizes the importance of aligning values with behavior and action, not just as aspirational values, to build trust and integrity within the organization.
00:19:03 - Decision Cascade and Clarity
Bessi introduces the concept of the decision cascade as a tool for unlocking clarity and decisiveness, particularly around values. She explains how breaking down decisions into primary, secondary, and tertiary levels can lead to smoother decision-making and prevent costly missteps.
00:25:00 - Bridging Systemic and Grassroots Perspectives
Bessi shares her experiences working at both grassroots and systemic levels, emphasizing the importance of understanding broader systems while still being connected to the ground reality. She highlights the value of expanding perspectives to bridge different worlds and drive innovation in leadership.
00:31:08 - Apprenticing with the Problem
Bessie shares Pamela Hardigan's advice to "apprentice with the problem," emphasizing curiosity, asking questions, and having conversations rather than assuming we know best. She also highlights the importance of holding seemingly contradictory ideas in our minds and working towards a balance.
00:36:17 - Balancing Purpose and Profit
Bessie discusses how many leaders feel overwhelmed by the idea of adding purpose to their business, seeing it as a distraction or expense. She challenges this perspective, encouraging leaders to merge money and meaning by pursuing competitive advantages that add value and relieve pressure.
00:39:57 - Shaping Decision-Making
Bessie emphasizes the importance of shaping decisions and influencing outcomes, even for middle managers. She encourages leaders to create psychologically safe spaces for their teams, shape how directives are shared, and cultivate a culture of unapologetically pursuing both purpose and profit.
00:42:19 - Purpose and Opportunity
Bessie speaks about the belief that money and meaning can be merged, leading to a self-reinforcing loop of delivering and capturing value. She encourages leaders to shift their perspective, innovate in their business models, and create win-win situations that relieve pressure and stress.
00:43:44 - Connecting with Bessie
Lori thanks Bessie for sharing her unique perspective and encourages listeners to visit Bessie's website for more resources and insights. Bessie offers a free download of five essential questions
00:45:55 - Learning from Experience
Lori discusses the value of sharing knowledge and learning from others, highlighting Bessi Graham's extensive experience working at the UN headquarters and in diverse locations like the Pacific islands and Melbourne, Australia.
00:46:32 - Resilience and Self-Leadership
The conversation delves into the importance of resilience and self-leadership, offering insights on how to navigate difficult circumstances and make congruent decisions to alleviate burnout.
00:47:07 - Taking a Break without Compromising Impact
Lori emphasizes the significance of taking breaks and self-care while continuing to make a difference in the world, encouraging listeners to stay true to themselves and bring their unique contributions to the table.
00:47:45 - Embracing Individuality
The episode concludes with a reminder to embrace individuality and show up authentically, highlighting the importance of being true to oneself and making a difference in the world. Lori urges listeners to take care of themselves and continue making an impact.
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Uncover the unexpected impact of the Trump campaign on the evangelical community as NPR journalist Sarah McCammon shares her personal journey. Her book delves into the complex experiences of those navigating a transition away from evangelicalism, offering a raw and empathetic perspective. Join us as we explore the surprising insights and vulnerabilities that shape this compelling narrative. Stay tuned for a revealing conversation that will leave you with a fresh perspective and a newfound appreciation for diverse religious experiences.
My special guest is Sarah McCammon
Sarah McCammon, a national political correspondent for NPR and co-host of the NPR Politics podcast, is recognized for her extensive coverage of political, social, and cultural divisions in America, specifically delving into the intersections of politics and religion, reproductive rights, and the conservative movement. With past experience as NPR's lead political reporter during the 2016 election cycle, assigned to the Donald Trump campaign, she offers a comprehensive understanding of the impact of Trumpism on evangelical communities. Her upcoming book, "The Exvangelicals: Loving, Living, and Leaving the White Evangelical Church," draws from her personal background growing up in white evangelicalism in the Midwest, providing a firsthand perspective on the subject matter. Sarah McCammon's authoritative insights, coupled with her personal experiences, contribute a significant and authentic viewpoint to the discussion.
Don't be afraid of questions. Try to find trusted people, whether that's people in your church or outside of it, people who are of goodwill and that love you and tell them what you're thinking about. - Sarah McCammon
In this episode, you will be able to:
Unpacking the challenges of an evangelical upbringing - understanding the complexities and impact on personal identity.
Exploring the influence of Trumpism on evangelical communities, shedding light on shifting ideologies and values.
Understanding the evolving demographics of American Christianity and its implications for society and culture.
Embracing inclusivity and diversity in religious spaces, fostering a sense of belonging and understanding for all individuals.
Analyzing the role of media in shaping evangelical narratives, providing insight into the power of storytelling and representation.
Evolving Demographics of American Christianity
The landscape of American Christianity is undergoing a marked transformation, with shifts in demographics and the growing influence of social media. As Sarah emphasizes, these changes may result in a more liberal, secular, and diverse religious demographic. Recognizing and embracing these shifts is crucial for evolving religious spaces and fostering inclusivity and diversity within such communities.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Preorder Sarah McCammon's book The Exvangelicals: Loving, Living, and Leaving the White Evangelical Church releasing on March 19, 2024. Preordering helps support the book's sales and ensures you receive it as soon as it's available.
Follow Sarah McCammon on Twitter at @sarahmccammon for updates, insights, and discussions on her work and the topics she covers.
Subscribe to Sarah McCammon's Substack Off the Air for nuanced conversations, personal insights, and behind-the-scenes stories from her experiences as a journalist.
Join the Difference Makers community on Patreon to access exclusive, in-depth conversations with guests like Sarah McCammon, where you can engage with others and learn how to make a difference together.
Engage with Sarah McCammon's work and share your thoughts on her book, her insights, and the topics discussed in the podcast to continue the conversation and contribute to making a difference.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the World of Difference podcast
00:00:44 - Benefits of Therapy and Betterhelp
00:01:17 - Introduction of Sarah McCammon
00:02:27 - Sarah McCammon's Background and Book
00:03:00 - Personal Vulnerability in Writing
00:14:09 - Finding Inner Strength
00:16:34 - Impact of Trump Narrative
00:19:52 - Pressure for Perfectionism
00:23:08 - Understanding Exvangelical
00:27:43 - Impact of Evangelical Movement
00:28:58 - Rise of the Nones and Impact on Politics
00:29:36 - Factors Contributing to Change
00:30:15 - Church Response and Criticism
00:32:24 - Intimate Perspectives and Voices
00:35:22 - Inclusivity and Diverse Perspectives
00:43:25 - The Impact of Gen Z in the Election
00:44:25 - Future of Exvangelical Movement
00:46:08 - Evolving Religious Spaces
00:47:28 - Connecting with Sarah
00:48:23 - Sarah's Writing and Impact
I think it's okay to pray anytime you want. And I don't think you have to know exactly what you think about that. - Sarah McCammon
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the World of Difference podcast
Host Lori Adams Brown introduces the podcast as a platform for those who are different and want to make a difference. She also mentions the podcast's sponsor, Betterhelp, and the benefits of therapy for personal growth and self-discovery.
00:00:44 - Benefits of Therapy and Betterhelp
Brown discusses the benefits of therapy for personal growth, self-discovery, and mental well-being. She highlights the role of therapy in understanding oneself and making a positive impact on the world. Lori Adams-Brown also promotes Betterhelp as a resource for professional therapy.
00:01:17 - Introduction of Sarah McCammon
Brown introduces Sarah McCammon as a national political correspondent for NPR and co-host of the NPR Politics podcast. She outlines McCammon's work focusing on political, social, and cultural divides in America, including the intersections of politics and religion, reproductive rights, and the conservative movement.
00:02:27 - Sarah McCammon's Background and Book
Brown discusses McCammon's upcoming book, "The Exvangelicals: Loving, Living, and Leaving the White Evangelical Church," highlighting McCammon's personal experience growing up in white evangelicalism in the Midwest. Brown also mentions McCammon's diverse media appearances and her current residence in Norfolk, Virginia.
00:03:00 - Personal Vulnerability in Writing
Brown and McCammon discuss the personal vulnerability of writing about one's experiences, with McCammon sharing her
00:14:09 - Finding Inner Strength
Sarah shares a spiritual moment of finding inner strength in a challenging situation outside the church. She discusses the evangelical expectation of spiritual moments and the concept of loving one's enemies.
00:16:34 - Impact of Trump Narrative
Sarah discusses how the Trump narrative of labeling reporters as the worst people has affected the perception of evangelical whistleblowers reporting spiritual or sexual abuse in churches. She highlights the importance of criticisms from within the evangelical community.
00:19:52 - Pressure for Perfectionism
Sarah reflects on the intense pressure for perfectionism and behavior management of children within evangelical spiritual formation. She shares her experience of feeling the responsibility to be a witness for Jesus through her family's appearance and behavior.
00:23:08 - Understanding Exvangelical
Sarah explains the term "exvangelical" and addresses misconceptions about the group being exclusively non-religious or secular. She emphasizes the common experience of stepping away from evangelicalism and the complexity of the journey.
00:27:43 - Impact of Evangelical Movement
Sarah discusses the well-established impact of the evangelical movement on American politics and society. She also explores the broader societal and cultural impact of the exvangelical movement, highlighting its role in the larger shift away from religion.
00:28:58 - Rise of the Nones and Impact on Politics
The conversation delves into the growing demographic of the Nones and its potential impact on American politics, as well as the erosion of the Republican base and the rise of a more liberal and secular movement.
00:29:36 - Factors Contributing to Change
Demographic changes, social media, and the impact of Trumpism are discussed as factors contributing to the shift in evangelicalism and Christianity, with implications for both politics and culture.
00:30:15 - Church Response and Criticism
The conversation explores the responses of churches and prominent pastors to the move away from evangelicalism, as well as the criticism from Christian evangelical thinkers and the need for churches to become more open to diverse points of view.
00:32:24 - Intimate Perspectives and Voices
The dialogue emphasizes the value of intimate perspectives and granular insights from individuals raised in the evangelical world, shedding light on experiences and perspectives often overlooked in academic conversations.
00:35:22 - Inclusivity and Diverse Perspectives
The conversation highlights the need for inclusivity and the elevation of voices of people of color and women in evangelical spaces, as well as the potential impact on shaping priorities, theology, and perspectives on scriptures.
00:43:25 - The Impact of Gen Z in the Election
The conversation begins with a focus on Gen Z's influence on the upcoming election and their diverse upbringing in the digital age, reflecting on the changes happening in society.
00:44:25 - Future of Exvangelical Movement
Sarah discusses the challenges faced by younger exvangelicals in forming their own religious identity and the need for more inclusive religious spaces. She also explores potential future trends in an increasingly diverse and secularized society.
00:46:08 - Evolving Religious Spaces
The discussion shifts to the evolution of religious spaces, with a particular focus on churches genuinely welcoming non-traditional beliefs and the need for meaningful connections in an evolving society.
00:47:28 - Connecting with Sarah
Sarah shares her presence on various social media platforms, emphasizing her engagement with Substack for more nuanced conversations and insights into her life as a journalist and a mother.
00:48:23 - Sarah's Writing and Impact
The conversation concludes with a focus on Sarah's impactful writing, her vulnerability in exploring personal narratives, and the importance of amplifying her voice and perspective in the media and journalism industry.
I think there's something like that, particularly in an increasingly diverse and secularized society. I think people are always going to need connection and look for meaning, but where they find it, I think might change a little bit. - Sarah McCammon
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Want to learn the key to supporting survivors of sexual assault and making a real difference in their lives? Rowena Chiu shares her powerful insights and experiences, shedding light on the path to understanding and supporting survivors. Stay tuned to discover how you can be a part of the change and make a positive impact in the lives of survivors.
My special guest is Rowena Chiu
It's an absolute pleasure to introduce Rowena Chiu, an extraordinary survivor and advocate joining us today. Rowena's journey, from being an assistant to Miramax CEO Harvey Weinstein to bravely sharing her experience of sexual assault, is nothing short of inspiring. Her powerful voice has not only contributed to the #MeToo movement but has also sparked crucial conversations about power dynamics and influence in sexual assault cases. With a rich cultural heritage and a global perspective, Rowena brings a unique blend of insight and empathy to the table. Her unwavering commitment to advocating for survivors and fostering change makes her an invaluable voice in our ongoing dialogue about abuse. We're truly privileged to have her with us today.
Rowena Chiu worked as Assistant To Harvey Weinstein in 1998. After leaving the film industry, she has worked in the fields of management consulting (for Accenture in London, McKinsey & Company in Silicon Valley, and PricewaterhouseCoopers in Hong Kong) and international development (for the World Bank in Ethiopia, South Sudan & Washington DC). Rowena holds an MA in English Language & Literature from the University of Oxford, an MSc in International Management For China from the University of London, and an MBA from London Business School. She lives in Silicon Valley with her husband and four young children and is currently working on a memoir and a screenplay about her experiences in the film industry.
"Sit with a survivor. Hear their story, acknowledge their grief. Let them own that space. Give them the space to talk about it. Say all the things that Lori was gracious enough and kind enough to say just now. 'I believe you. I'm here for you. I will listen for as long as it takes for you to come out with your story. I will be that safe space for you.'" - Rowena Chiu
In this episode, you will be able to:
Explore effective strategies for advocating for sexual assault survivors.
Discover the importance of cultural sensitivity in addressing sexual assault.
Understand power dynamics and influence in sexual assault cases.
Uncover the impact of media portrayal on sexual assault survivors.
Learn how to create a trauma-informed and survivor-centric society.
Address with cultural sensitivity
Understanding cultural nuances can deeply impact how we approach conversations about sexual assault. For instance, in cultures that value collectivism like Rowena Chiu's Chinese background, the individualistic approach often adopted in the West of isolated support may not be as effective. Instead, broader family and social context need to be taken into account, which demands a healthy dose of cultural sensitivity when providing support or addressing potential impediments to speaking out.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Join the Patreon community called Difference Makers at www.patreon.com/aWorldofDifference to watch the exclusive video episode where Lori Adams-Brown and Rowena Chiu discuss organizations that Rowena supports and get a call to action to make a difference together.
Follow Rowena Chiu on social media platforms such as LinkedIn, Twitter, and Instagram to stay updated on her speaking engagements, advocacy work, and upcoming memoir.
Reach out to Lori Adams-Brown on Twitter at @LoriAdBr or on Instagram at @LoriAdamsBrown for support, prayers, or to share your thoughts on the episode.
Show support for Rowena Chiu by attending her speaking engagements, especially if she is in your area, and by engaging with her content on social media.
Consider sitting with a survivor, hearing their story, acknowledging their grief, and offering support by saying, "I believe you, I support you, and I'll sit with you as long as it takes for you to tell your story."
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction and Therapy Benefits
00:01:00 - Sponsor Promotion and Trigger Warning
00:03:00 - Guest Introduction and Cultural Background
00:07:49 - Impact of Sexual Assault on Community and Family
00:11:18 - Rowena's Story: Assault, NDA, and 20 Years of Silence
00:14:15 - The Trauma of Speaking Out Publicly
00:15:10 - The Importance of Speaking Out
00:16:32 - Impact of Sharing Personal Story
00:19:34 - MeToo Movement's Impact on Workplace Conversation
00:24:43 - Centering Survivor Stories
00:28:24 - Women's identification with survivors
00:29:42 - Survivor representation in media
00:30:36 - Bringing generational change
00:33:01 - Speaking out against powerful figures
00:38:20 - Myths about survivor success
00:43:20 - The Neat Bow in Allyship
00:45:02 - Finding Rowena
00:46:43 - Sharing Your Story
00:48:16 - Finding Healing
00:49:40 - Supporting Rowena
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction and Therapy Benefits
Lori introduces the podcast and its sponsor, Betterhelp, emphasizing the benefits of therapy for personal growth and self-understanding, not just crisis intervention.
00:01:00 - Sponsor Promotion and Trigger Warning
Lori promotes the sponsor, Betterhelp, offering a discount for first-time users. She also provides a trigger warning for sensitive topics related to abuse and sexual assault.
00:03:00 - Guest Introduction and Cultural Background
Lori introduces the guest, Rowena Chiu, an abuse survivor and advocate. Rowena shares her cultural background as a British-born Chinese and discusses the significance of Lunar New Year and the challenges faced by abuse survivors in communal cultures.
00:07:49 - Impact of Sexual Assault on Community and Family
Rowena discusses the collective impact of sexual assault on survivors and their communities, emphasizing the communal nature of Chinese culture and the importance of addressing the broader impact on families and communities.
00:11:18 - Rowena's Story: Assault, NDA, and 20 Years of Silence
Rowena shares her personal experience of being sexually assaulted by Harvey Weinstein, reporting the assault, signing a nondisclosure agreement (NDA), and being silenced for 20 years. She highlights the complex reasons for her delayed decision to speak out publicly.
00:14:15 - The Trauma of Speaking Out Publicly
Rowena discusses the distinction between private and public trauma when speaking about a difficult experience on a wide platform, such as a TV show, compared to sharing with close friends and family.
00:15:10 - The Importance of Speaking Out
Rowena emphasizes the difficulty of speaking out, but also stresses the importance of doing so, particularly for those who have not yet shared their experiences with trusted individuals.
00:16:32 - Impact of Sharing Personal Story
Rowena reflects on the personal and professional impact of sharing her story, drawing inspiration from Dr. Christine Blasey Ford and highlighting the strength derived from fellow survivors.
00:19:34 - MeToo Movement's Impact on Workplace Conversation
Rowena discusses the MeToo movement's role in exposing power dynamics and inequalities in the workplace, emphasizing the need for societal change and true equity.
00:24:43 - Centering Survivor Stories
Rowena addresses the media's tendency to center the perpetrator in narratives, expressing the challenges in getting survivor stories featured and the need for a more survivor-centric approach in media and society.
00:28:24 - Women's identification with survivors
Rowena discusses the difficulty for women to identify with sexual assault survivors like Laura Madden, Rowena Chu, and Zelda Perkins, compared to high-profile figures like Jodie Cantor and Megan Tui. She highlights societal treatment and media depiction of survivors.
00:29:42 - Survivor representation in media
Rowena critiques the two-dimensional portrayal of survivors in media, emphasizing the need for a more comprehensive depiction. She points out the survivor-centric nature of "she said" but notes the focus on journalists rather than survivors.
00:30:36 - Bringing generational change
Rowena expresses the need for generational change in societal attitudes towards survivors. She acknowledges the difficulty of having conversations about sexual assault and the discomfort survivors bring, emphasizing the importance of creating a better world for future generations.
00:33:01 - Speaking out against powerful figures
Rowena addresses the challenges of speaking out against powerful individuals, such as pastors or influential figures in the entertainment industry. She encourages finding allies and emphasizes the impact of one's voice in inspiring others.
00:38:20 - Myths about survivor success
Rowena discusses common myths about survivor success, highlighting the importance of acknowledging and sitting with survivors' grief. She challenges the notion that personal success in career or family can compensate for the trauma experienced.
00:43:20 - The Neat Bow in Allyship
Rowena emphasizes that anyone can be an ally of the MeToo movement, and shares that sitting with a survivor, hearing their story, and acknowledging their grief is the most impactful way to support them.
00:45:02 - Finding Rowena
Rowena shares where people can find her on social media platforms, talks about her upcoming book, and discusses her speaking engagements in various settings to open up a dialogue about sexual assault and survivorship.
00:46:43 - Sharing Your Story
Lori acknowledges the difficulty of sharing abuse stories and offers love and support to listeners who may have been inspired by Rowena's journey of speaking out after years of silence.
00:48:16 - Finding Healing
Lori reassures listeners that they are not alone, encourages them to seek healing, and highlights the importance of sitting with survivors and supporting them through their journey of healing.
00:49:40 - Supporting Rowena
Lori urges listeners to support Rowena in her advocacy work, shares information about exclusive content on Patreon, and emphasizes the impact of being a part of the support network for survivors like Rowena.
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Uncover the shocking truth behind a pastor's arrest and the toxic systems in faith communities. Join me as we delve into a Twitter thread that reveals the dark underbelly of abuse, manipulation, and cover-ups within religious institutions. You won't believe the tactics used to protect the abuser and silence the whistleblowers. This eye-opening discussion will leave you with a newfound understanding of the challenges survivors face and the importance of dismantling toxic systems. Stay tuned to unravel the unexpected truths and be part of a community where your voice matters.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Recognize signs of abusive pastors within faith communities to protect vulnerable members.
Uncover tactics used to silence victims and empower them to speak out.
Center survivors and support whistleblowers to create a culture of trust and accountability.
Identify patterns and toxic systems in faith communities to foster healing and change.
Learn how to create safe spaces for victims within faith communities to promote healing and restoration.
"It's heavy. It's a lot to take in. And if you're in a faith environment right now, listening to this, where things seem not right, things seem like there's a lot of red flags. You're not sure how to process it. Maybe a pastor has been accused of abuse or even arrested for crimes, and you're hearing these narratives. I just want to say, I'm sad with you that that's happening, and I hope you get to a place of safety." -Lori Adams-Brown
Uncovering tactics used to silence victims is a critical part of creating safer faith communities. These strategies may include deflecting blame onto whistleblowers, encouraging unification around the abuser, and invoking notions of spiritual warfare to foster loyalty. Awareness of these tactics can encourage conversations about abuse and discourage the protection of abusers.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Join the Difference Maker community on Patreon at www.patreon.com/aWorldofDifference to access deeper episodes and discussions with guests.
If you need to talk to a professional, consider signing up for therapy with Betterhelp at www.betterhelp.com/difference for 10% off your first month.
Take a deep breath, look around the room, and notice five things that you see to use grounding techniques for processing heavy emotions.
The Twitter/X thread where Lori lists the common statements she hears from churches with "predapastors" who have abuse allegations and even at times crimes: https://x.com/loriadbr/status/1753526994979934418?s=20
"Centering survivors should be number one. But I just almost never hear it in these cases." - Lori Adams-Brown
Recognizing signs of abusive pastors can be challenging due to their position of authority. However, patterns often emerge including the protection of the pastor over the well-being of the congregation. This emphasis on shielding the pastor can lead to harmful practices like silencing victims, minimizing the severity of the abuse, and even blaming those who speak out.
Survivors of abuse should be treated with respect and care. Instead of centering the narrative around the abuser in times of crisis, communities should prioritize listening to and supporting survivors. Creating a culture that truly supports survivors can help dismantle toxic systems and create an environment in which truth and transparency prevail.
"I hope you get to a place of safety. I hope you get to a place where your voice matters. And I hope you can find the freedom and the love that you deserve to thrive with your spirituality in a place where it's safe to be you and to speak the truth out loud."-Lori Adams-Brown
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction to World of Difference Podcast
00:01:40 - Processing News of Pastor Arrest
00:03:52 - Grooming and Gaslighting in Faith Communities
00:07:14 - Patterns of Abusive Leadership
00:13:57 - Distracting from Abuse with Grandiosity
00:14:46 - Downplaying Abuse and Crime
00:15:30 - Unifying Around the Abuser
00:16:41 - Spiritual Warfare and Manipulation
00:18:07 - Silencing and Control
00:19:55 - Finding Safety and Support
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction to World of Difference Podcast
Lori Adams-Brown introduces the podcast as a platform for those who are different and want to make a difference, sponsored by Betterhelp for therapy and personal growth.
00:01:40 - Processing News of Pastor Arrest
Lori shares her personal experience of processing the news of a pastor's arrest on 35 counts of sexual assault and how it resonated with many listeners on Twitter.
00:03:52 - Grooming and Gaslighting in Faith Communities
Lori discusses how faith communities often groom their members to protect abusive leaders, focusing on the abuser rather than the victims, and using psychological tactics like gaslighting.
00:07:14 - Patterns of Abusive Leadership
The conversation delves into the common patterns of abusive leadership in faith communities, including the use of coercion, betrayal blindness, and centering the abusive leader while disregarding the victims.
00:13:57 - Distracting from Abuse with Grandiosity
Lori highlights the tactic of using grandiosity, such as claiming "God has big plans for the pastor," to distract from the abuse and crimes, and redirect focus to the size and success of the ministry.
00:14:46 - Downplaying Abuse and Crime
The conversation starts with a discussion on the tactic of downplaying sexual abuse as merely a sin, minimizing the severity of the abuse and crime.
00:15:30 - Unifying Around the Abuser
The tactic of using unity language to silence whistleblowers and center the focus around the abuser instead of the victims, creating a cult-like environment.
00:16:41 - Spiritual Warfare and Manipulation
Manipulative tactics of framing the situation as a battle between good and evil, pressuring individuals to support the abuser and silencing conversations about safety within the faith community.
00:18:07 - Silencing and Control
Addressing the tactic of silencing and controlling the narrative within religious environments to maintain image management and prevent conversations about abuse and misconduct.
00:19:55 - Finding Safety and Support
Offering support and empathy to individuals in faith environments where abuse and red flags are present, encouraging them to seek safety and speak the truth.
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In the pursuit of becoming a great leader, Lance Ford found himself immersed in the fervor of the mid-90s Seeker church movement. However, his journey took an unexpected turn as he began to notice discrepancies between the teachings of Jesus and the prevailing leadership ethos. This realization led to his departure from the church he had founded, and a subsequent role at a prominent megachurch only solidified his conviction that a deeper issue permeated the church's leadership structures. What he discovered will challenge everything you thought you knew about leadership in the church.
If you're feeling overwhelmed by the pressure to grow your church at any cost, then you are not alone! The relentless focus on numbers and programs may be leaving you feeling spiritually depleted, despite the outward appearance of success. If you're feeling like you have to put on a facade of perfection and always have all the answers, then you are not alone! The pursuit of a mega-church model may be causing you to neglect your own well-being and authenticity as a leader. If you're feeling like you're constantly comparing your church to others and never measuring up, then you are not alone! The endless cycle of competition and comparison in the pursuit of growth may be leading to burnout and a loss of true community within your congregation.
My special guest is Lance Ford.
Lance Ford, a well-established church leader and author, has made significant contributions to the faith community through his publications in recognized platforms like Christianity Today and Outreach magazine. With a distinguished career spanning over three decades, Lance has applied his expertise as a pastor and church planner to develop unique training systems utilized by network seminaries and leaders globally. Renowned for his insightful books, including "Unleader," "The Starfish and the Spirit," and "Missional Essentials," Lance has demonstrated a comprehensive understanding of the complexities within evangelical spaces. His latest work, "The Atlas Factor," critically examines the inherent pitfalls of traditional church leadership models, offering valuable insights and practical wisdom for church leaders and pastors aiming to establish healthier and more authentic leadership structures. Lance's extensive experience and authoritative perspective position him as a valuable resource for reshaping leadership dynamics within the faith community.
You're not wrong with those little red flags. When you go to the scripture again, you start seeing it. - Lance Ford
In this episode, you will be able to:
Embrace authentic and servant-hearted leadership in your faith community.
Explore the pitfalls of the mega-church model and its impact on leadership.
Learn to shift the focus of leadership to Jesus for a more genuine approach.
Understand the disillusionment with the leadership industrial complex and its effects.
Implement healthier leadership structures for a more sustainable and impactful church.
Cultivating healthier leadership structures
Creating healthier leadership structures within the church is a salient issue across different denominations and sizes of churches. Institutions can draw on Jesus Christ's teachings for inspiration, fostering a balance of power that encourages servant-hearted leadership. By shifting leadership paradigms and prioritizing the fundamental teachings of Jesus Christ, churches can cultivate healthier communities that better serve their congregations and embody the true spirit of Christianity.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Join the Difference Maker community by visiting www.patreon.com/aWorldofDifference to access exclusive interviews and engage in deeper conversations with difference makers like Lance Ford.
Purchase a copy of Lance Ford's book, "The Atlas Factor," to gain insight into toxic leadership systems and find hope for healthier faith communities. The book is available for purchase on various online platforms and in bookstores.
Connect with Lance Ford for coaching, consulting, and training on church leadership and systems by visiting www.theatlasfactor.com or emailing [email protected].
Consider engaging in self-care practices to support your mental and emotional well-being, especially if the conversation has brought up challenging experiences or emotions. Take time to breathe, engage your senses, and prioritize your own health and well-being.
Explore the free trial option for the Difference Maker community to access exclusive interviews, polls, and engage in conversations that can help you make a difference in your own unique way.
The majority are good. Even some of the worst abusers that we could name today, you look back at their history, you talk to the witnesses that were around in the early days. They started out good. - Lance Ford
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introducing the Podcast and Guest
00:01:52 - Lance's Background and Book
00:04:10 - Aha Moment
00:11:08 - Root Causes of Leadership Issues
00:14:15 - Church as a Platform for Narcissism
00:16:38 - The Evolution of Leadership
00:23:17 - Abuse of Power in Churches
00:27:04 - Jesus' Approach to Power
00:29:32 - Impact of the System on Whistleblowers
00:30:21 - The Atlas Factor
00:33:33 - The Importance of the Atlas Vertebra
00:35:06 - Paul's Teachings on Leadership
00:36:57 - Challenging Traditional Leadership Models
00:39:55 - Overcoming Cognitive Dissonance
00:46:03 - A Call to Action and Finding Support
00:49:19 - Importance of Metaphor and Theology
00:50:05 - Lance's Approach and Authenticity
00:51:46 - Recognizing Red Flags
00:52:47 - Lance's Empathy and Straightforwardness
00:55:21 - Self-Care and Encouragement
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introducing the Podcast and Guest
Lori introduces the podcast and the guest, Lance Ford. She highlights his background as a pastor, church planter, and author, and emphasizes his new book, "The Atlas Factor."
00:01:52 - Lance's Background and Book
Lance shares his background as a pastor and network director, and his journey of questioning leadership in the church. He discusses his previous book, "Unleader," and how it led to the writing of "The Atlas Factor."
00:04:10 - Aha Moment
Lori asks Lance about his moment of realization regarding the leadership culture in the church. Lance shares his experience of being on staff at a large church and witnessing questionable behavior from influential leaders, leading to his realization of the epidemic.
00:11:08 - Root Causes of Leadership Issues
Lori and Lance discuss the potential causes of the toxic leadership culture in the church. They touch on the attraction of power and influence in faith-based organizations and the potential draw for individuals with narcissistic tendencies.
00:14:15 - Church as a Platform for Narcissism
The conversation delves into the allure of the church as a platform for individuals with narcissistic tendencies to fulfill their desire for power and control. They explore the dynamics that enable and perpetuate such behavior within church leadership.
00:16:38 - The Evolution of Leadership
Lance discusses his surprise at the newness of the concept of leadership, as evidenced by its absence in older dictionaries. He highlights the industrial revolution's impact on the development of modern leadership theories.
00:23:17 - Abuse of Power in Churches
Lori and Lance discuss the specific impact of the industrial revolution on church leadership and the resulting burnout culture. They emphasize the need to address systemic issues rather than just symptoms.
00:27:04 - Jesus' Approach to Power
Lance delves into Jesus' teachings on power and leadership, emphasizing the contrast between worldly power dynamics and the servant leadership model promoted by Jesus.
00:29:32 - Impact of the System on Whistleblowers
The conversation explores the detrimental effects of the current leadership system on whistleblowers and women, highlighting the toxic masculinity and patriarchal structures within the church.
00:30:21 - The Atlas Factor
Lance introduces the concept of the Atlas factor as a metaphor for the burden placed on church leaders to carry the weight of the world. He explores the idea of decentralized leadership and the need to shift the focus onto Jesus as the true head of the church.
00:33:33 - The Importance of the Atlas Vertebra
Lance Ford discusses the significance of the atlas vertebra, its role in connecting the brain to the body, and how misalignment can affect overall health.
00:35:06 - Paul's Teachings on Leadership
Paul's writings in Ephesians are discussed, emphasizing the importance of the body of Christ and the misuse of titles such as "head pastor" in modern leadership models.
00:36:57 - Challenging Traditional Leadership Models
Lance encourages readers to re-examine their understanding of leadership by reading the Bible with fresh eyes and questioning the prevailing church growth and leadership models.
00:39:55 - Overcoming Cognitive Dissonance
The conversation delves into the challenges of navigating cognitive dissonance within the church, addressing the disconnect between what should be happening and what actually occurs in many church settings.
00:46:03 - A Call to Action and Finding Support
Lance offers support to those who have experienced abuse within the church, providing hope and practical resources for individuals and communities seeking positive change. He also shares his contact information for further assistance.
00:49:19 - Importance of Metaphor and Theology
Lance Ford discusses the significance of the metaphor of the Atlas factor and theological implications. He emphasizes the need for people to know they are not alone in dealing with toxic faith environments.
00:50:05 - Lance's Approach and Authenticity
Lori praises Lance's research synthesis and caring nature. She highlights his ability to give language to issues and communicate in a caring and loving manner. Lance's authenticity in addressing hard truths is also commended.
00:51:46 - Recognizing Red Flags
Lori emphasizes the importance of recognizing red flags in toxic faith environments. She encourages listeners to pick up Lance's book, "The Atlas Factor," to gain insight into unhealthy church dynamics and toxic leadership.
00:52:47 - Lance's Empathy and Straightforwardness
Lori appreciates Lance's empathy towards marginalized individuals and his ability to synthesize information. She commends his straightforward yet caring approach in addressing toxic faith environments and interactions with people.
00:55:21 - Self-Care and Encouragement
Lori encourages listeners to engage in self-care and mindfulness after listening to the podcast. She affirms the value and worth of the audience, urging them to take care of themselves as they continue making a difference in the world. -
Have you heard the myths about feminist readings of the Bible? Some common myths include: feminist interpretations of the Bible are anti-male, feminist readings ignore traditional religious teachings, and feminist perspectives on the Bible are not rooted in scholarly research. Our guest, Dr. Julie Faith Parker, will share the truth, dispel these myths, and provide a deeper understanding of the feminist perspectives found in biblical texts.
My special guest is Dr. Julie Faith Parker
Our guest today is Dr. Julie Faith Parker, an accomplished biblical scholar and author of the book "Eve Isn't Evil: Feminist Readings of the Bible to Upend Our Assumptions." With a distinguished background in ancient languages, including Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic, Dr. Parker brings a wealth of expertise to the discussion. Her extensive research focuses on the cultural and linguistic nuances of the biblical world, providing valuable insights into feminist interpretations of biblical texts. As a visiting scholar at Union Theological Seminary and a biblical scholar in residence at Marble Collegiate Church in New York City, Dr. Parker's work has garnered widespread acclaim for its scholarly depth and thought-provoking perspectives. We are honored to have her join us on the show today.
The past is a foreign country. They do things differently there. - Dr. Julie Faith Parker
In this episode, you will be able to:
Explore feminist perspectives in the Bible to uncover hidden narratives and empower your understanding.
Gain insight into the cultural context of biblical times, shedding light on the lives of women in the ancient world.
Discover the significance of understanding original languages to unveil deeper meanings within biblical texts.
Challenge traditional interpretations of the Bible to embrace diverse and inclusive perspectives.
Experience the transformative and empowering nature of the Psalms through a feminist lens.
Discovering the Significance of Original Languages
The episode emphasizes the value of studying the Bible in its original languages. Such study provides valuable insights into the minds of biblical figures and bypasses the influence of interpretive decisions made by translators. By examining the scripture in Hebrew, Greek, Latin, and other languages, listeners can discover new nuances, foster a deeper understanding of the texts, and challenge commonly accepted interpretations.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
To purchase Julie Faith Parker's book Eve Isn't Evil, visit her website at JuliefaithParker.com.
Join the Difference Makers community on Patreon to access exclusive episodes, engage with guests, and participate in polls to shape the future of the podcast. Visit www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference to join for as little as $5 a month.
Engage with Lori and other listeners in the Difference Makers community to access exclusive content and connect with like-minded individuals.
Explore the Difference Makers community on Patreon to access deeper episodes with guests like Julie Faith Parker and gain insights into their perspectives and experiences.
Subscribe to the Difference Makers community on Patreon to access all past and future episodes, providing a wealth of content to explore and enjoy.
Gaining Insight into the Cultural Context
Understanding the cultural context that shaped the Bible's narratives, forms a significant part of the discussions in this episode. The biblical world, markedly different from today's society, had unique vocabularies, concepts, and societal structures that influence how we interpret the text. Grasping these aspects is vital to fully appreciate the texts and uncover hidden meanings obscured by modern perspectives.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the Podcast
00:00:32 - Introducing Betterhelp
00:01:22 - Introducing Dr. Julie Faith Parker
00:03:18 - Understanding the Biblical World
00:08:08 - Importance of Language Study
00:14:08 - Reinterpreting the Psalms
00:16:43 - The Psalms in Latin America
00:18:26 - Teaching in Sing Sing
00:20:58 - Criminals in the Bible
00:27:17 - Feminist Lens on the Scriptures
00:28:22 - Feminist Interpretation of Scriptures
00:29:49 - Unique Filters in Reading Scriptures
00:31:32 - Family Struggles and Labels
00:35:35 - Reinterpretation of Eve
00:40:55 - Consequences of Punishments
00:41:04 - The Divine Mother and Daughter
00:42:22 - The Misinterpretation of Eve
00:44:50 - Feminist Lens on the Book of Job
00:48:26 - Job's Integrity and Feminist Takeaway
00:51:06 - Understanding Eve and Women in Ancient Scriptures
00:54:00 - Introduction to Difference Maker Community
00:54:40 - Exclusive Episodes and Community Benefits
00:55:03 - Call to Action
00:54:00 - Introduction to Difference Maker Community
00:54:40 - Exclusive Episodes and Community Benefits
All of us are different, but some people have labels that are put upon them that you live with because it's your ticket to services. It's how you hopefully can get some help, but that's not easy. - Dr. Julie Faith Parker
Exploring Feminist Perspectives in the Bible
The episode unveils a fresh outlook on biblical narratives by exploring feminist interpretations. By questioning traditional interpretations, particularly those that perpetuate inequality, and shedding light on the strength and resilience of women in the Bible, the episode underscores their crucial role in biblical stories. Such exploration of feminist perspectives can break away from the conventional interpretations, highlighting women's experiences, voices, and roles in the Bible.
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction to the Podcast
Lori introduces the podcast and its focus on making a difference for those who are different. She also highlights the importance of self-care for difference-makers.
00:00:32 - Introducing BetterHelp
Lori talks about the importance of seeking help and introduces Betterhelp.com/difference as the sponsor of the podcast, offering a 10% discount to listeners. She shares her personal experience with therapy and healing.
00:01:22 - Introducing Dr. Julie Faith Parker
Lori introduces Dr. Julie Faith Parker, a biblical scholar and author of "Eve isn't evil feminist readings of the Bible to upend our assumptions." She highlights Dr. Parker's extensive background and research interests.
00:03:18 - Understanding the Biblical World
Dr. Parker discusses the importance of understanding the cultural differences in the biblical world, emphasizing the tribal, age-integrated society and the absence of certain concepts like privacy, individualism, and race.
00:08:08 - Importance of Language Study
Dr. Parker shares her experience studying multiple languages and how it offers insights into the biblical texts. She emphasizes the importance of original languages to better understand cultural nuances and avoid the biases of translators.
00:14:08 - Reinterpreting the Psalms
Julie shares her experience of using the Psalms for spiritual connection during a dangerous encounter in Nicaragua. She highlights the cultural and biblical significance of the Psalms and the sense of worship they provide.
00:16:43 - The Psalms in Latin America
Julie reflects on her experience of singing the Psalms in Spanish during worship in Venezuela. She discusses the influence of liberation theology and the impact of the Psalms on her understanding of different types of liberation.
00:18:26 - Teaching in Sing Sing
Julie talks about her transformative experience teaching at Sing Sing Maximum security prison. She emphasizes the intelligence and capability of the incarcerated individuals and challenges the stigma surrounding people who have been incarcerated.
00:20:58 - Criminals in the Bible
Julie discusses the presence of individuals who committed crimes in the Bible, such as Cain, Moses, David, Jesus, and Paul. She emphasizes the importance of offering second chances and not being quick to judge incarcerated individuals.
00:27:17 - Feminist Lens on the Scriptures
Julie explains her choice of using a feminist lens to interpret the scriptures. She shares her experience of feeling empowered and discovering a different perspective on the story of Eve, challenging traditional interpretations.
00:28:22 - Feminist Interpretation of Scriptures
Julie discusses making the scriptures accessible to all, regardless of biblical education. Feminist interpretation liberated her and she hopes her book will do the same.
00:29:49 - Unique Filters in Reading Scriptures
Julie talks about the uniqueness of individual filters when reading scriptures. She relates it to her work in leadership development and emphasizes the relevance of the scriptures to human experiences.
00:31:32 - Family Struggles and Labels
Julie shares her family struggles, including her son's autism diagnosis and daughter's bipolar disorder. She highlights the importance of erasing the stigma associated with such conditions and finding help.
00:35:35 - Reinterpretation of Eve
Julie discusses her reinterpretation of Eve, emphasizing her curiosity and the blame unfairly placed on her. She delves into the translations and punishments related to Eve's story.
00:40:55 - Consequences of Punishments
Julie explores the consequences of the punishments given to Adam and Eve. She discusses the ideology and patriarchy reflected in the scriptures' portrayal of gender roles.
00:41:04 - The Divine Mother and Daughter
Julie discusses the relationship between Eve and God, highlighting the divine connection between mothers and daughters. She emphasizes that the presence of women together reflects the presence of the divine mother and daughter.
00:42:22 - The Misinterpretation of Eve
Julie delves into the misinterpretation of Eve's actions, pointing out the mistranslation of her words and the bias against her character in the biblical text. She challenges the traditional narrative and provides a feminist perspective on Eve.
00:44:50 - Feminist Lens on the Book of Job
Julie explores the feminist perspective in the book of Job, highlighting the portrayal of women characters and their significance in the narrative. She emphasizes the importance of interpreting the text through a feminist lens to uncover hidden biases.
00:48:26 - Job's Integrity and Feminist Takeaway
Julie discusses Job's refusal to accept blame and his unwavering integrity in the face of adversity. She interprets this as a feminist takeaway, emphasizing the importance of standing up against unfair accusations and holding onto one's truth.
00:51:06 - Understanding Eve and Women in Ancient Scriptures
Julie shares her insights on understanding Eve and women in ancient scriptures, highlighting the importance of reexamining the portrayal of women in religious texts. She encourages a deeper understanding of women's roles and experiences in ancient narratives.
00:54:00 - Introduction to Difference Maker Community
Lori introduces the Difference Maker Community where listeners can engage with guests and participate in polls to impact the podcast content for 2024.
00:54:40 - Exclusive Episodes and Community Benefits
Lori encourages joining the community to access exclusive episodes and interact with guests. Access is available for as little as $5 a month on patreon.com.
00:55:03 - Call to Action
Lori invites listeners to join the community and acknowledges their efforts in making a difference worldwide. She signs off with a reminder to continue making a difference.
00:54:00 - Introduction to Difference Maker Community
Lori introduces the Difference Maker Community where listeners can engage with guests and participate in polls to impact the podcast content for 2024.
00:54:40 - Exclusive Episodes and Community Benefits
Lori encourages joining the community to access exclusive episodes and interact with guests. Access is available for as little as $5 a month on www.patreon.com/difference.
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If you're feeling frustrated and helpless in your efforts to promote cultural and linguistic accuracy in the church, despite taking actions like advocating for diverse representation and using inclusive language, then you are not alone!
Words matter, especially in translations of the Bible. Join us as we dive into the world of New Testament translations with Scott McKnight and uncover the importance of accurate translations and the impact they can have. But when it comes to women in ministry and the use of certain words, will the translation choices make or break their place in the church? Find out in this thought-provoking discussion.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Recognize the value of cultural understanding and meticulous translation in the proper interpretation of the Bible.
Delve into the intricate dynamics of power within the church and their varied consequences.
Learn how to address spiritual abuse effectively and foster a support system for survivors.
Embrace the core principles of good leadership and the altruistic use of power in ministry.
Highlight the vital insights shared by women scholars and survivors for a more inclusive faith community.
My special guest is Dr. Scot McKnight
Meet Dr. Scot McKnight, a renowned New Testament professor at Northern Seminary in Illinois and a prolific author with a passion for diving deep into the cultural context of biblical texts. As a guest on Lori Adams-Brown's podcast, Scot brings his expertise in Bible translation and interpretation, having written over 90 books, including widely-read titles like "A Church Called Tov" and "The Blue Parakeet." A dedicated advocate for abuse survivors and a favorite professor among his students, Dr. McKnight's insights are sure to enrich your understanding of the Bible.
"I believe in the power of a more literal translation."- Dr. Scot McKnight
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Check out Dr. Scott McKnight's new translation of the New Testament, The Second Testament.
Subscribe to Dr. McKnight's newsletter
Consider taking Greek classes with Dr. McKnight.
Purchase Dr. McKnight's books, including A Church Called Tov, The King Jesus Gospel, and The Blue Parakeet.
Follow Dr. McKnight's blog, The Jesus Creed.
Follow him on Twitter: @scotmcknight
Read Dr. McKnight's contributions as general editor of the Dictionary of Paul and His Letters.
Explore the Everyday Bible series, including the First Testament by John Golden Gay and The Kingdom New Testament by Tom Wright.
The Way of Jesus
Good leadership in the church involves recognizing, using, and sharing power in ways that are faithful to the teachings of Jesus. Followers of Jesus should strive to cultivate humility, compassion, and an attitude of serving others, often forgoing one's power to benefit those who are more vulnerable. Dr. Scot McKnight, during the podcast interview, mentioned several examples of power abuse in the church, contrasting them with the biblical teachings of Jesus. He specifically cited Romans 16 and Philippians 2:1-11, which emphasize the concept of Kenosis – the act of laying down one's power to serve others. McKnight believes that understanding this concept and applying it in the context of leadership and church relationships is essential to embodying the way of Jesus and countering the negative aspects of power dynamics in churches.
"Words deeply matter, and those words can wound and they can hurt for a long time." - Dr. Scot McKnight
Women in Ministry
An accurate translation plays a crucial role in recognizing and valuing the contributions of women in the early church. Being mindful of the words used to describe women's roles is crucial as language can shape our understanding and reinforce stereotypes or power dynamics within the church. By translating words and phrases accurately, women's contributions to the early church can be acknowledged and celebrated more fairly. During the conversation, Dr. McKnight emphasized the importance of using accurate translation to highlight women's roles in the church, such as translating the word Phoebe to mean "deacon" rather than "servant." He also mentioned the prevalence of false narratives and power dynamics in church culture that can negatively affect how people perceive women's roles in ministry. By ensuring accurate translations, he believes we can better acknowledge, value, and empower women working in the church.
Keeping Names Authentic
One of the essential aspects of ensuring cultural authenticity in a Bible translation is the use of names as close as possible to what they would have sounded in the original language. This offers a sense of novelty and unfamiliarity for readers, prompting reflection on the context and culture surrounding the text. By preserving the original names, readers can gain deeper insights into the characters and their significance in the narrative. Dr. McKnight uses transliteration in his translation, meaning that names in the Bible are rendered more authentically, closer to their original language. For instance, Yakobos is used instead of the English equivalent, James. Dr. McKnight argued during the podcast that using such authentic names invites readers to reconsider the context and culture of the Bible's characters, creating a more engaging and meaningful reading experience.
"We need to be careful with the words we use for translations, because if we don't get it right, it can hurt people." - Dr. Scot McKnight
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction,
Dr. Scott McKnight is an advocate in the survivor community and a professor at Northern Seminary in Illinois. He has written over 90 books and blogs at The Jesus Creed. He talks about his new translation of the New Testament, the Second Testament, which he made more literal to help people understand the ancient context of the text.
00:06:01 - Reason for New Translation,
McKnight believes that the capacity to translate Greek into English has reached near perfection, but people miss things when they try to make it a natural English equivalent. He wants to show people the differences between the original Greek sentence and the English sentence.
00:11:37 - Distinctives of the Second Testament,
McKnight was inspired to translate the New Testament after reading John Golden Gay's translation of the Old Testament. One of the distinctives is the transliteration of names, which may be confusing but creates an authentic ancient context. McKnight's translation sometimes sounds clunky because it is formally equivalent, but that helps readers slow down and think.
00:14:57 - Keeping Names Authentic,
The Second Testament transliterates names to help readers understand the ancient context. This makes the text feel foreign and distant, which is appropriate, as it helps readers dig deeper into cultural exegesis. McKnight believes that being familiar with the text can be a hindrance to truly understanding it.
00:15:47 - Familiarity with the Text,
Familiarity with the text can sometimes
00:16:13 - The Impact of Names on Reading,
Dr. Scot McKnight discusses the impact of names on reading and how different names can lead readers to think differently and understand a text in a new way. He suggests that using the original Greek text can take readers into the first-century Christian world and help them understand the text in a new light.
00:18:10 - Women in Ministry,
Dr. Scot McKnight discusses the controversy around women pastors, using the example of the lack of pastors in the Bible. He suggests that titles such as Piscopos, Diaconos, and Presbutaros were used instead. He also refers to Romans 16, which mentions several women involved in church ministry, including an apostle and a deacon.
00:22:54 - Multiculturalism in the Early Church,
Dr. Scot McKnight discusses the multicultural and multiracial nature of the early church, with a mix of slaves and free people, men and women, and Jews and Gentiles. He draws attention to the several women mentioned in Romans 16, performing ministries that today would be called pastoring.
00:27:39 - The Importance of Language,
Dr. Scot McKnight emphasizes the importance of language and translation, pointing out that the wrong translation can hurt people. He uses the example of King James' Bible, which made choices to keep its subjects subdued. He also discusses the power dynamics in evangelical churches and how they favor men and certain behaviors that have become manly.
00:33:10 - The Four Types of Power,
Dr. Scot McKnight discusses the four types of power: power over, power to influence, power with, and power for. He explains how power over is the most corrupted form of power and how it is prevalent in the business world, sports, and even the church. He also highlights the importance of using power for the good of others and sharing power with others.
00:35:25 - The Power With,
Dr. McKnight delves deeper into the concept of power with and how it involves the willingness to share power with someone else to achieve a mutually beneficial outcome. He cites his experience of co-authoring a book with a young man and how they worked together to create a cohesive product.
00:36:53 - Power For,
Dr. McKnight discusses the last type of power, power for, which involves using one's power for the good of another person. He cites Jesus Christ as an example of this type of power, as He came not to be served but to serve and give His life for others.
00:40:00 - Dealing with Spiritual Abuse,
Dr. McKnight advises people who are experiencing spiritual abuse or know someone who is to first become healthy enough to handle the blowback that comes with going public. He also stresses the importance of having a support system and following the proper protocols or guidelines for reporting abuse. Lastly, he emphasizes the need for patience and resilience as it may take a long time to see change.
00:50:50 - Abusing Power in Churches,
Dr. Scott McKnight discusses how some pastors and church leaders abuse their power, particularly with vulnerable members such as children. He encourages readers to follow his work in understanding power dynamics and using power for good, especially with survivors of abuse.
00:52:00 - The Way of Jesus,
Dr. Scott McKnight emphasizes the way of Jesus in using power for good and elevating others. He references the Kenosis passage in Philippians 2 and encourages listeners to learn how to understand and wield their power for the benefit of others.
00:53:38 - Call to Action,
Lori Adams-Brown issues a call to action for listeners to use their power for good, particularly with survivors of abuse. She encourages finding a survivor and listening to their story while respecting their autonomy and using power to elevate their voice and support them.
00:54:48 - Tov
Lori Adams-Brown references Dr. Scott McKnight and Laura Behringer's book, A Church Called TOV, and highlights the importance of using power in tov, or goodness, particularly with survivors of abuse. She encourages listeners to find ways to support survivors and let them lead the way in how they want to share their stories and move forward.
00:56:03 - Conclusion,
Lori Adams-Brown thanks listeners for their work in making a difference and encourages them to read Dr. Scot McKnight's book, Second Testament. She also hints at future episodes with Dr. Scot McKnight and his new book with Laura Barringer as a follow up to A Church Called TOV.
Appreciate the role of cultural context and precise translation in interpreting the Bible effectively.
Comprehend the various power dynamics at play within the church and their implications.
Recognize signs of spiritual abuse, ensuring adequate support for survivors.
Grasp the crucial need for responsible leadership and the ethical use of power.
Discover the valuable contributions of female scholars and survivors in the ministry.
Realize the importance of context and accurate translation in unlocking the true meaning of biblical passages.
Uncover diversities in church power dynamics and their impacts on members.
Identify the nature of spiritual abuse and the ways to help survivors heal.
Understand the significance of virtuous leadership and the fair exercise of power for communal benefit.
Shed light on the often-overlooked perspectives of women scholars and abuse survivors in ministry.
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In a world where women's voices are marginalized, join Liz Cooledge Jenkins as she challenges patriarchal structures in evangelicalism and empowers women to reclaim their humanity. But will she be able to make a difference in a system resistant to change? Discover the shocking truth in this gripping journey of faith and advocacy.
In this episode of the A World of Difference podcast, you'll join host Lori Adams-Brown as she chats with guest Liz Cooledge Jenkins about reclaiming women's humanity from evangelicalism. Liz shares her own experiences and insights, drawing from her background as a writer, preacher, and former college campus minister. The conversation explores the impact of patriarchal structures within the church and the importance of speaking out against gender inequality. Liz's book, Nice Churchy Patriarchy, is praised for its compelling title and narrative approach, making it a valuable resource for anyone seeking to challenge patriarchal norms in evangelicalism. Through personal narratives and thought-provoking discussions, this episode empowers individuals to reclaim their humanity and advocate for gender equality in religious communities. So grab your headphones and get ready to dive into this inspiring conversation on A World of Difference.
My special guest is
Liz Coolidge Jenkins is not your typical preacher and writer. With a BS in Symbolic Systems from Stanford and a Master of Divinity, Liz brings a unique blend of intellect and spirituality to her work. She is passionate about challenging patriarchal norms within evangelicalism and advocating for gender equality in religious communities. Through her writing, Liz fearlessly delves into the complex issues surrounding women's rights and roles in the church. Her book, "Nice Churchy Patriarchy: Reclaiming Women's Humanity from Evangelicalism," is a powerful exploration of her own journey and experiences within the evangelical world. With a mix of personal narrative and insightful analysis, Liz offers a fresh perspective on how we can create faith communities that are inclusive, just, and life-giving for everyone. Prepare to be inspired and empowered as Liz Cooledge Jenkins invites you to join her in reclaiming women's humanity and transforming the religious landscape.
Even if progress has been made, there's still work to do. We deserve full equality and we won't settle for anything less. - Liz Cooledge Jenkins
Amplifying Women's Voices
The importance of amplifying women's voices is a primary factor in challenging and shifting age-old patriarchal structures, particularly within evangelical contexts. Women's experiences, insights, and perspectives can bring a fresh understanding and significant contributions to religious and societal discourses. Actively seeking and valuing women's voices is a crucial step towards attaining gender equality and smashing restrictive norms.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Visit www.BetterHelp.com/difference today to receive 10% off your first month of therapy.
Explore the different classes and lessons available on BetterHelp.com, such as trauma, EMDR, and losing a pet.
Sign up for therapy on www.BetterHelp.com/difference, and easily switch therapists if the first one isn't a good fit.
Check out Liz Cooledge Jenkins' new book, Nice Churchy Patriarchy: Reclaiming Women's Humanity from Evangelicalism.
Read Liz Cooledge Jenkins' writings on Patheos at Always Reforming and on her personal blog at lizcooledgejenkins.com
Follow Liz Cooledge Jenkins on Feminism and Religion for her regular contributions. She has a Substack newsletter at: Growing Into Kinship.
Listen to more episodes of the A World of Difference podcast for inspiring stories and interviews with guests who are making a difference.
Consider incorporating more narrative storytelling into your own writing and communication to engage and connect with others.
Reflect on your own experiences with gender and faith and consider how they have shaped your perspective.
Encourage women to define what is best for themselves and to reject patronizing attitudes that limit their potential.
In this episode, you will be able to:
Challenging Patriarchal Power Structures
Patriarchal power structures are deeply ingrained, not only in religious communities but also in broader society. They can perpetuate gender inequality and hinder progress towards a just and inclusive world. Challenging these structures requires courage, collective action, and mindful efforts to uplift marginalized voices, fostering a shift toward equality and fairness.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction and Sponsorship
00:02:00 - Introduction of Liz Cooledge Jenkins
00:05:06 - Writing Style and Personal Narrative
00:07:48 - Dave's Comment on Women in Ministry
00:10:49 - Reflection on College Experience
00:15:20 - Neutrality and its Impact on Women in the Church
00:16:40 - The Threat of Speaking Up
00:18:22 - Marginalizing Voices of Change
00:19:59 - The Importance of Advocacy
00:21:54 - The Impact of the Barbie Movie on Gender Equality
00:30:47 - Rethinking Leadership and Gender
00:33:23 - Navigating Challenges in Evangelical Spaces
00:36:25 - Dealing with Silencing and Marginalization
00:37:58 - Reflecting on Experiences and Finding Empowerment
00:41:24 - Calls to Action for Male Pastors
00:47:14 - The Importance of Women's Perspectives
00:47:57 - Liz's Experience in Seminary
00:48:47 - Book Recommendation: "Nice. Churchy Patriarchy"
00:49:11 - Difference Maker Community and Deeper Conversations
Uncovering hidden stories
Hidden stories are powerful narratives often overlooked or suppressed due to their challenging nature towards established norms. In the context of evangelicalism, these stories often stem from marginalized voices speaking up against patriarchal power structures. These narratives play a crucial role in fostering empathy, broadening perspective, and ultimately empowering individuals who may be experiencing similar struggles.
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction and Sponsorship
Lori introduces the podcast and the sponsor, BetterHelp.com, which offers therapy services. She shares her positive experience with therapy and encourages listeners to take advantage of the 10% off offer.
00:02:00 - Introduction of Liz Cooledge Jenkins
Lori introduces Liz Cooledge Jenkins as a writer, preacher, and former college campus minister. She mentions Liz's educational background and her writing contributions to various publications. Lori also mentions Liz's new book, "Nice Churchy Patriarchy."
00:05:06 - Writing Style and Personal Narrative
Lori discusses how Liz chose to incorporate personal narratives into her book and why she believes stories are powerful. They also touch on the challenge of making academic writing accessible to a broader audience.
00:07:48 - Dave's Comment on Women in Ministry
Liz shares an experience from her college years when a church member named Dave made a patronizing comment about women in ministry. She reflects on how it made her feel and the importance of women defining what is best for themselves.
00:10:49 - Reflection on College Experience
Lori asks Liz how she felt during that jarring experience as a college student and what she would say to her younger self. Liz expresses her shock and the lack of words to respond at the time, but affirms that her feelings were valid.
00:15:20 - Neutrality and its Impact on Women in the Church
The discussion begins with the question of neutrality and its implications. The guest shares her experience in a patriarchal church and how it made it difficult for any change to occur. Speaking up for gender equality was often seen as causing trouble.
00:16:40 - The Threat of Speaking Up
The conversation delves into the fear that speaking up against the system poses for those in power. Drawing parallels to the Civil Rights Movement, the guest emphasizes the importance of raising questions and advocating for change, even if it disrupts the status quo.
00:18:22 - Marginalizing Voices of Change
The guest recounts the experience of a woman in her church who faced labeling and marginalization for pushing for gender equality. Many voices that advocate for change are squashed and silenced. It highlights the significance of those who can speak out about their experiences.
00:19:59 - The Importance of Advocacy
The conversation addresses the misconception that women should be content with their relatively better situation compared to others. The guest emphasizes the need for equality and justice, and how it is essential to dream and work towards a better world for women.
00:21:54 - The Impact of the Barbie Movie on Gender Equality
The guest reflects on the Barbie movie and its impact on addressing patriarchy directly. The powerful speech by America Ferrera's character resonated with many, highlighting the impossible expectations and the need for women to be empowered to be their
00:30:47 - Rethinking Leadership and Gender
The conversation explores the socialization of women and the need to redefine what a leader looks like in terms of gender and style. It emphasizes the importance of considering women's ambitions and assertiveness positively and reexamining assumptions about leadership and gender roles.
00:33:23 - Navigating Challenges in Evangelical Spaces
The discussion delves into the challenges faced by women in evangelical spaces and the difficulty of speaking up for equality. It suggests embracing agency, having conversations about experiences, and being open to the possibility of leaving if necessary to find spaces where women's gifts are valued.
00:36:25 - Dealing with Silencing and Marginalization
The conversation acknowledges the silencing and marginalization experienced by women who advocate for equality. It encourages women to find communities that take them seriously and honor their value. It reassures them that leaving an unsupportive environment is not walking away from faith and that God is present in the journey of change.
00:37:58 - Reflecting on Experiences and Finding Empowerment
Reflection on difficult experiences, even when women are aware that others have it worse, is deemed important. It highlights the value of processing and not being afraid to take seriously the things that feel wrong. Exploring resources from different thinkers and finding empowering expressions of faith is also recommended.
00:41:24 - Calls to Action for Male Pastors
Male pastors are urged to seek feedback from women in their congregations and
00:47:14 - The Importance of Women's Perspectives
The speaker acknowledges that exposure to new communities can sometimes stifle curiosity, especially in faith communities. She highlights the importance of women's perspectives, even those that contradict dominant viewpoints, in order to create a more equitable and wonderful world.
00:47:57 - Liz's Experience in Seminary
The speaker mentions Liz's book and her journey of trying to find her voice as a woman in seminary classes that were not always supportive. She emphasizes the need for women's opinions in churches, classrooms, and society at large.
00:48:47 - Book Recommendation: "Nice. Churchy Patriarchy"
The speaker recommends Liz's book, "Nice. Churchy Patriarchy: Reclaiming Women's Humanity from Evangelicalism," and encourages listeners to read it for themselves. The book delves into issues of patriarchy and the importance of women's perspectives.
00:49:11 - Difference Maker Community and Deeper Conversations
The speaker invites listeners to join the Difference Maker community and announces that Liz will be a part of exclusive conversations there. The community offers additional content and a platform for deeper discussions on the topics addressed in the podcast.
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In the depths of despair, Naghmeh Panahi's story holds an unexpected twist that will leave you breathless. From the war-torn streets of her homeland to the foreign shores of America, she battled not just with oppression, but with her own sense of belonging. But it was when her husband faced imprisonment in Iran that her life took a dramatic turn, revealing a truth so shocking it will make you question everything. Prepare yourself for a journey of resilience, as Naghmeh's story unravels with a heart-wrenching open loop, leaving you eager to discover the strength she found to break free.
My special guest is Naghmeh Panahi
We are thrilled to rerelease this Best of 2023 episode with Naghmeh Panahi on the A World of Difference podcast. Naghmeh's story is one of incredible strength and resilience in the face of abuse. Having experienced domestic violence and spiritual abuse within religious institutions, she has become a beacon of hope for survivors. Her book, "I Didn't Survive: Emerging Whole After Deception, Persecution, and Hidden Abuse," is a testament to her courage and determination. Naghmeh's journey from an immigrant Muslim girl from Iran to an advocate for women and children impacted by domestic abuse is truly inspiring. Through her foundation, Tahir Al Nisa, she is making a profound impact on the lives of those who have experienced similar traumas. We are honored to have Naghmeh share her story and insights on the podcast, as she empowers others to break free from abusive relationships and find their voice. Get ready for an episode filled with empowerment and inspiration.
As we go through the fires of trials, we don't really survive. A lot of our way of thinking or things we didn't see before, like abuse or different things just come to light and our old self doesn't survive and we become a new person. - Naghmeh Panahi
In this episode, you will be able to:
Discover the courage and strength of Naghmeh Panahi as she shares her powerful story of surviving abuse within a religious institution.
Uncover the hidden nature of abuse within religious institutions and gain a deeper understanding of the complexities involved.
Find hope and inspiration as you learn about the healing and recovery process for survivors of abuse within religious institutions.
Gain knowledge and insight into advocating for change and holding religious institutions accountable for their actions.
Empower yourself to break free from abusive relationships within religious institutions and create a life of freedom and authenticity.
Uncover the Hidden Abuse
Abuse takes many forms, and often, the emotional and verbal types remain hidden from sight. In religious institutions, the power dynamics can foster such mistreatment, which goes unnoticed or is deliberately neglected. Understanding the nuanced ways in which abuse can manifest is vital to identifying victims and offering them the necessary support and resources.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Listen to the A World of Difference podcast episode featuring Naghmeh Panahi's inspiring story of survival and redemption.
Purchase Naghmeh Panahi's book, I Didn't Survive: Emerging Whole After Deception, Persecution, and Hidden Abuse, available now. https://naghmehpanahi.com/
Support the Tahir Al Nisa Foundation, co-founded by Naghmeh Panahi, which serves women and children impacted by domestic abuse by visiting their website and donating. https://www.tahriralnisa.org/about/naghmeh-panahi/
Learn more about the immigrant experience and the trauma faced by refugees by attending trauma recovery weekends and workshops led by experts like Naghmeh Panahi's husband.
Explore the Persian culture and attend events like the Iranian New Year Festival to experience the rich traditions and learn about the history.
Get involved in human rights advocacy by supporting organizations like Amnesty International and sending postcards to individuals in jail in Iran.
Reflect on your own identity and the impact of being a third culture kid by exploring resources and joining support groups for individuals who have similar experiences.
Educate yourself on domestic abuse and its impact by reading books and articles, attending workshops, and supporting organizations that provide resources and support for survivors.
Share Naghmeh Panahi's story
Abusive governments or abusive people try to control you think they try to control weak people, but it's actually sometimes it's trying to restrain strong people... women are really strong and that's why the government is so focused on shutting them down. - Naghmeh Panahi
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:02 - Introduction
00:01:38 - Nagmeh's Background and Book
00:05:17 - Writing the Book to Help Others
00:07:06 - Immigrant Experience
00:11:41 - Identity as a Third Culture Kid
00:16:03 - Strength of Iranian Women
00:18:11 - Restriction and Fear in the Middle East
00:19:28 - Strong Women and Resistance to Oppression
00:20:53 - Inspiring Women in the Middle East
00:22:19 - Domestic Violence and Speaking Out
00:31:45 - Naghmeh's Hope for Franklin Graham
00:33:27 - Naghmeh's Thoughts on Franklin Graham
00:34:19 - The Title of Naghmeh's Book
00:38:20 - Naghmeh's Message to Those Experiencing Abuse
00:42:55 - Paying Attention to the Body's Signals
00:47:20 - The Sacrifice of Putting People First
00:47:43 - Finding Naghmeh and Her Work
00:48:21 - Gratitude for the Connection
00:49:06 - Naghmeh's Life as a Butterfly
00:50:43 - Calls to Action Based on Naghmeh's Story
Even when you have a strong force coming against you, whether it's government or it's a religious institution or whatever, you have to really be strengthened even more, be stronger to break through. - Naghmeh Panahi
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:02 - Introduction
The host introduces the podcast episode and provides a trigger warning for the guest's discussion of abuse. Listeners are advised to prioritize their mental health while listening to the episode.
00:01:38 - Nagme's Background and Book
Nagme Panahi is introduced as a remarkable woman who has experienced various forms of abuse. Her book, "I Didn't Survive," details her journey of emerging whole after deception, persecution, and hidden abuse.
00:05:17 - Writing the Book to Help Others
Nagme shares that she wrote her book to help others who may be going through similar trials and to share her story of renewal and transformation through suffering.
00:07:06 - Immigrant Experience
Nagme discusses her experience as an immigrant from Iran, highlighting the challenges of adjusting to a new culture and feeling like she didn't fit in. She also reflects on the trauma of war and the limited resources in her home country.
00:11:41 - Identity as a Third Culture Kid
Nagme shares the difficulties of navigating her identity as a third culture kid, feeling neither fully Iranian nor fully American. She discusses the unique perspective and mindset that come with living between cultures.
00:16:03 - Strength of Iranian Women
The guest discusses the stereotypes and misconceptions about Iranian women, highlighting their strength and resilience. She shares stories of Iranian women breaking barriers and standing up against oppression.
00:18:11 - Restriction and Fear in the Middle East
The conversation shifts to the restrictions faced by women in the Middle East, particularly in Afghanistan. The guest emphasizes that these restrictions are a sign of fear from those in power towards strong women who may bring about change.
00:19:28 - Strong Women and Resistance to Oppression
The guest mentions several strong Iranian women who have stood up to oppressive governments and religious institutions. She highlights the importance of strength and resilience when facing challenges and how these women have become voices for change.
00:20:53 - Inspiring Women in the Middle East
The host shares her experiences meeting incredible women in the Middle East, including Malala, and hearing their stories of education and empowerment. She acknowledges the threat these women pose to those who want to suppress their voices.
00:22:19 - Domestic Violence and Speaking Out
The guest opens up about her experience of domestic violence from her husband, who was seen as a Christian hero. She discusses the challenges of speaking out and the strength she found within herself to set boundaries and break free from the abuse.
00:31:45 - Naghmeh's Hope for Franklin Graham
Naghmeh expresses her desire for Franklin Graham to use his platform to advocate for abuse survivors and bring awareness to the issue within the church. She hopes that he will repent of his harmful views and become an ally in the fight against abuse.
00:33:27 - Naghmeh's Thoughts on Franklin Graham
Naghmeh clarifies that while she doesn't currently like Franklin Graham, she doesn't hate him either. She believes that his way of thinking is harmful and hopes that he will change his perspective and become an advocate for abuse survivors.
00:34:19 - The Title of Naghmeh's Book
Naghmeh explains that the title of her book, "I Didn't Survive," reflects the transformation she went through in breaking free from cultural and religious expectations that silenced and oppressed women. She emerged as a new person with a deeper understanding of who God is and the power she possesses.
00:38:20 - Naghmeh's Message to Those Experiencing Abuse
Naghmeh urges anyone experiencing abuse, whether it's in a marriage, church, or any other institution, to prioritize their own well-being and get out of the toxic environment. She emphasizes that God values individuals more than institutions and encourages victims to trust their bodies and seek help.
00:42:55 - Paying Attention to the Body's Signals
Naghmeh highlights the importance of listening to one's body when it comes to recognizing abuse
00:47:20 - The Sacrifice of Putting People First
Naghmeh discusses the importance of prioritizing people and being willing to make sacrifices for them, even if it means losing everything. She emphasizes the simplicity of this concept while acknowledging the challenges it can present.
00:47:43 - Finding Naghmeh and Her Work
Naghmeh shares that she now has a website where people can find information about her and her work in the Middle East. She also mentions that her name can be searched on social media to access more information.
00:48:21 - Gratitude for the Connection
Lori expresses her gratitude for the opportunity to get to know Naghmeh and establish a friendship. She also acknowledges the vulnerability Naghmeh has shown through her writing and shares her appreciation for it.
00:49:06 - Naghmeh's Life as a Butterfly
Lori reflects on Naghmeh's transformation from a caterpillar to a butterfly, symbolizing her freedom and growth. She encourages listeners to find inspiration in Naghmeh's story and highlights the lessons embedded within her narrative.
00:50:43 - Calls to Action for 2024
Lori acknowledges that a story like Naghmeh's can lead us to want to make changes in our own lives whether it's in New Year's Resolutions, goals or saying "goodbye" to last year's ways and "hello" to this year's new ways.
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Join us as we dive into the hidden world of spiritual abuse within church communities, uncovering shocking revelations and the urgent need for justice. But what happens when the very institutions meant to provide solace and support become complicit in perpetuating harm? Tune in to find out what happens next.
If you're feeling frustrated and helpless because your efforts to stop abuse in your church or faith community are being ignored, then you are not alone! You may have already tried reporting the abuse to church leaders or authorities, only to see it swept under the rug or dismissed. Instead of seeing justice and accountability, you may be witnessing the perpetrators being protected and the victims being silenced. It's time to come together and take action to demand change and ensure that everyone in your community is safe and treated with respect.
My special guest is Johnna Harris
(Listen to part 1 of this two-part interview here.)
Johnna Harris, a dedicated advocate and co-host of the Bodies behind the Bus podcast, brings a wealth of experience and empathy to the conversation around spiritual abuse in church and faith communities. Her unwavering commitment to amplifying the voices of survivors and promoting awareness is truly commendable. With a unique blend of personal insight and professional dedication, Johnna's work is making a real impact in the lives of many. Her passion for fostering healing and understanding shines through in her thoughtful approach to advocacy, making her a valuable voice in the ongoing dialogue about supporting survivors and creating positive change within faith spaces.
We have to be willing to say no person is perfect, and no person is above questioning. And our church leaders, our pastors, these ministry organizations, all of them, we have a rubric for what their integrity and character should look like. That has been thrown into survivor faces over and over and over again in the SBC. It's thrown into women's faces. You cannot be here. You cannot be leading if you are a woman, because it needs to be a man. Here's what it says in the Bible. Yet we're not holding them to those standards. All I'm asking people is to actually be consistent and hold our leaders, hold our churches to the standards that we were told matter to them, that we were told matter to God. - Johnna Harris
In this episode, you will be able to:
Understand how to address Southern Baptist Convention sexual abuse.
Discover survivor stories and advocacy for change.
Embrace the importance of justice and accountability in faith communities.
Take action against spiritual abuse within your church.
Join a Patreon community for difference-makers in promoting justice.
Hear survivor stories
Listening to survivors' narratives is a powerful way of understanding the gravity and reality of spiritual abuse in faith communities. Each story offers a firsthand perspective that illuminates the complexity and nuance of this issue. It is through these narratives that we can become better allies, advocates, and agents of change within our communities.
Listen to Part 1 of this 2 part interview with Johnna Harris. If youu haven't heard part 1, listen to it here.
The resources mentioned in this episode are:
Join the Defund the SBC movement by designating your donations to specific areas in your church and asking for transparency on where the money goes, especially in relation to legal fees and image management efforts.
Send letters, emails, and make phone calls to church leaders and denomination policymakers to advocate for justice and transparency in handling abuse cases.
Follow abuse survivors in the SBC on social media and read their stories to understand the impact and importance of seeking justice for survivors.
Consider making a New Year's resolution to actively do justice, love mercy, and walk humbly with God in your circle of influence, taking tangible steps to make a difference.
Join the Difference Maker community on Patreon to access exclusive episodes and engage in deeper conversations about advocacy and making a difference in various spaces at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference.
Key Takeaways:
Understand the impact of Southern Baptist Convention sexual abuse on individuals and communities.
Hear survivor stories and learn about their advocacy efforts for change.
Recognize the importance of justice and accountability within faith communities.
Take actionable steps to combat spiritual abuse in church settings.
Join a Patreon community for difference-makers in promoting justice and accountability in faith communities.
The key moments in this episode are:
00:00:00 - Introduction to Johnna Harris's advocacy work
00:04:02 - Trigger warning and self-care
00:08:47 - Impact of spiritual abuse on women's voices
00:11:45 - Healing journey and self-care
00:13:10 - Connection between Acts 29 and the SBC
00:15:16 - Sexual Abuse Scandals in the SBC
00:16:01 - Corruption Within the SBC
00:17:48 - Samantha Killary's Lawsuit
00:21:49 - Transparency with Cooperative Program Funds
00:30:42 - Hope for Change
00:33:33 - SBC's involvement in thwarting justice
00:35:23 - The role of good people in complicity
00:37:40 - Holding church leaders accountable
00:41:18 - Making wrongs right
00:43:38 - Taking action for justice
00:49:17 - The Power of Stories and Advocacy
00:49:42 - New Year's Resolution for Justice
00:50:22 - Invitation to Do Justice
00:51:05 - Join the Patreon Community
00:52:40 - Reflecting on the Year and Making a Difference
Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:00 - Introduction to Johnna Harris's advocacy work
Johnna Harris discusses her advocacy work on behalf of Southern Baptist Convention and the Acts 29 network survivors, focusing on survivors of spiritual abuse themselves.
00:04:02 - Trigger warning and self-care
The host provides a trigger warning for the discussion on abuse and emphasizes the importance of self-care for those who have experienced religious trauma.
00:08:47 - Impact of spiritual abuse on women's voices
Johnna and Lori discuss the silencing of women's voices in some religious spaces, sharing their own experiences and the challenges they faced as women in leadership roles.
00:11:45 - Healing journey and self-care
Johnna shares her healing journey, including therapy and avoiding retraumatization in religious settings, highlighting the importance of self-care for survivors of spiritual abuse.
00:13:10 - Connection between Acts 29 and the SBC
The discussion delves into the connection between the Acts 29 network and the Southern Baptist Convention, shedding light on the lack of robust accountability structures within the SBC and its impact on survivors of spiritual abuse.
00:15:16 - Sexual Abuse Scandals in the SBC
Discussion on the handling of sexual abuse within the Southern Baptist Convention (SBC) and the numerous lawsuits and scandals related to survivors coming forward.
00:16:01 - Corruption Within the SBC
The Guidepost report findings of corruption within the SBC in handling and reporting sexual abuse cases, with mention of multiple lawsuits in Kentucky.
00:17:48 - Samantha Killary's Lawsuit
Details about Samantha Killary's lawsuit, the entities involved, and the implication of the SBC's intervention potentially affecting other abuse survivors in Kentucky.
00:21:49 - Impact of Cooperative Program Funds
Highlighting the use of Cooperative Program funds for legal actions and the potential negative impact on abuse survivors if the Supreme Court in KY rules in favor of the SBC's stance.
00:30:42 - Hope for Change
Discussion on the challenges of bringing about accountability and change within the SBC and other western evangelical entities, expressing a desire for positive growth within churches.
00:33:33 - SBC's involvement in thwarting justice
Johnna discusses the potential impact of the Southern Baptist Convention's (SBC) amicus brief on the statute of limitations for second-party perpetrators. She highlights the potential consequences for survivors seeking justice and the disturbing reality of justice being thwarted by powerful entities.
00:35:23 - The role of good people in complicity
Johnna emphasizes the complicity of good people in allowing injustice to persist. She urges listeners to educate themselves and take action to hold leaders and organizations accountable for their actions, particularly in cases of abuse and cover-ups.
00:37:40 - Holding church leaders accountable
The conversation delves into the need for consistency in holding church leaders accountable to the standards they espouse. Johnna urges people to consider where their tithes and donations are directed, emphasizing the importance of transparency and responsible stewardship of financial contributions.
00:41:18 - Making wrongs right
The discussion emphasizes the importance of making wrongs right and pursuing justice, rather than succumbing to "himpathy." It calls for a collective effort to address spiritual abuse and hold leaders accountable for their actions, advocating for defunding the SBC as a potentially necessary course of action.
00:43:38 - Taking action for justice
Johnna encourages listeners to take action in various ways, including defunding the SBC legal efforts by designating offerings, seeking transparency in financial contributions, and advocating for abuse survivors. The conversation underscores the need for accountability and highlights the role of individuals
00:49:17 - The Power of Stories and Advocacy
Lori and Johnna emphasize the importance of hearing abuse survivors' stories in the SBC to understand the significance of advocating for justice. They encourage listeners to actively engage in advocacy efforts and share their ideas in a Patreon episode at www.patreon.com/aworldofdifference.
00:49:42 - New Year's Resolution for Justice
Lori encourages listeners to make New Year's resolutions focused on doing justice, loving mercy, and walking humbly with God. She emphasizes the importance of actively participating in advocacy efforts within their circle of influence.
00:50:22 - Invitation to Do Justice
Lori invites followers of God to consider how they can do justice within their denominational and church homes. She encourages listeners to join their Patreon community for deeper discussions on advocacy and making a difference.
00:51:05 - Join the Patreon Community
Lori invites listeners to join their Patreon community, where they can access exclusive episodes and engage in conversations about making a difference in their respective spaces. She welcomes individuals from diverse religious backgrounds to share their perspectives.
00:52:40 - Reflecting on the Year and Making a Difference
Lori encourages listeners to reflect on the past year and consider what they want to stop, start, or continue doing. She invites them to connect with her on social media to share their reflections and discuss their plans for making a difference.
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